Widowed Mum - Setting Boundaries

[nadia2024]

Hi

I'm a 45 year old woman in a relationship of 12 years. My mum lost my Dad over 4 years ago, quite suddenly. It was not long after they both relocated to be nearer to me and my partner. It was a shock for my Mum for his sudden passing. They did everything together. It was heart breaking for Mum, naturally. She moved here, not only for them to be closer to us, but also for my Dad to see new things with her together. He was getting a bit depressed, so was looking forward to seeing new things together.

Mum is naturally lost without him. She grieved quite privately all through the immediate lockdown just after he'd past, but refused to stay with us and I respected that. I did, however, go to do her shopping and sat outside in her garden whilst i talked to her through the door. She did, however, stay with us for the second lockdown, which of course we wanted for her.

It has been four years now. I go to visit my mum every Wednesday I have off from work. I also have her over my house every weekend from Friday evening to Monday morning. My partner is extremely patient, kind and welcoming to her.

When she comes around, at times she can be nice and courteous, but sometimes she says things that can be a little rude and nasty. Mainly flippant comments. She will sometimes critise the things I do, or she will do it better, or just give unsolicited advice. To take for example, to do with washing dishes. She doesn't understand why I don't use the washing bowl in the sink. I explained that I can't fit everything in there and that i'm happy as it is, but she still did it. She also has changed the toilet roll around to the way she likes it. I just put it back, then she does it again. I do understand that this behaviour is coming from a place of trying to find her place within our family dynamic, but it's getting a little exhausting.

My partner and my mum have always shared some light hearted banter, but recently she has been saying quite snide comments. A couple of weeks ago it was about my partners lack of DIY skills, another time 'he watches too much football', and 'he should go in the other room'. She will make remarks on the tv about people, about the way they dress, or how they speak in a derogatory manner.

I don't recall my Mum being like this when she was younger, and I wonder if it's an age thing, or something else. To do with the constant advice giving, I know she did like to micro manage my father, so in replacement I presume she's doing that.

As it's been four years, and we have given Mum lots of care and attention, we feel that we should scale back the amount of time Mum spends at ours. We have tried to encourage her to join a group, to meet new people. My mum's excuses have been numerous. The most recent response when I tried to encourage her to go to a coffee morning was 'I don't want anyone taking over my life?' When I suggest her to perhaps find a new thing she'd like to do she says that 'she's not interested in anything'. If I push any more, she gets moody and says 'I will do things in my own time'. When I've said my partner and I are going to learn archery she replied she'd love to go, to which she did. We feel like we are baby sitting her and are a bit exacerbated by it all.

We are going to ask her if she could come on a Saturday morning and stay till Sunday evening, as the days are getting longer (she won't drive at night)

I will still see her on a Wednesday afternoon still, but I can't help feeling guilty with this reduction in the weekend. She does visit my aunt who relocated to where I live from Spain a couple of years ago on a Tuesday, or vise versa. I just can't seem to try to get her carve herself a bit more of a social life for herself. It hurts to think she is maybe sitting alone on a Friday night.

I guess I'm on here trying to find out if I'm being a bad daughter. I'd like advice on how to deal with her inflammatory remarks to my partner.

Thank you for reading this very long message. Hopefully you got to the end and have some pearls of wisdom

Best Wishes

Nadia

Of course you're not being a bad daughter, OP.

I'm not sure I have advice on how to deal with her unpleasantness to your partner, but your post set off a few alarms for me.
You say this behaviour is new for her. Are there any other changed behaviours, such as forgetting familiar names, trouble retrieving the words she wants, basically any cognitive changes? When was the last time she was in to see the GP?

Forgive me if I'm way off-base here, but the fact that these behaviours are new for her seems concerning.

