Should more people prepare for old age?

[Glasscabinet]

Bear with me on this one.

Off the back of two thoughts: PIL have received a sizeable inheritance and have asked us to have a think of what we’d like as they’d like to pay for something for us (car/something for our house/holiday). I won’t side this thread by they’ll be hidden strings involved so we’ve declined the offer three times.

But joking aside, what I’d really like them to spend the money on is planning for their old age. They’re both mid 70s, okayish health (FIL has had cancer twice in the last decade) but neither have had a particularly healthy lifestyle which is starting to show. Supposedly nobody in FIL’s side has reached 80; I doubt FIL will either. But they still manage two long haul holidays a year (for longer periods as they take them slower these days).

I can preempt that we’ll get the call within the next five years that FIL has died and MIL cannot cope alone in her four-bed-house. She hates her own company and relies on FIL for everything (no online shopping/cannot put fuel in the car/very much panics in any situation/problem…) The house has a downstairs toilet but no shower, not wheelchair friendly, huge garden and the area isn’t the safest- doubtful MIL would feel comfortable going to the shops in a scooter etc. The house is also four bedrooms of clutter.

Also reading another thread of when elderly family need to move it’s too late. Basically you’ve got to be pretty capable of doing a big move and life can change in an instant.

We’ve got a young family and I doubt it’s ’complete’. I feel almost obliged to spell it out to them that they can’t be relying on us as it’s just not feasible. MIL makes a lot of comments that we need to move closer as they want to help us with childcare. I feel myself biting my tongue that they need to sort out their arrangements first.

I’d have loved to have parents that travelled and spent their money. They were so obsessed with saving and providing for us, they never spent a penny more than was necessary.

The really first anticipate paying for any care - that would’ve been anathema to them. They got exactly what they wanted. No need for care and absolutely no burden on their children. They remained completely independent and both died in their 90s. My mum in her sleep, my dad after an extremely brief 5 day hospital stay, having been well up to that point.

They left us all shed loads of savings and a big, valuable house in one of the most expensive areas in the country. I’m grateful, but sad they didn’t get to enjoy the money they’d worked for. It’s had the effect that I don’t feel comfortable spending it and want to give the lot to our kids, who’ll need it more.

Sorry I am derailing this thread.

Of course we should all make plans, things change in an instant. Wills & POA should be in place, we have too much clutter generally.
Funeral plans should be made and paid for in advance where possible and finances in order and simplified.

Surely if you have the ability to take out a mortgage or sign a rent ail agreement, then a will isn’t an huge next step?

The whole thing helps with the people left behind. People need to spend time grieving when you’re gone and it’s the decent thing to do. What’s not is watching people spend months getting rid of mouldy cardboard from your loft and phoning Bradford & Bingley to see if the share certificate you’ve just found is still valid.

That’s properly selfish and I won’t be told otherwise. So is staying in a massive unsuitable house and expecting long distance care from people with already busy lives.

However, I know that’s a housing issue in general (where are all these great, accessible, affordable places with no stairs) that’s not fixing itself any time soon.

Well I'm sorry to be so rude but you are both stupid and selfish. Can I ask why though? Is it that you think you will never have a fall/get dementia/suffer from the usual older people's ailments? Do you have children or other family who will be expected to step in?

@IhaveanewTVnow absolutely your right to make your own choices. Can I ask though assuming you have adult children will you expect them to step up to help you? If so are they aware of your decision to make no plans? How do they feel about that potential responsibility?

Exactly this.

I have many examples of friends and parents friends that have gone from aqua aerobics and golfing to unable to care for themselves as quick as a flash.

Get wills and powers of attorney sorted for health, welfare and finances now whatever else you do.

The first reaction of whoever is doing the assessment should be to call the daughter and get her response to being asked to be a carer.

What exactly would you like someone like me to do? 70, arthritic hip but otherwise well. Sell my modest home and go where? Bungalows are rare and expensive, the local assisted living flats are in huge demand and I certainly can't afford/don't need residential care!
I am not entirely sure what is selfish about living happily alone, with my dog, pottering in my garden, socialising etc.
My will is made and the boys know where it is. Nt sure what else you are expecting.

To be fair, my mother, a trained ballerina, could do the splits at 85 and still met her friends, coffee mornings, Bridge, etc. At 87 she was diagnosed with acute aortic stenosis, and has had a TAVI. Discovering she is not invincible has now taken it out of her. She has dizzy spells, has had to give up driving and has lost confidence to get the bus to the village, let alone to the local county town for lunch and a shopping trip.

Her frailty has been swift, unanticipated and quite shocking. She's on Sertraline and has had therapy.

Two years ago she was still wearing leather trousers, silk blouses and heels. Now she's in leggings and trainers.

A disaster could happen to anyone of any age at any time but you don’t see most people living their lives in anticipation of a major problem - why would you expect others to do so?

focus on yourself - eat well and exercise , keep a healthy weight and plan your life around the car accident or stroke that can hit at any time. Let the in laws live their best life

do not go gently as the saying goes

My preparation for old age is a decent pension and enough money to pay for care if needed. I wouldn't be so quick to downsize and want to enjoy having a lovely big house and doing loads of entertaining and having friends and family to stay as my in laws have in later life/retirement.

I live 10 mins away from our local hospital. As I'm in a London borough, my free travel pass is incredibly useful and gets me to all the services I could possibly need.

I am not moving to somewhere with limited travel options or miles away from a hospital.

