The Brexit Arms (temporary till the licensee get here)

[BoredofBrexit]

Noise enforcement squad!
Where's the landlady? Surfer?
We've been advised of a a lock in and it's reported that the jukebox has been stuck playing Pulp - Common People - all night.

Trump may think he has 'won' Scotland but I'm afraid Scotland certainly thinks other wise!

I think it's sad for America that the POTUS is a pussy grabbing racist with questionable morals related to his personal finances. I also am worried about the sense of white priveledge that will likely flourish from this vote.

But I also think many of his promises will go the way of the Brexit ones. He said what he needed to say to get the popular vote. I wouldn't be surprised if his tenure is not as dramatic as everyone is worrying.

I am concerned about women's liberties esp Roe vs Wade. With republicans taking both senate and congress I think women and minority rights are in for a tough few years

I think he can do a fair bit of damage to our climate / environment too. Did Trump votes worry about climate change much?

I would struggle ever to vote Republican if I were American (I have a DD who is) purely because of abortion rights and gun control. However Trump is far better on these issues than the mainstream Republican party and any of its preferred candidates. In fact pre election cycle he was widely regarded as pro choice and was forced to tow the party line and row back his more moderate position to secure the nomination. The Democrats have been woefully ineffectual on gun control. The extent to which they court the Latino vote means they may not be that trustworthy on abortion rights and they have certainly done very little to address restrictions on support for charities promoting safe sex.

Trump voters are more likely to disbelieve it (along with Trump). It is a worry.

I have to have faith though. The US has had dodgy (understatement) presidents before and we've got through it

Howabout you are right about Trump's personal stance on abortion, he said what he had to to get the vote.

However I worry about the rest of congress. He will be under pressure.

In more Brexit related news I think the Trump effect will continue to strengthen the pound against the dollar and the Euro and limit the downsides of devaluation overshoot. In the market for Euros between now and Christmas and I'm a glass half full sort of gal

I think it's quite telling that sterling fell off a cliff when we voted Leave and it's only that plus the BOE stimulus that held the markets up, yet today the dollar and US markets have barely moved and they've voted for a complete loon to be president.

Says a lot about how bad Brexit is perceived to be doesn't it?

Caprianna
Of course he's one of the 'elite' - most politicians are! ( not that he is a politician ) but you're thinking 'elite' in terms of wealth, that's not what I'm talking about, I'm talking about the politicians who ignore anyone who they think are unworthy ( usually lefties who think anyone who votes UKIP are ignorant racists )

ok so basically he doesn't call racists racists and sexists sexists because he is one himself.

Yes, mangomoon, the usa took the sensible precaution of writing down their constitution whereas ours is cobbled together from various bits and bobs and has to be thrashed out by judges.

There has been an element of hyperbole about our constitution requiring the brexit vote to be subject to parliamentary scrutiny.

Was just wondering if the same level of horror applied when someone else's constitution caused the will of the people to be overruled.

But of course, everyone knew beforehand how the system worked. .. just like everyone knew our referendum was advisory?

Actually, I was way overthinking that...
The government could quite legally and constitutionally say, 'Look guys, we know you were keen on this Brexit idea, but we've looked into it, we've chatted to India, and frankly the whole thing is going to be a massive ball-ache that leaves us up shit creek. So we've decided to bin it, OK?

But apparently that would cause Civil Unrest The Likes Of Which Has Never Been Seen.

Entirely in line with our constitution, the law, and Parliament's intentions in passing the Referendum Bill, though.

Although TBF it remains to be seen how much the Americans are going to kick off over their denial of the popular choice.

The vote for Trump wasn't really for Trump per se, but a vote for change & a vote against the status quo

I think people are desperate I heard today some peoples wages have been stagnating for 1, 2 decades . They are desperate.

because an awful lot of people are willing to make these blind leaps thinking they're proving a point when the reality is it is going to bite them on the arse in one way or another because what they actually want wasn't on offer as I said ^ they are desperate. They have no choice.
They have to make a leap in the dark, they very fact they have - does that not make you think? Why are politicians failing to reach out to these people? If you want to blame anyone for Brexit - lay the blame at the door of Tony Blairs Labour Party, nicely followed by Brown.
You can blame all the external conditions you want - but they are politicians who have failed to do anything for these people.

I'm always drawn back because some of the comments made during the mutal congratulations really should go unchecked

Who are you to check people?

Ok, 'unchecked' wasn't the best word- more like unchallenged.

Yes I agree that there is a major problem when people feel they need to make these leaps of faith but voting they way they did/ do is probably going to make things worse for them because these elections/ referendums aren't the answers they're looking for.

I have not seen any substantial challenging though, just an outright dismissal, casual brush off of anything anyone has said.

I find it astonishing condescending to tell people whats good or not for them and I wonder if people who hold these views have ever been in very precarious situations in their lives? If they know what its like to be desperate?

What is the answer?

I don't know surfer but Brexit isn't it.

winter I'm not sure what threads you've been reading but the general trend is that Leavers make claims that get dismissed because they're incorrect/ misinformed etc.

They're not dismissed out of hand- it's just they don't stand up to challenge.

"While this is not the outcome I hoped for, it is the verdict of the American people and we must respect it."

Haha!
Oh! The irony!

That quote was from Nicola Sturgeon...

Have you seen this study posted by red on the other link? The main concern for both Brexit/Trump voters was immigration, while for Remain/Clinton voters the main concern was inequality/poverty. It's shockingly clear, scroll down the page and you'll see the two bar charts. The whole article is fascinatin

blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/trump-and-brexit-why-its-again-not-the-economy-stupid/
Here it is!

That was interesting, good post but if it's just 'immigration' why? Why do so many voters feel immigration is a problem? I know my vote wasn't based on immigration I've explained it many times and clearly with Trump gaining 30% of the Hispanic vote the U.S. election that vote wasn't just immigration either.

Interesting article - I'm not surprised to see that the similarities are so striking tbh.

I will say though, that I would have answered 'considerate' rather than 'well behaved' to the child question, yet voted Leave - so I don't fit with that bit.

By the way, just for the record - although I can see why Trump was voted in, and will no doubt be arguing that side of things - can I just make something clear:

On a personal note, I think he is an odious man. I cannot stand him and disagree with almost everything he says/does.

Haven't had a chance to read Reds link yet but will do now.

But it's obvious Trump won because he's anti Muslim.

Mango the NS quote you selected is a bit out of context.

stv.tv/news/politics/1372436-scotland-reacts-to-donald-trump-s-us-election-victory/

RD's remarks very much mirrored NS as did WRs. KD and PH lost quite a lot of points from me yesterday with their lack of nuance and political naivety.

surfer there was an interesting interview with Muslims for Trump on the bbc at about 4 am election night. They don't see him as anti-Muslim and they are at least as anti terrorist Muslim (or non-Muslim) as he is.

I do think Trump tapped into Islamophobia and fear of the unknown in the US - they are far far less multicultural and more insular than the UK. However I thought the way the Clinton campaign used the dead US soldier's family in their campaign was extremely distasteful fear. They could instead have taken the higher path and celebrated the positive contribution of him and other Muslims in the US. They did not do this because Clinton's supporters largely share the same prejudices as Trump's.