No, you are not being a bad daughter. As a matter of fact , you are the opposite. She is at your house every weekend which I think is a bit too much . I certainly would not want to impose that much on my son and dil if I was in your mums shoes . You need some breathing space too and your partner has so much patience he sounds like a saint . We all have our habits and techniques of how we run our household and she is not respecting your way which would be annoying but I don’t know what else you can say to her . I can’t offer any advice really but you sound like a wonderful daughter.

You sound like a lovely daughter and have been going above and beyond.
Yes to more boundaries.
Could you reduce to alternate weekends initially - “DH is taking me away for anniversary / treat / concert/visit friends / event” etc.
It will be better for your DM and her independence going forwards.
If she criticised my DH I would pull her up on that - “DH won’t take kindly to you criticising him and in his own home, I don’t like that either”

(I write this very kindly and as someone of your DM’s age and similarly widowed)

How old is your mum - 60s or 80s, as it’s not clear. Either way you need more time on your own but I’d approach it differently. 60s needs some tough love. She needs to make friends and a life for herself in the area she’s in, but won’t feel the need if you’re constantly there for her. I’d suggest cutting the weekends down to every other week tbh. She needs time to look for other forms of social connection.

80s is a bit different depending on health needs. I’d look at things she can do and see if I could accompany her in the first instance so she gets comfortable and gradually remove yourself. I also think that you should cut weekends down to late Saturday though to Sunday lunch or Friday through to Saturday afternoon latest. You need at least one day a week for you and partner.

speaking as a 60 year old with adult children

You and your partner have the patience of saints. Every weekend Friday-Monday? That’s incredibly generous of you both.

Sje should be taking the initiative and step back herself but it sounds like she’s got other ideas. Friday - Morning once a month would be much more reasonable.

I think you have two separate issues here - frustration sometimes with things your mum says, and separately, how much time she spends with you.

I think it’s important to separate them in your own head. It’s ok to get annoyed by stuff she says and does - that’s normal!

Even if your mum was the most perfect fun company in the world, her spending that much time with you isn’t ideal for you, or her, or your marriage.

You say that you worry about her being on her own on a Friday night. That’s really the heart of it, you are placing limitless demands on yourself. You will never meet your own expectations. You can’t fix the situation she finds herself in. You need to get comfortable with that.

If this carries on, you will start resenting her. It’s already started a bit. That resentment will hurt your relationship in the long run. It won’t be good for either of you.

In terms of practical strategies, I would try to start to drop a bit here and there, on an ad hoc basis, to get yourself comfortable with knowing it’s okay for her to be on her own.

Encouraging her to do stuff on her own clearly isn’t working. So I think @HidingFromDD ‘s suggestion of accompanying her to stuff is a good one. Think about her interests and find out what there is in the area and just take her. And don’t expect her to love it at first. It may be a slow burn.

My Grandad was the same after my Nan died, my mum used to call every day on her way home from work & on a Saturday morning her & my Dad went & cleaned then brought him home for dinner & tea, then on a Sunday they picked him up mid morning & took home home after tea. It got to the stage that our home didn't feel like home, Grandad dictated which chair he sat in, had full control of the television, he would either turn over or turn it off even if we were watching something, we had to sit in silence if the news was on. I used to escape to the pub just to keep out of the way, I practically spent the whole weekend there. My Dad got so fed up that he told my Mum he was leaving as he felt like he no longer had a home, he was working all week & had no time to relax at weekends due to my Grandad, had he gone, I would have gone with him. In the end he only came for Saturday dinnertime & was taken home mid afternoon.

I think you are doing far too much and, whilst we'll intentioned, you are actually stopping her from helping herself in the longer term. I'd also be concerned about the impact of her dependence and how this could impact your dh, he must feel caught between a rock and a hard place and I'm not sure you're being fair expecting to him to accommodate her on all his time off in the week. I'd start gently scaling back and being more 'busy' yourself with other commitments, gently nudging her to make her own life. You're very kind but it sounds like it's at a cost to you now.

