Genuine q, what does the UK gain from this?

[dragonsarebest]

I voted Remain, but we lost and I want to be optimistic, so I'd genuinely like to know what benefits we can look forward to following Brexit. I'm really not interested in arguing, point-scoring or vague "taking control" statements, but I would like to understand what the positives will/could be for my family and me once the UK is officially out? Thanks.

Snowbells sorry, that'll teach me to read the whole thread ;) (difficult on these fast moving ones). Yes, I agree educated people on the continent invariably have at least one foreign language to a good standard and often two. My daughter is in a state school in France where she is taught for 9-10 hours a week (three subjects) entirely in Spanish. Language teaching is quite good here.

My UK employer requires applicants go the graduate scheme to be bilingual (English plus French, German or Dutch). Obviously this massively favours EU applicants, because in the UK specialisation occurs early and as a result, too few scientists and engineers have language skills.

I can't see what the benefits would be.

I hope the disaffected voters aren't too badly damaged in the inevitable fall out.

So, positives. Well, basically I think it's a disaster, but it's a disaster that happened many years ago, slowly, not just now.

I think that economically it'll be a disaster, because confidence is inevitably, unavoidably, dented by uncertainty. And we just can't be certain what's going to happen. Even once we trigger Article 50, we've got 2 years of it. So the economy is going to take a huge hit.

Politically, I am more hopeful. 'Leave' and 'Remain' were both cross-party movements, and their very incoherence gives me hope that we might, just might, see some proper political revival/reawakening/reshuffling of a political status quo that hasn't worked, for so many people, for so long.

I hope that:

• we have another General Election very soon indeed
• that we also have another referendum soon - NOT on Europe, but on electoral reform. I LOATHE what UKIP stands for, but it is wrong, just wrong, that they won SO many votes last time and have just a single MP. It makes a mockery of our political system, and can only feed alienation. So some form of PR, perhaps on the lines we have for the London Assembly (half constituency members, half PR) would work
• that the Conservatives split
• that Labour also reforms/reshapes/reworks itself
• that UKIP also reforms, probably into a far-right party, which will (again, I have to hope) wither in the way Nick Griffin's party did.

Essentially, I think we need a new political approach to justice, to inequality, to housing, transport, trade.

I am bitterly disappointed that Remain didn't win. BUT, our political settlement just hasn't worked, for far too many, for far far too long. Changing that is what we need to work towards.

Dacre I don't disagree with anything you say (except I have always been pro-EU), insults have been hurled from both sides, but I still don't see how leaving the EU will tangibly help any of the people in those films. I've just watched the tale of two Kensingtons and it struck me that both voted remain.

Well we could rehash the economic and legislative arguments again but essentially if you're a Remainer and I'm not, we won't agree. It's so much about individuals and how the read things. I think we can reposition ourselves globally and ultimately be much freer to steer our own course, and that the pain will be short-term and worth it. Remainers scoff at that.

But maybe if we also view the result as an enormous howl of protest from the bottom 3 or 4 deciles by income, our response to that WILL BE our biggest gain in the end? Or part of it?

watched the films Darce - nothing new being said there, that hasn't been covered before. I understand there are massive social issues - people have been wrong to project that onto EU IMO.

Anyway there are 10000000's of threads on MN to argue about all that.

This thread is about identifying actual positives of Brexit - what are yours?

I understand there are massive social issues - people have been wrong to project that onto EU IMO.

I think it's clear that in deprived areas, many people are drawing a direct connection between freedom of movement and their own difficulties.

Which means that probably it is that one aspect of EU membership that has disproportionately outweighed all others in many minds.

They might be right, they might be wrong but in the end does it matter? They believe it. Many (not all) of them believe it strongly, sincerely and without racism and have voted on it and we need to respond.

purits was clearly one of the many 'protest' votes.

I cannot comprehend what the thought process was to reach the conclusion that voting to leave the EU would radically change all that's wrong in your area.

The EU has nothing to do with the vast majority of these problems and now you've just handed your precious 'control' to the government who've done nothing to stop the situation before.

Just how did you expect that to work?

Chances are the deprived areas will get worse not better as the focus will be on sorting the immediate shitstorm of getting out of the EU.

pangurban these areas (Cornwall and Wales) will probably be at the back of the queue in terms of funds now not because they voted to leave but because the government will allocate more funds to the money making areas such as London.

