to think the Remainers aren't going to take this lying down and we won't leave

[SybilEngineer]

A million plus more people voted leave than remain but still over 16 million voted in. And many of the people this will affect - the under 18s - didn't get a say.

The majority of our elected representatives want us to remain as does our capital city.

The EU wants us to remain and once the leaders have stopped throwing their toys around they will realise they need to reform the EU and make changes that will keep UK and all the other eurosceptic people in.

Today has been a body blow for us remainers but, we're shot of Cameron, so we can re-group and start the fight to remain in the EU but with changes that much of Europe wants.

Hipho effectively not literally.
Where are the parties? What are the tabloids saying? The ones which filled their front pages with straight bananas and immigrants stories? Is your Facebook timeline full of excitement and relief or shock and fear?

This is not an unstoppable ride though, Article 50 has not yet been invoked, and the EU can't force us to. Cameron said he would and he didn't, I wonder whether Boris asked him not to.

Here's a flowchart of how we might actually end up remaining (written before the leave vote)

I suspect it IS an unstoppable ride. The moment the first vote was cast, we pissed off the EU. They're pushing for us to exit ASAP, and they've already cancelled the agreement from February. We do not have that much of a voice in the EU. They can sit back and put us at a disadvantage with every decision they make, and we'd be essentially powerless to change that. They've already said there will be no renegotiations.

Not to invoke article 50, you would have to believe that not just a few, but about half the leave voters have buyer's remorse, otherwise you are just postponing the problem till the next election (not that we have that long) and prolonging the uncertainty. They only voted on Thursday - have so many of them really changed their minds?

Meanwhile Boris has just got rid of the prime minister - he really isn't in a position to back track and who is going to lead the remain campaign - Gordon Brown?

Of course people are vocally disagreeing with the result - just as 'leave' would have in other circumstances. However, practically, this is now the hand we have been dealt and we have to move forward on that basis.

Who is going to invoke Article 50? No one for a few months yet.

If the negotiated terms of our exit include free movement of people in return for access to the single market, does the person who invokes Article 50 really have the remit to do that given that the Leave campaign was won (and you can't pretend it wasn't) on the premise that leaving the EU would stop this?

Noble there is no negotiation before invoking article 50. To negotiate you must be in the 2 year track to leaving.

The EU won't exist in its current form in few years anyway. Juncker and Hollande are trying to insist the UK starts right now exiting. It would suit them as Hollande said publicly yesterday they need to prevent the 'contagion' Well too late, the EU no longer dictates the timescale.
Czech, Italy, Netherlands, Denmark, Sweden all have a strong contingent pushing for a referendum, and this will accelerate the pace.
In a few years, EU will probably be Germany, paying for Portugal, Spain ( except Catalonia which will have broken free), Scotland let's hope, and a ragtag of newly acceded eg Albania, Ukraine, Turkey - basically any hoping for handouts.

The other countries are tied together by a common currency. I think the challenge of unraveling that will make them much less willing to completely abandon the EU.

Who is going to invoke Article 50? No one for a few months yet.

The EU are going through the legalities with a fine toothcomb to see if they can trigger it straightaway.

I think we should do best of three.

Well, quite.

Scotland can have one after the other until they get what they want.
So, why not us?

And i'm only half joking.

The EU are going through the legalities with a fine toothcomb to see if they can trigger it straightaway.

And if they don't find it, they will simply put through things over and over that put the UK at a disadvantage, overrule us, refuse to negotiate, and force the decision earlier if they can.

VoyageOfDad

"Unless someone presses the leave button ( article 50 ) , or the EU do it themselves, a lot could happen between now and Oct."

For the EU to 'force' the UK out they would have to rewrite several of their own polices. Not an easy or quick task.

"Like all divorces, it isn't just the side that instigates leaving that gets to call the shots."

but in order for the EU to be able to get rid of us quickly they would have to rewrite article 48, bot a simple, easy or quick task.

Just some food for thought.

A Prime Minister resigned. The £ plummeted. The FTSE 100 lost significant ground. But then the £ rallied past February levels, and the FTSE closed on a weekly high: 2.4% up on last Friday, its best performance in 4 months. President Obama decided we wouldn't be at the 'back of the queue' after all and that our 'special relationship' was still strong. The French President confirmed the Le Touquet agreement would stay in place. The President of the European Commission stated Brexit negations would be 'orderly' and stressed the UK would continue to be a 'close partner' of the EU. A big bank denied reports it would shift 2,000 staff overseas. The CBI, vehemently anti-Brexit during the referendum campaign, stated British business was resilient and would adapt. Several countries outside the EU stated they wished to begin bi-lateral trade talks with the UK immediately. If this was the predicted apocalypse, well, it was a very British one. It was all over by teatime. Not a bad first day of freedom.

