Am I mean? Wd like some perspective

[runningpram]

We have an elderly relative who around six months ago started asking for money every month. It's typically around £100 to £200 - so not a huge amount.

We also give elderly relative some money every month anyway to help them out.

We can sort of afford the extra but it means things like DC not doing activities, or me having to delay getting a coat or get hair cut. These aren't huge sacrifices I absolutely don't want relative going without and struggling, so don't mind in principle as elderly relative only has state pension plus other small pension - so is obviously badly impacted by cost of living.

However they do a lot of travelling around the country some times to see us but mostly to catch up with friends - which adds up to a lot.

I tried to talk to relative about this and they said in return they thought I owed them money for buying treats for DC when they came to visit, which they have never mentioned before. To be clear - treats are basically ice creams, snacks while out and about etc. We usually give cash for these but sometimes relatives has bought clothing (nothing massively expensive) without asking us but this has always been described as a present.

They have done a little childcare before but only when they are visiting us and it is a case of sitting on the couch with DC in bed and being on call if there is an emergency. We get DC ready for bed and DC have always gone to nursery. By contrast they have done huge amounts of full time childcare for other side of family - which is fair enough because they live closer. We always pay train fares etc if elderly relative comes down and stays.

The issue I'm having is the constant demands - they've even now started to ask when I'll get paid!! They don't ask other side of family for anything as they are not in position to help. This is fair enough but I work full time - which has been quite a sacrifice for me over the years and elderly relative has had the odd negative comment to say about this, which I've let go. DH's role isn't super well paid - so I keep our heads above water.

Recently things have come slightly to a head as elderly relative has announced they are going on an expensive holiday. They were initially suggesting I should 'loan' them the cash. They have now got the cash from elsewhere in the shape of a loan from a friend. Clearly it is their business but if they money requests start again - can I refuse? They have been given a sizeable loan and have chosen to spend it on a hol. HOWEVER this is a longed for holiday late in life

I honestly don't know if I am being a meanie or not. Elderly relative is a really kind loving person- I am actually a bit worried for them generally as this is all slightly out of character.

Am I a meanie or am I stupid and naive? Pls some perspective and kind advice on how to deal with this.

This isn't my parent - there are some cultural issues attached - so it is a bit of a complex dynamic.

what relation are they to you? What are the cultural issues? Why do you feel this very strong obligation to help them financially?

Suggest a chat about money and budgeting if they can't make ends meet, you really can't afford to keep subsidising them, life isn't all about just affording food on the table, you have your children's future to save for. Are they entitled to any benefits if they are so short of money?

WTAF have I just read? The way the OP keeps making excuses, even feeling bad about the possibility of suggesting the OAP goes to CAB.

Goong without haircuts and depriving your own children of activities so the OAP can go on a ‘longed for’ holiday? Have you lost your mind?

OP, normally I’m quite measured, but just stop being a doormat. Your hard earned wages are for you and your children. Any surplus is for saving, investing or paying down your mortgage, not for some other family member to spaff on a holiday. Our ancestors fought hard for women’s rights to work and have financial independence. Stop insulting them with this doormattery.

The OAP is not hard up: they have state pension AND private pension and they have paid off their mortgage. They have multiple other benefits such as WFA and free travel courtesy of the taxpayer. They have way more disposable income than you. FACT. Even if they didn’t, you ‘owe’ them nothing.

Don’t ‘sit down them and have a nice chat’ as other people are suggesting. To use a phrase from the Grange Hill days:

Just Say No. No need to explain or get them to understand or empathise.

Just Say No.

Just a thought have you checked they are claiming all benefits they are entitled too . Someone from Age Uk can help with this . They help complete forms

I would absolutely not let my children miss out on activities or go without a haircut in order to support them. I would put in writing 'We cannot afford to support you financially any more. We have all been missing out on basics in order to support you and we will not do this any more. I am sure you understand and would not want the children to go with out. We think it's best to be clear that we will not give any more money to you, so you can plan and budget accordingly '. I would add something about them not buying any more small treats for your children as it's unreasonable to do that and expect to be reimbursed. They are CFs

They’ve got a bloody nerve. If they were planning on travelling in older age they should have saved up as most people do.
No is a sentence.

To put this in context this is a close relative.

Someone asked about cultural expectations - ER has spent a lot of time in another culture where younger members of the family routinely help out older relatives and has many friends from that background. So I think thinking is influenced by that potentially.

I don’t think I have been a doormat to date but agree that the holiday - even though we are not funding- puts things into a different light.

I think if there are further requests i will say no- although will help out with a shop if things are really desperate.

I do suspect ER is not claiming everything or could be claiming more - so we will suggest we work through their finances.

If my relative was having difficulties I would pay for heating, water and council tax directly rather than give them hard cash. That way you know where your money is going. However, you need to ensure your needs and your child's needs are covered off first.

You are being manipulated and used. They are milking the cultural ticket and taking the piss.

Stop it. As others have said, “NO “ is a complete sentence.

If the holiday money was a loan from a friend, I'd be anxiously awaiting ER telling you that she now needs extra money monthly to pay them back, either directly or indirectly via now having no money for food due to repayments. Get the conversation over now, don't wait for the situation to escalate to 'they won't even pay now I'm starving'.

I don't want to be in any way culturally insensitive, but you could argue that 'cultural values' that make you feel bad is just peer pressure from dead people. Why would you love under strain or unhappiness so a group of dead people or ERs friends think you're behaving properly?