Friends of mine have recently sold their house in the country and moved to a town. This is sensible imo. But most retirees seem to go in the other direction.

chipstick, "her version of events". There's some serious history there between you all 😂.

It's all about probabilities etc. A "disaster" is far less likely to a young healthy person than an older person. It's well known that lots of health conditions are age related, so the risks rise as you get older. Basically, when you're 60, the chances/risks of something "bad" happening in the near future is far higher than when you're 30. It makes perfect sense to start to think and make plans as you get towards retirement, especially as things can change very rapidly and before you know it, it may be too late for you to be able to cope with downsizing etc. No one is suggesting living a basic/boring life and doing nothing, giving up everything, etc. It's more about planning for an uncertain future at a time when you actually have options and are capable of making changes.

I moved from the country into a town in my mid 40s cause I could see the issues which were highlighted by 2020

It's a mix of living your life and being practical but also it can be hard to cover off everything. My parents sort of did 'the right thing'. They retired to a single storey new build 5 years ago, but it's 2 1/2 hours from nearest child and 10 hours from the other children. They wanted a change, it was dream location and affordable. I think they just thought we could travel more than we can with work and small kids.

They like where they are but have to travel a lot to see (grand)kids. After 5y my DF has some health issues which mean they're not travelling so he can attend appointments. Hopefully the issues will be resolved in 6m but it does give a glimpse into a future where they can't travel and we all have limited leave.

She sounds like she has had an amazing life!

One of our oldies (term of affection for all of those who object!) had a stroke at 85, and went in an instant from someone golfing, shopping, meeting friends and looking after her husband to someone who is unlikely to ever go home again. Heartbreaking - particularly as she and her husband have no family, and are relying on friends such as us to sort everything out.

But she has had an amazing life!

We know some people in their 80s who moved from a London suburb to the seaside. It was a ridiculous move. They complained constantly about the lack of facilities then hospitals. They had so much money there was nothing stopping them buying a second home or flat by the seaside for a few years. Instead the husband became unwell, suffered from the lack of medical care nearby, died within a year and the wife is bouncing from relative whilst she tried now to buy something suitable.

😂

She is a CF of the highest order at times. I have zero intention of making a trip to fix her printer when she demands. Or organising appointments. She shouldn’t have bought a house where she did.

Mainly stamp duty!

I’d be £24k in stamp duty to buy a bungalow near me for example. £17500 + VAT in estate agent fees to sell this one, £1000+ solicitor fees, £500 home report etc.

Add to that new carpets, curtains, any adaptations.

It’s a lot of money and really has to be done when people are capable of making a move.

Oh gosh, this is sad and it makes me fearful of my own future, as my partner and I are both only children and we have no kids, so no chance of any family being around. You are a kind person for supporting them though.

I used to think that I could merely say “ I don’t want to go into a care home” and by putting that in my expression of wishes in my LPOA, would be good enough for my kids to get me carers in my own home instead.

i was naive and inexperienced

my dad died of Lewy body dementia last year. He was “only” in care for two years. He hated it. Was depressed by it. Thought he was going home soon, pleading, right up to two weeks before he died.

but the issue was he was a danger to himself and otheres. LBD causes hallucinations and delusions. He was agressive and violent at times. He HAD to go into hospital, under deprivation of liberty. He was later sectioned. He was in some terrible nhs mental hospitals while they tried to figure out what was happening. For 9 months moved from pillar to post in nhs. They finally got on top of it as LBD and got him out into a care home. Then care home couldn’t cope. Back in hospital. Finally he was given nursing care and discharged to a bloody brilliant specialist nursing home. Out of area as his local authority literally had no where for him to go.

it was terrible. LBD is a grotesque illness.

by the time we realised dad had issues, it was so fast..there was no choices for anyone.

and dad knew exactly where he was. Holding someone hand who is crying, aged 86, because they want to go home to their music and workshop is soul destroying. It’s cruel

but it is often not a choice. Dad wasn’t only one in this situation. Many dementia patients end up agressive and violent at certain points, or doing stuff like calling out emergency services repeatedly or wandering half dressed at night. They simply can’t be looked after in their own homes safely. It takes 1:2 ratio of care for people in this state. Even if we have assisted suicide it won’t solve many dementia patients being forced into care homes - it’s too late for consent by then.

im not naive now. I’ve rewritten my expression of wishes to account for this worse case scenario. I dread care homes , but I know now it probably won’t be something I get choice about.

This is a really importsnt point. When I moved it was stressful trying to find a house with downstairs bedroom and bathroom options. I ended up in dormer bungalow , but even that has proved to be a shoddily built 1960s money sink. Just to make it habitable and structurally sound.

there just aren’t enough bungalows as it is. They attract a premium price due to demand.

if everyone who was getting expertly decided to do practical thing and downsize to bungalow type living- well there just isn’t anywhere near that amount of housing stock of that type

my friends and I were tlaking just this afternoon, a new build estate of over 2500 houses has just 10 bungalows to build between the developers to meet planning permission. 10? When population is aging?

amd all the younger folks that think elderly are blocking large family homes and should downsize? Have they ever thought about where all that downsized, single story accommodation is going to magically conjured up from ?

if governemnt were serious about elderly downsizing they up quotes for houses with aging in place type functions, and reduce stamp duty if you’re downsizing.

I read a very interesting article by the lady who was the Green Goddess, getting us all to do aerobics on C4 breakfast when it first came in.

She still does fitness and was adamant that bungalows are a bad idea. The stairs keep one fit and keep one balanced to climb. A skill worth keeping and that will prolong life.