The Westministenders Hunger Games continues. Boris still trying not to be outmanoevered.

[RedToothBrush]

Clearly Boris didn't get the memo, on when to quit the power games, even after Gove schooled him in the dark arts of the Tory Leadership....

So the Tory Smackdown rolls on whilst Corbyn STILL clings on. UKIP has now entered the race to make a challenge for who can make the biggest leadership contest shambles.

In The Blue Corner
May strikes fear into the hearts of EU citizens as she counts her bargaining chips.
Gove strikes fear into the hearts of humans, with his Martian twitch.
Loathsom strikes fear in the hearts of Britains by talking about babies brains.
Crabb strikes fear into the hearts of Torys by suggesting a plan that Corbyn might like. (and that beard doesn't help).
And Fox.
Well he just turned up.

Johnson is still waiting in the wings to stab Gove. He'd quite fancy a seat at the cabinet table too.
Osborne has gone quite again and we wait with baited breathe to see if he is the 'Charlie off Casualty' of the Tory Party (y'know whatever happens he somehow survives like a cockroach).

In The Red Corner
Corbyn apologies. So we know he's getting a bit desperate.
Will the Unions figure out something else to do other than sit with their head in hands.
Angela Eagle is still doing jellyfish impressions and hasn't found that backbone.
We STILL don't know who the fuck Owen Smith is?
Will Bliar's chicken's finally come home to roost?
The Cult of Momentum, rumbles on. We aren't quite sure who they actually vote for, but they seem to like their Dear Leader.
When will this country next have an opposition party?

Its kinda getting boring guys, we need some action now. End the Chicken Coup! The Tories are definitely out doing in the high drama stakes.

In the Purple Corner
Farage has gone! Hurrah. We hope only that he stays under that rock.
(Don't count on it. They'll wheel him out when they need publicity)
Will Leadsom be elected leader? Oh sorry, wrong party. I was getting confused for a second there.
Will they throw the cuckoo Carswell out? [:)]
Will they be able to find a less offensive leader than Farage who can unite them in their common goal of errrr..... yeah. That.
How long before one of their candidates has to apologise for something?

And I suppose I should ask, when will a50 be triggered....? And by whom?

All these questions and more.
Sense of humour compulsory. No experience necessary though

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2670552-Has-Boris-been-outmanoeuvred?pg=1 Previous thread 1

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2672388-Has-Boris-been-outmanoevered-Will-someone-please-tell-me-who-is-in-charge Previous thread 2

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/a2673982-Have-Boris-and-Jeremy-been-stabbed-in-the-back-Please-can-we-have-some-leaders Previous thread 3

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2675432-Boris-outmaneovered-Et-tu-Gove-Corbyn-The-Westministenders-Hunger-Games-Continues? Previous thread 4

Chilcot's next job.

alas, that is, I feel, as unlikely as it is necessary. I'm seeing no signs of it happening at the moment, and I cannot think of anything more necessary.

:(

Is it?

Oh dear. I actually thought maybe things were imoroving on that score.

I thought, if nothing else, Brexit had brought our relationships with the rest of the world into sharp relief.

:(

LOL @ Chilcot's new job

Going back to how dangerous Loathsom is because she knows better than experts, here she is on Newsight giving Nobel prize winner Paul Krugman a lesson in economics. Phew, glad she was there!

Action film mentioned in Chilcot report
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Ross Hawkins @rosschawkins
Mind boggling Chilcot detail - intel may have been made up after someone watched Nicolas Cage film
5:25 PM - 6 Jul 2016

Red and SwedishEdith and thanks for the jokes.

Doin No - I think there really needs to be a mass out-reach of informing people. How many of the people who voted 'Leave' do you think are following all of this? (Or those who voted 'Remain'?) They do need to be reached. Somehow.

on 'The Rock':
"The new source from September had described "spherical containers" filled with chemical warfare agents. MI6 in April acknowledged it had not been able to "verify fully" the details, but said it had "no reason to dismiss the bulk of this material".
However, MI6 also drew attention to the fact the source's description of the device and its spherical glass contents was "remarkably similar to the fictional chemical weapon portrayed in the film The Rock".
It even acknowledged that the similarity had been pointed out by one recipient when a report from the agent had been circulated.
In June 2003, MI6 finally met the agent. He had been involved in Iraq's chemical weapons pre-1991 and had been involved in destruction activities. He denied providing any of the material attributed to him. MI6 "concluded that its source was a fabricator who had lied from the outset".
In July 2003, the reports were officially withdrawn. "The withdrawal of the reporting was done in a very low key manner compared with the way in which the original intelligence was issued," the inquiry notes."

