Westminstenders Contines. Boris outmaneovered everyone?! Now War and Peace?

[RedToothBrush]

THE BREXIT FALLOUT CONTINUES - THREAD TEN

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This set of threads started out asking if Boris had been outmanoeuvred by Cameron handing him a poison chalice. Fate made it seem as if Boris lost the battle but May has confounded everyone and handed him a second chance. Or so it might seem.

May now has a new Cabinet after a sweeping cull of Cameron's lot. It is more right wing than in a generation. A number of appointments have raised eyebrows. There are plenty of poison chalices and plenty of Brexiteers. Will this create peace in the Tory ranks? Or is it just the calm before the storm

Labour are tearing themselves apart what now seems to be all out civil war. Talk of gerrymandering, violence, disenfranchisement, deselection and intimidation are rife. The seems to be no end in sight, and no prospect of a solution apparent. The question perhaps seems to be when and how, rather than if the party will split, and who will retain the name and party funds.

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So the sad face of British politics in the last two days can be summed up in a single image. Boris and a brick.

Depressed?

I think we have a while to go yet before we hit the bottom.

Excuse me with the intros as I'm starting to struggle to keep up with things myself

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2684990-The-Westminster-Hunger-Games-Contines-May-Day-May-Day Previous Thread Nine

TM redefined 'austerity' as 'living within our means'. Why does that remind me of Thatcher?

Yes, and why does it scare me so much? It's not going to have a 'name' anymore, it's just going to 'be'.

We all remember Thatcher's Britain right? From the age of 9, I grew up in it.

We don't need to remember.

George Osborne put us in a time machine in 2010.

The Windscale solution: rename a problem, it magically stops being radioactive
“He calls it austerity, I call it living within our means.”

So does that mean the same principles of austerity will apply, they'll just be calling it something else? That way they can say they are no longer doing the "austerity thing" but still actually be doing it?

It may well mean that the old austerity is becoming the new "normal".

Also, living within one means for a vicar's daughter may mean something really quite parsimonious.

Something like that, Ginger.

Thing is, I despised Osborne. But for 5yrs, he was chancellor in a govt without a commons majority, and his actions were diluted by the coalition with the libs - and David Cameron was no Thatcher.

Now we have Thatcher reincarnated as PM, with a full govt mandate, a (slim-ish) majority. May is more right wing than Cameron. Shit, I'm going to miss Cameron, aren't I?

And we still have no opposition.

So 183,000 people joined the Labour Party in the last 2 days so they can vote. That's a lot!
Three thoughts:

1. They now have a huge membership overall - more than ever before, more than any other party? (I don't know the exact figures.) So by rights Labour should be an unstoppable force in the country. But they're not.
2. Do these members include anyone in Scotland?
3. That's nearly five million pounds income in 3 days. Wonder what they'll do with it?

Diane Abbot on R4 Today, now.

She is saying that one of the problems for JC during PMQs is lack of parliamentary support by his own MPs.

Theresa May has a massive cheer as she enters the HOC, and cheers along with her answers - JC gets no cheer from his own, and silence during his questions.

Why are they not at least giving him a show of support in the commons? I can't see Owen beating him, either.

£5 million should go some way to paying off the Referendum debts.

I wonder just where the new members live? If it's London and the South East, it's just going to be more of the same. If it's the other areas which have been badly hit by austerity, and they are people seeking to rebuild the party, then there may be hope.

Why are they not at least giving him a show of support in the commons?
They don't support him. They're worried about losing their seats. Cowards.

Our whole democracy depends on MP's caring about losing their seats.

Safe seats are an anathema to a parliament that represents its electorate.

You can't lead a party that doesn't support you.

So what now? It looks like he'll win. Then years of unelectable wilderness like the 80s and early 90s because of a divided opposition. Defections to other parties? The formation of a new party of moderate Socialists? Whichever, it means weak opposition during the straitened Brexit times, and no effective champion for working people.

It's a disaster, Hester.

The left has sold working people out.

I have no idea what the way forward is, but this puritanical, sexist, posturing macho politics is definitely not it.

She is saying that one of the problems for JC during PMQs is lack of parliamentary support by his own MPs.

So she finally figured out that it's kind of difficult to be an effective leader of opposition when your party's MPs don't support you? Good.

Have you seen this? Don't know what will come of it but I think I am ready to sign up.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/19/liberals-celebrities-and-eu-supporters-set-up-progressive-movement?CMP=sharebtnn_tw

If any Labour MP doesn't support JC then I'd prefer them not to pretend to support him in the House in general. However, if he makes a comment they support then I'd expect them to voice that support even if they're not keen on the leader.

Laudable aims:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36852222
I can take seriously just about anything JC says here, except 'future Labour government'.
Hollow laugh.
Something seismic needs to happen. Yes Kaija, it's an appealing and interesting idea. Not quite sure how it works, but maybe we do need something completely different.

Yes, nauticant.

The logic of the new democracy seems to be that if an MP doesn't support the (dear) leader, they should resign from the party.

Hester I'm a Labour Party member in Scotland - there is a few of us, honest.

I feel thoroughly disheartened by the way the Labour Party is going. I'm not inspired to vote for JC or OS (although I will vote for one of them). I think JC is going to get voted back in and then there'll be no getting rid of him, and then the left will be in the wilderness for years while the far right gains ground.

and we still have no opposition - that's actually the only reason why I think it is ok for TM to comment on the state of the Labour Party in PMQs - they aren't just Labour, they are the Opposition, they get public funds for being the Opposition, and they have a job to do besides going to shouty rallies, being sexist and calling everyone who doesn't worship their icon 'Blairite scum'.