Your child going without activities and you going without a basic necessity such as a coat to fund them is absolutely appalling. You need to stop giving them a penny.

But then ER spends her newly augmented disposable income on treats. You can tell yourself you're funding those things, but really you're supporting her not paying them.

There is no chance that I would sacrifice doing things for my child such as hobbies for this relative, none.

I would have given it to my mum if she needed it but not if she was able to go on holidays etc. Ultimately my biggest financial responsibility is my children. This year I will have driving lessons to pay for for my son. They are £40 per hour. He can’t pay for them himself as he gets paid £7.55 an hour at his part time job and is doing A levels. He also has a very expensive tutor to help with his A levels. Well A level maths to be specific as he needs to get an A in this subject, which is very hard. He is also going on the first abroad school trip he has ever been on, which is very expensive. So he (and his brother) are my priority. I have no older relatives left sadly but even if I did I would only help for the basics for them as I need to prioritise my teenagers.

So I would just not let them buy anything else for your children. Maybe set up a direct debit for £50 per month and say that’s all you can afford and stick to it.

You’re being taken advantage of and your kind nature is being exploited. I agree with a PP that she will need money to help with the repayments. She’s identified you as a source of free money and will keep asking and the demands will get more audacious. I would restrict your help to checking she’s got all the benefits she is entitled to. If she was desperate for help, then it might be different. I wouldnt be in a hurry to pay specific bills either as you’ll still be indirectly subsidising her discretionary activities while you go without. You sound like a lovely person, but I think you’ll need to be bit tougher here.

Stop giving them money and offer to help organise a financial meeting with Age UK who can help them fill in forms and claim everything they’re entitled to.

If you’re worried they’re going without (although it doesn’t sound like they are!) you could offer to pay for an online supermarket order or similar each month. But don’t hand over cash!

I sympathise. Spent my mid 20s to mid 30s giving a regular subsidy to a parent - a bit different perhaps for a dad but I know how it happens. Of course you aren’t being unreasonable not to subsidise an older relative. Cultures where the children support the elders financially don’t usually involve said elders living alone in a house they own, or going on big holidays.

I think giving them a heads up that the payments stop in 2026 is quite kind enough.

You can offer, but I’ll eat my hat if they accept any kind of ‘help’ managing their finances. Tbh in a way, why should they? But they don’t get to be subsidised either.

You are being taken advantage of here op. It certainly isn’t a common scenario in UK culture and for good reason - the children’s well-being should take priority over the elders and with the current cost of living you clearly can’t afford to subsidise their lifestyle. I agree with previous suggestions that they need help with budgeting and ensuring they claim any benefits they are entitled to - they and you will be surprised at what that looks like I suspect.

Is the 'cultural' aspect linked to Confucianism? I have read everything you've shared and I think you need to stop. Is it your MIL?

Can ER downsize house to release funds and reduce outgoings?

You need to put your children first. They shouldn't be missing out because your relatives are spending their own money on travel and expecting you to make up the shortfall. Explain to them that the cost of living has increased drastically and you can;t afford this any longer.

Agree with all this. Unfortunately ER is v good at claiming they need to see friends to offer them support. Hol has been depicted as not hol but offering support until I mentioned that friends thry are travelling with should therefore pay, when it became a restful hol again!

So it’s not an expectation in your culture? It’s that the ER sees her friends being financially supported by their children and she expects you to do this? Are any of you of this culture?

if you, your DH and your ER are enmeshed in specific cultural expectations of how younger generations should support older relatives, then 99% of the responses on here are irrelevant. you would be better telling us what the culture is, and getting some more informed opinions.

if you and your DH are not of this culture and you’re just going along with it because you are too feeble to say no, then you need to learn about setting and enforcing boundaries.

If they were actually concerned with being able to eat/heat their house then they wouldn’t be borrowing money to go on holidays. Your children come first and I absolutely would not take from my children to give to a relative. Any talk of “you owe me”, I’d of been shutting down straight away. £200 a month is a lot of money so unless she was doing regular childcare that’s nonsense. Has her financial situation changed recently or is this just coming out of nowhere? If she owns her house then maybe she needs to downsize. Maybe phrase it as “We were happy to help with essentials, but it seems like a lot of your money is going to holidays and whilst we understand that it’s important to you to see your friends we cannot sacrifice activities and essentials for our own family to fund this”.

I agree with all the PP on this thread. It would be different if ER were short of money for basics like food and bills. However this is clearly not the case. Seems like they have an adequate income and are probably in a position to claim at least some benefits, So this is the direction in which I would point them. There is nothing wrong in an ER having some treats and social life but that should be paid our of disposable income when the basics are met. And not scrounged from younger family members who are depriving themselves and their children as a result. The lavish foreign holiday is a complete piss take. I would scale back considerably because of that.

There are some good suggestions on this thread. First action after the holiday is to have a hard talk with ER and take her to CAB for a benefits check. Perhaps it needs another person (from outside the family) to be there when you reiterate that you are depriving your own family to meet ERs needs. The suggestion that ER share her financial information with you as a condition of any further help or advice is a good one. Normally I would say that it might be a form of abuse to inquire into someone's private means in this way. However ER had made herself your dependent and beggers cannot be choosers.

What does your husband say about this situation and does he know the extend to which you are depriving yourself and your child to fund this scrounger?