LOL Swedish

They had to put too neolibs up against Krigman on his own and they still xame off looking like a pair of ignorant twats with an agenda.

Which is the reality.

I think there really needs to be a mass out-reach of informing people.

I had a conversation about the referendum/Tory leadership with the woman on the checkout in the supermarket today. She's a nice lady, roughly my age, I see her quite often, we always talk. She asked me what the Home Secretary did, because she didn't know, and when they talk about it in the papers or on the news, they always assume people know the basics.

And she had a point, because we never learned anything about our political system or how the government works in school. Maybe they do now in citizenship, but I've seen no evidence of it in my kids, what they know they get from me and from watching the news. I learned a lot in History classes, but that was in 6th form, and was because we were specifically studying English/British political history.

Although, I will admit, while I understand how our government and political system works, economics and economic theory is beyond me. It seems to be a constant stream of best guesses, with no definite answer ever, and if you predict something wrong, it's never your fault, it is always because something unexpected happened.

I wish I understood it better, but I just don't.

TheBathroomSink the first thing you'll learn in economics is to use the word "assume" all the time as their are so many variables that even experts frequently get things wrong!

I just watched Leadsom 'challenging' Paul Krugman. Thanks for that link, SwedishEdith.

Her lack of grasp of how large, complex economies work is embarrassing and scary.

TheBathroomSink I'm no expert, but I know a lot more about economics than I do about politics.... and, yes, you are broadly correct! There are various economic models and theories, but none of them have come close to accurate predictions of the future. There are just too many variables.

I see TeamGove are at it again then. Apparently Michael doesn't mind taking a thrashing for the next two months in the party and nation's interest.

That reminds me of the old Economists joke.

A physicist, a chemist, and an economist were stranded on a desert island with no implements and a tin of beans.The physicist and the chemist each come up with a scientific method for opening the tin. The economist says 'Let us assume we have a tin opener"!

Tory Smackdown update:
Declared votes. May 159, Leadsom 47, Gove 27. (total 223)

The last tally before the count was:
Theresa May - 141
Andrea Leadsom - 43
Michael Gove - 27
Stephen Crabb - 24
Liam Fox - 9
(Total 244)

I make 10 of Crabb's lot have gone for May so far, with two (both leavers) have gone for Leadsom.
Out of Fox's lot, two have gone for May (both leavers) and one for Leadsom.

(I know the figures don't match up - I think the declare tallies are from different sources hence they are slightly out from each other, but you should get the idea)

There are still over 100 who are undeclared though and who knows who might do some Govian shenanigans.

Her lack of grasp of how large, complex economies work is embarrassing and scary.

And widely shared amongt the right wing establishment, including our awful Chancellor.

Anyway, Krugman correctly points out that neither of them is being honest about believing national economics to be the same as home economics.

It's just an excuse for slashing the size of the state. They are political, not economic arguments.

It's been going on at least since Thatcher.

Paul McNamara ‏@PGMcNamara · 1m1 minute ago
Full media strategy for war in #Iraq from 2002 - a YEAR BEFORE. Including a "list of 10 facts" for The Sun #Chilcot

tweeted with a photo of a highlighted line from the Chilcot report.

Channel 4's coverage of Chilcot is good.

Andy Burnham
We did it! Commons votes by 245-2 to secure status of EU nationals in the UK. Govt can't now retreat on this. Thanks to everyone who helped.

(trouble is, its a non-binding vote)

Every time I venture off this thread, I'm grateful for it. There are still threads where people are battling out the referendum itself, while Remain voters are castigating Leave voters for being thick and racist. Honestly, how many times can they have the same bloody argument?!?

I am curious how long before the EU starts creating some real noise about us actually triggering A50. I would think if we don't do it by 1 January 2017, they will start putting the pressure on.

Good for him - sends a message

Private eye is well worth a look today. They go after loathsome and Sarah vain in particular.

I did enjoy the "turkeys vote for Christmas in referendum cliffhanger" said one turkey 'I'm happy to put my neck on the line if it means that we can take control of our own destiny.'

TORY WAR GAMES!
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/06/michael-gove-ally-urges-theresa-may-supporters-to-back-him-and-k/

Gove ally trying to get May supporters to take him through to round two over Leadsom.
Leave.eu getting kippers to pressure Conservatives to back Loathsom.

(So the Torygraph is Team May then)

Also Lady Macbeth fury over Vine slur. " lady Macbeth was said to be furious at attempts to compare her responsible political strategy over the Scottish throne with what she called Sarah Vile's 'vaulting ambition'.