DSis disabled and not looking after baby

[Redcentre]

Wasn’t sure where to put this as I’m not often on mumsnet, but do appreciate it when I am.

I have a dilemma about my sister- she has MS and had a baby who’s eight months now. She downs to now how to look after him. Just feeds him lots of bottled milk. He’s obese (officially) and doesn’t have much chance to move as she’s in a small house with lots of furniture and no carpet/ soft surfaces.

shes always been very lazy and the MS makes her life all the harder. She still sees (childless, arty, drug taking) friends. So she’s not completely housebound and sad.

her baby only lies down and can now roll over. But with an experienced/ even inexperienced caregiver I think he’d be starting to go on hand and knees and definitely sitting. He’s not weaning.

I contacted social services when he was two months as I was worried about her and her partner’s lack of effort and basic knowledge about feeding and sleeping. As well as their constant partying. Aaagh!

I have three healthy happy kids and don’t want to be a bossy big sister as it wouldn’t help at all. Just want some advice form people who have had similar issues/ seen similar things.

social services haven’t contacted her as far as I know. The baby is bored and quite neglected : (

Bottle fed babies who are six montha plus and on less than 500ml of formula a day need vitamin A, C and D supplements.

Which clearly does not apply to this baby and is completely irrelevant to this thread

OP whereas I agree this isn't how I'd choose to raise my own child I'm not sure that what you're describing really meets the threshold for significant intervention from social services.

I think you need to let go of your idea of the perfect upbringing for your dn and be realistic about what influence you can have. This is especially the case since it doesn't sound like you like your dsis much. I'm not sure she's going to respond very well to any interventions from you as I'm sure on some level she knows how you feel about her and her 'obese' baby.

I think if you really want to support your dn then you need to be supportive to dsis and keep her friendly. I wouldn't persue social services or anything else unless anything changes.

The NHS is clear that babies should be eating some food as well as milk by 6 months.
https://www.nhs.uk/start-for-life/baby/weaning/what-to-feed-your-baby/7-to-9-months/#feeding

The baby could be bored and frustrated because he wants to do things that he cannot yet do due to his own limitations. But living in a tiny house without carpets will have no bearing on that. Neither of my children went on their hands and knees or crawled an inch. Youngest walked very early instead.

When you say 'not weaning' do you mean your sister hasn't attempted to give him any solids? He definitely should be having them. Does he have toys around him and interaction? Go out for walks etc? It sounds as though you don't think your sister is engaging with him and if that's really the case she'd probably benefit from some help.

Could you please link to the NHS guidance advising that iron supplementation of babies is required? Not the other supplementation you've since mentioned, but iron specifically.

Then when you've done that, you can provide some proof of your claim that food is a play item before 1 and that required nutrition should be coming from milk.

There's no such thing as an obese baby, all babies are chubby, some more than others

My sons dr wrote that he was obese in his medical records the health visitor put the next entry in stating he was tall for his age and his height/weight were in proportion and not cause for concern so yes SOME Dr's believe its possible for babies to be obese

Do you really think a HV would be fine with an 8 month old baby being fed no solids because they're not sitting independently yet?

What are your actual concerns OP?
You say she’s feeding him bottles of milk - is this formula, or cows milk? At 8 months cows milk should only be given with food so that would be a concern, but if formula that’s totally fine.

weaning yes ideally you’d start at 6 months but it can be a slow process (my twins just nibbled at stuff until ~10 months). But yes, if you think she’s too ‘lazy’ to prepare food again I’d be a bit concerned (but what about her partner??)

I’ve never ever known a baby be referred to as obese - my son rode the 99th centile and not a word was said about it. Who has ‘officially’ said this?

8 months perfectly normal to still be lying/rolling too. Maybe an attempt at rocking / sitting but not abnormal for that to all take a few more months yet.

I’ve been thinking about your post @Redcentre and tbh, its so ableist!! It’s unbelievable.

What does the fact the mum has MS has anything to do with the situation?
Why the need to say she ‘isn’t sad’? Do you think all disabled or chronically ill people are sad? Or housebound. Or that being sad or housebound is automatically impacting on the ability of a new mum to look after their baby?

Im so uncomfortable with that post is so full of prejudices. From being lazy to being sad or unable to parent properly.
And all under the pretence of being worried about the baby who shows no issues at all.

You might want to review your prejudices tbh.

I find a lot of these types of threads overbearing and alarmist – but not this one. It feels bad.

Maybe because I suspect I know the exactly sort of person you're talking about. It's not really about the MS, it's the other stuff.

This doesn't sound like it quite merits SS involvement but I would still be concerned.

What about the rest of your family, can you get others to help encourage? Can you spend more time with them, and subtly model better parenting?