Or the other view (from Facebook):
INDEPENDENCE DAY ROUNDUP

Our first day of independence has gone just swimmingly:

1. Nigel Farage went on the tele and retracted the (false) claim that we send £350 million per week to the EU that would now be re-directed to the NHS and said Vote Leave should never have made that commitment to voters in the first place. Yesterday, this commitment was on the side of Vote Leave busses across the country. Exit polling indicates additional funding for the NHS was cited as a reason for leaving by nearly 80% of leave voters.
2. Daniel Hannan MEP retracted the (false) claim that leaving the EU will lead to drastically reduced immigration into Britain. Exit polling indicates this was the second most cited reason voters gave for leaving the EU. Would have been nice if Vote Leave had bothered to be honest with voters about both of these matters before today.
3. S&P, the only rating agency still giving the UK a AAA credit rating, confirms it has placed that rating under review for downgrade. It appears a downgrade is much more likely than not. Borrowing costs to fund Britain’s large deficit are set to increase markedly.
4. Sterling collapsed to its lowest level against the USD in three decades, the biggest single day drop in the history of the currency. It is the third biggest single day drop in any currency ever. It is currently $1.36, down an incredible 13 cents against the dollar in less than 24 hours from a high of $1.49 yesterday.
5. Nicola Sturgeon, Scotland’s first minister, has said a second independence referendum is “highly likely”. Scots will likely vote on dismembering the United Kingdom in the next few years, which will fuel uncertainty and economic turmoil.
6. Sinn Fein and various others in Northern Ireland call for a border poll on reunification.
7. Spain calls for co-sovereignty over Gibraltar.
8. More than £1.5 trillion in wealth was wiped out across global markets in just a few hours this morning, the single greatest wealth destroying event in stock market history. That's 187 years’ worth of British contributions to the EU. Seems worth it to get that money back from Brussels though.
9. The FTSE 100 (largely multinationals) fell more than 8% and the FTSE 250 (which reflects mostly British firms rather than multinationals) fell more than 12%. Both steadied after Mark Carney declared that the Bank of England would not hesitate to intervene to instil stability, the same sort of intervention that Mario Draghi had to make to save the Euro during the Greek crisis and that the G7 had to make to save the global economy after the collapse of Lehman. Brexit is an event that ranks alongside those crises in terms of effects on global markets.

10. Ultimately, the FTSE 100 finished down 3% and the FTSE 250 down 7%. Hundreds of billions of pounds has been wiped off people’s ISAs and pension funds. Banks in particular have been hammered. 11. David Cameron resigned without mapping out any plan for implementing the results of the referendum. Boris Johnson is odds on favourite to be our next Prime Minister. In October. 12. Labour MPs have moved for a vote of no confidence in Jeremy Corbyn which will be considered by the party on Monday. 13. The presidents of the European Council, Commission and Parliament told us to invoke Article 50 and leave as soon as possible and the settlement negotiated by David Cameron earlier this year is now void. 14. Nigel Farage, who earlier claimed that independence was achieved "without a single bullet being fired", just called for UK gun laws to be relaxed, one week after Jo Cox was murdered on the street in broad daylight. With a gun. 15. Numerous reports of immigrants, and native Britons who happen to be brown, being told to “go back home” in the street and on the Tube, the vote to leave apparently having been taken by some as an indication that most of the country now thinks this sort of thing is acceptable, rather than profoundly un-British and utterly awful.

2. Daniel Hannan MEP retracted the (false) claim that leaving the EU will lead to drastically reduced immigration into Britain.

Dan Hannan never ever said it would.

"It seems that some voted Leave because they felt their voice wasn't being listened to by anyone"

Right.

So not, for example, because they wanted to leave the EU, then?

Balanced view from Martin Lewis. www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/family/2016/06/martins-reaction-to-brexit

Dan Hannan never ever said it would.

Possibly true, but the question is whether voters were listening to him.

This is the biggest fucking case of plausible deniability ever, isn't it.

Is anyone actually going to stand up and own the £350m for the NHS claim? Or, well, any of them?

Is anyone actually going to stand up and own the £350m for the NHS claim?

Answered my own question here.

GingerIvy that paragraph sounded like some kind of editorial - just out of interest, can I ask where it was from?

And here's a point: does anyone know where the hell George Osborne has gone?? Given that he's supposed to be chancellor (and in view of his apocalyptic warnings) I'd have expected more than a few tweets, frankly