They shot themselves in the foot really, I couldn't stop laughing (bitter laugh of course) reading an article where a Welsh guy was asking what did EU do for him. This while playing football on a new EU funded sports centre close to a new EU funded housing development.

None that I can think of!

*The young are already upset and disappointed. We are pissing their life away. Its a wonder they haven't abandoned us all en masse on some ice floe.

Their voices need to be heard. We actually need action on the streets instead of just farting around on social media.*

If 'the young' were really so 'upset & disappointed' then getting off their arses to vote would have helped their cause somewhat.

Only app 36% of 18 - 24 year bothered to vote.
They are pissing their own lives away, perhaps they should take responsibility for themselves instead of expecting it to be done for them?

Mango thanks but that doesn't real answer the q! What are the specific benefits that you are looking forward to, post Brexit?

Dacre So, one benefit of the EU ref will be the mobilisation of support for the disaffected and disadvantaged, have I understood that right? Really not being goady, trying to find some specific positives.

I agree 100% Mango - the young are thoroughly pissing me off. I'm a Remainer and am more irked by the young so volubly protesting when they were loafing around in a muddy field in Somerset rather than actually bloody voting.

Dragons - with respect, discussions on threads are allowed to go off at a tangent!

acre So, one benefit of the EU ref will be the mobilisation of support for the disaffected and disadvantaged, have I understood that right? Really not being goady, trying to find some specific positives.

I'm not sure I'd put it in such terms.

Hopefully, one major positive outcome will be the impetus to heal the schism in the population, though, yes.

And rebalance our economy at the same time.

the mobilisation of support for the disaffected and disadvantaged

except now thanks to Brexit it's become clear that many people see the "Dissafected/disadvanteged" as simply goady fucker racists & xenophobes and will not be supporting them.

Nothing solved - perhaps things made worse.

So I'm not sure that can be counted as a positive.

Hmc Oh I know, but it's particularly the views of leave voters that I'm interested in hearing so I was trying to grab one as they passed through! (Apologies to mango if I misunderstood your position).

The same as has already been articulated throughout this thread.

The biggest gains will be:

Autonomy as a country (obviously).

Ability to make decisions for our own benefit in a timely fashion; at the moment we work to the timetable of the slowest of 27 other countries.

Ability to have real diverse immigration as a country, rather than the largely white EU.

As an offshoot from this referendum, the gains will be (I hope) a complete overhaul of this country's politics.

There is scope and will for a complete breakdown and reformation of our party system as it stands.
Although, if Stephen Crabb & Sajid Javid gain control of the conservatives then they will hopefully begin to represent blue collar workers once more - & hopefully labour can pull themselves up too with a complete change of leadership.

Oh and lightbulbs. At the other end of the scale some of us have hopes about the bulbs;

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/2669862-will-i-be-able-to-buy-a-quarter-of-pear-drops-or-a-lb-of-apples-again-now-frivolous-thought?

Well this is an optimistic thread

Although I don't know for sure (who does) I think the EU as it is, will eventually collapse. The UK pump in a lot of money (Billions a year) which has helped out the poorer countries within the EU (Greece/Spain etc) and without us, how can the EU survive? If it does, I would expect, one positive is that we do not have to continually bail out other countries (using taxpayers money) that have blindly taken the Euro as their currency, and are living in a desperate economy ever since. Teetering on the brink of bankruptcy. We were told how bad it would be for us keeping the pound ... see how that worked out?

Also - for anyone with young boys/men, they will not longer have to sign up to the EU army that has been proposed - and for which they would have no choice but to sign up for?

We also have more control over laws and where our money goes? And the money, can be used to benefit the UK and not just the EU as it is now.

Hey, I could be wrong, but I would like to think all of the above were true. I will remain positive

No!
Apologies to you Dragons - I just got cross with that 'young people' comment near the start and posted before reading the rest of the thread.

We weren't bailing out Greece! Jesus Christ how do people still believe this?!

That was one our many exemptions.

Threads go off on a tangent, of course! And that's one of the brilliant things about MN. :)

But MN is already full of threads where we can share our dismay and fear about the result. This thread was created purely to discuss any possible upsides, any tiny glimmers of goodness, that might come out of this.

loobylou - the collapse of the EU is one of my greatest fears. I cannot see it as something to be hoped for.

Nor is it easy to be very pleased that something that hadn't happened yet and was profoundly unlikely, won't happen (the European army - we'd have vetoed it).

Well this is an optimistic thread

You can polish a turd.
You can even roll it around and cover it in gold leaf and glitter.

But its still a turd.