It is a cheap shot, but sadly at the moment it is a valid one.

Labour have now got more members than all the other parties put together, I think, and have raised themselves an awful lot of money. But even if they've got half a million members by the time the unions are added in, it is still tiny compared to the whole electorate.

It's horrible to watch the Labour party tearing themselves apart like this.

I agree Doin, the left has sold working people out. I'm fed up with the infantile posturing, student level politics and sexism. The Labour Party seems determined to hobble itself.

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-john-kerry-boris-johnson-us-uk-trade-deal-eu-referendum-a7146406.html Democrat America tells UK that Brexit talks must be completed before a US deal can be talked about. Bad news.

www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/21/donald-trump-america-automatically-nato-allies-under-attack?CMP=twt_gu Meanwhile Republican America is saying that there may be no NATO in the future, as they put America First (Though in contrast to this Trump has always been very pro-Uk and there are a lot of UK conservatives and kippers over at the Republican conference, so I do think the special relationship is regarded as different.)

www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/al-baldasaro-donald-trump-hillary-clinton_us_578fa150e4b07c722ebd2fd1?
Indeed, one of Mr Trump's advisors thinks Clinton should be put in front of a firing squad for US foreign policy.

Possibly even worse news.

So what happens in the US election really makes a difference - we are looking at two VERY different visions of the future and how that might affect a Brexit Britain.

Johnson is actually in the US with Defence Secretary Fallon to discuss the ISIS campaign.

www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/21/brexit-untangling-uk-industry-europe-german-manufacturing-single-market-bavaria?CMP=twt_gu
Untangling UK industry from Germany may be impossible. Good news - sounds like trade will continue regardless of trade barriers

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36841066
Merkel and May seem to have got off to a good start:
The German chancellor said the two countries had "similar convictions and values" and she was determined to proceed in the "spirit of unity and friendship" that characterised Anglo-German relations.

BBC political editor Laura Kuenssberg said it was hard to believe that it was the first time that the two women had properly met as they seemed immediately at ease in each other's company and determined to build a personal relationship based on mutual trust.

May even gave Merkel a birthday present.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/20/angela-merkel-backs-theresa-mays-plan-not-to-trigger-brexit-this-year?CMP=twt_gu
Merkel backs us not triggering Brexit this year.

Even more Good News

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/labour-mps-tory-sleeper-agents-jeremy-corbyn-rally-told-as-leadership-campaign-begins_uk_578fe079e4b05c99a708e364?hpp3c8fr&
Labour rally says that PLP are Tory Sleeper Agents. Crackers News.

180,000 people joined up as Labour supporters in the 48 hours before the deadline. That's more than the entire Tory party membership. A crowdfunding campaign to raise £25 for people who wanted to join, was closed down for breeching party rules.

Corbyn launches his campaign at 10am.

Gisela Stuart is apparently 'seriously thinking' about not voting in Labour leadership. Which begs the question - would she defect, and of course if she did, who too?

www.independent.co.uk/voices/labour-jeremy-corbyn-owen-smith-angela-eagle-leadership-contenst-another-mediocre-man-a7146956.html
The Independent are running a story calling Owen another Mediocre Man

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/07/diane-abbott-sticks-knife-owen-smith/
And Diane Abbott also sticks the boot in. Predictable news.

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-commercial-london-property-prices-rics-office-real-estate-eu-referendum-a7147706.html
London Commercial property at the start of a downturn

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jul/20/brexit-farm-labour-shortages-fruit-vegetable-harvests-national-farmers-union
Farmers are panicking about the possibility of a lack of seasonal workers for harvest and are looking to have assurances that there will be special visas to allow migrant workers for this. Typical news

www.buzzfeed.com/patricksmith/things-that-have-happened-to-the-uk-economy-since-the-ref?bftwuk&utm_term=.hgQ5jgLaW#.ywodOR97q
Buzzfeed has an article summarising 13 things that have happened to the economy since Brexit. Generally more bad news.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36853577
EasyJet hit hard by Brexit. Bad news but also a bit of good news.

The ECB has its first meeting since Brexit, which might be of interest.

www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/40000-lodge-complaint-with-police-accusing-farage-and-leaveeu-campaign-of-inciting-racial-and-religious-hatred/ar-BBuzPdG?ocid=spartandhp
40000 people make a complaint to police about Farage and Leave.eu inciting racial and religious hate. Hurrah Good news

europe.newsweek.com/trump-farage-muslim-ban-republican-national-convention-482542
Maybe that also explains why Farage is in the US to support Trump, and then is off round Europe to stir up more trouble, rather than be charged here... Oh and he admits that Trump makes even him wince. Scary news.

Phew. If all that isn't enough for about a week, May is off to see Hollande in France today...

Wow Red thanks for the media roundup.

Tremendous respect to both Eagle and Smith in standing against Corbyn, and Eagle in stepping aside. However Owen still doesn't stand much chance - I can't imagine the 180 000 people who've just signed up intend to vote for him. I predict Corbyn will be re-elected, May will call a snap election to take advantage of Labour disarray, and she will win it in a 1983 style landslide. It is Thatcher and Foot all over again except Foot had more brains (but still as out of touch)