She may be entitled to paid respite daycare for the baby due to her disability. Might be worth looking into

DSis uses the bottle as a way to entertain the baby. He is clearly bored and wants to move but he’s not strong enough to do much. She doesn’t like seeing him frustrated and doesn’t encourage him to keep trying (hard also because of her MS and having an ill-thought-out house).
she doesn’t engage although the HV has said he’s much too big to be as mobile as he’d like. They said they’d be referred to a nutritionist but I’m not sur that what they needs. Feel they need emotional engagement with their kid to put some thought into caring for him.

Thanks to those who didn’t just think it was an issue I have with bottle feeding. To me it’s an innocent baby who needs care and love and is having to sacrifice development to parental non-engagement.

I suppose I can ask instead: is there any hope? I can hardly do anything. I actually care more about him than keeping on good terms with my sister btw. But keeping on good terms with her is better atm as it lets me have a tiny bit of influence.

My son (youngest of 3) refused solids. He was the biggest and he gagged. I took hi to health visitor numerous times because I was so worried he wasn;t eating despite being 98th percentile and had acid reflux. At one point he was basically living on fruit (and milk) alone and this was well past the 8 month mark. They said 'as long as he's getting something'. My eldest is autistic and was eating solids from 4 months despite being tiny. Also walked at 12 months unlike my NT son who was 18 months before he did, and he had plenty interaction with 2 older siblings and me running several parent/toddler groups that he obviously came to with me.

My son is now 15, not overweight, tall, strong and very smart. To me it sounds like OP has decide what is right and what's not, And instead of helping she is just judging from the sidelines.

And Runningoutofimagjnativeusernames you were an attentive and caring parent to your child. My enormous off the scale boy who ate very little solids until 1 was also offered them and did just fine (sensory issues/autistic) while another of mine was on three meals a day by six months. Our children don’t work as case studies though.

OP fears that the attentive care bit is missing and actually anyone who has worked with struggling parents know that they do often fail to deal with the transition into solids appropriately while using bottles to pacify. It is neglectful not to offer appropriate food and can be part of wider neglect. Or maybe the OP could be a sanctimonious sister but out of the two options presuming the latter doesn’t give any chance for a potentially struggling family to get support.

Sounds like the best thing would be for the baby to go to some baby groups, could you find out about options near your sister? Is she able to get out and about easily? Could you offer practical help with this like lifts? Go with her a couple of times if she's nervous about going alone?
Is she able to take the baby out for a walk? You could maybe help with this too, offer to take him to the park once a week for example.
Does she have space for toys like a play mat or a ball pit?
I wouldn't be overly concerned about the crawling, a lot of babies don't by 8 months, but he should be able to sit unsupported and should at least be offered finger foods by 8 months.
My youngest didn't crawl until 9 months and was quite chubby by then but could sit and roll.
Do you know who your sister's HV is? They could be better to contact with concerns than SS depending how good they are.
Is the baby clean etc? If he is then I don't think this falls into neglect, just more support needed.

This answer nails it for me.

Request more support on her behalf. If they investigate and find no issues then all you can do is keep an eye and offer what support you can.

The rest of this thread has just turned into perfect parents vs each other.

As I said I don’t want to come the sort-of carer for them. I think apart from pissing them off they do need to do it themselves. I didn’t mention her partner seems quite pro-parenting but he’s severely dyslexic and has a sort of phobia of looking anything up. He also doesn't want to annoy my DSis by proposing stuff she doesn’t want to do. He does most of the work at home. Apart from his job.

So, yes, it’d be nice and very enlightening for them to join a group but they don’t want to. I can’t make them.

You know what, before I contacted SS I talked to her doctor. It went terribly as her doctor seemed unaware of their role. It turned into me explaining lots of things to the doctor about how the system works (I don’t even know it all!) In the end I gave up and called Ss

Regional support is very varied these days but at the best level there is individual family support workers in many areas and there are still early days parenting courses available. Most of these will need referrals to access. Sounds like your sister’s partner could be encouraged to ask for support?

Rocknrollstar- thanks. I don’t want to get really involved but I do want to help them and the baby. If I contact social services again- I am very anxious about confidentiality and them just going there and seeing how to help. Is this realistic? There’s no point in doing something if it’ll just complicate everything. I think it makes it worse that they have no friends with kids. So no role models

My apologies, I think I was too honed in on the 'not meeting milestones'.

I do still think that offering practical support would be helpful. From what I understand SS are there to help but it doesn't always work that way. It's not OP's responsibility but if you're that concerned about a baby relative then try help. How does she know al this? Is she with them 24/7 or are her concerns coming from what she 'thinks' he should be doing at that age while barely seeing them? I suppose that's why I took it as that because they really are all different.

You can remain completely anonymous. Health visitor and Socials should be able to determine if all is well.

And people are saying ‘it’s not enough’ they can and will do wellness checks - it’s what the HVs are there for. Keep trying. X

Ok, thanks everyone. I’ll keep trying. And trying to stay ok myself despite the denial of both the parents. I see them about once a month for a day (with my kids). I don’t have a good feeling about it but maybe something will start flowing eventually.