I’ve already replied but wanted to add, I think she’s being selfish, because it’s really not fair on you DP to have to be at work all week and share his house and down time on a weekend with your mam - Every weekend.

You feel bad as you don’t want her to feel lonely, but she’s more than happy to take advantage of the situation because it suits her. Most mothers would (I imagine) acknowledge that it’s not fair on their adult DC to expect them to entertain them all weekend etc and would decline the offer (it’s hardly going to do anyone’s marriage any favours…)

Good luck

Goodness, that's a huge amount you're doing. At about this point after mine was widowed I moved five hours away and only saw her a handful of times a year!

I'm not suggesting you go to this extreme(!) but having her to stay every weekend AND seeing her in the week seems excessive (or is she very elderly and struggling to do shopping etc?). When do you do things you want to do, on your own or with your husband? It strikes me that neither of you have any free time when you're not working or got your mum there! What do you do about going on holiday?

I'd start by gently reducing the weekends down to once or twice a month. Maybe have a weekend away, or invite friends over, or go on a mad DIY spree or something to start it off?

And I wouldn't tolerate negative comments about your ways of doing things or your DH. That's when I drew the mine with my DM after I caught her making awful negative comments about my amazing DH.

It will be hard, it's easier for her to come to you but you're actually helping her to have more company, mix with more people and therefore access a wider range of support.

I have a similar situation and I really feel for you.

Mum definitely micromanaged Dad. Constant little corrections, he used to pretend not to hear her and let her chatter away.

Since Dad has gone she is constantly correcting my children, my DH and I. It’s really hard. Constantly micromanaging how we sit, how we eat the list goes on.

I think it’s a form of anxiety and driven by a lack of control. All I can do is offer sympathy and support. 💐💐

Been there, done that with the weekends and if I could do it all again I wouldn't. The weekends she spends with you is time where she's not out entertaining herself, making a new social network, doing her own thing. She's living your life. not hers. It seems the kindest thing to do but in the long term it isn't. If she spends the weekend bored rigid then that's her choice, she could have gone to the library, a book group, garden centre. Perhaps a dose of boredom might encourage her to get out and find something that interests her.

The longer it goes on for, the harder it is to stop. Do you want to be doing this in twenty years? (I did, don't be me) Mum had done everything with Dad and was unwilling or unable to do anything by herself. I made a list of dozens of groups that met locally to her. offered to take her to a few meetings but no, all she wanted was me. I wish that I'd been less obliging at the beginning and put my needs above hers. It would have been harder for both of us in the short term but better for both of us in the long term.

Not sure how I reply to everyone individually so I’ll do it here. Thank you so much for taking the time to write and give your advice. I’m a bit nervous today as she’s in later tonight. After taking in all your advice I’ve decided to have a conversation I don’t want to have. However, it’s something myself and my DH need for our relationship. It’s not fair on my partner and remarks like she has been giving seems too much familiarity is becoming toxic for our relationship as a mum and daughter and myself and my partners. I’ve been enabling her to be dependant on us, and that’s my fault so I feel bad for that. I also relate to your own experiences and will learn from that too. I just hope I’m not going to receive a bad reaction from her, but inevitably it’s a conversation I need to have. We’re going to initially scale back to the Saturday afternoon to Sunday evening now the daylight is getting longer, then every other weekend after a few weeks. Fingers crossed this goes ok!! I do feel it shouldn’t be met with her storming off as many of you say, it should really be something she should be suggesting to us x

I'm assuming she is living independently? If so, she is spending far too much time at yours. It is your house. Your DM does not call the shots or dictate which way around the toilet roll sits.

Please put in boundaries about what you are prepared to offer her in terms of your time because this situation will only get worse as she ages.

If she complains that she is lonely but does nothing to help herself (even with suggestions and prompts from you) that's tough and it is not your problem to solve. You are really going to have to harden your heart a bit otherwise she will run you ragged.

Elderly parents = marathon not a sprint

I don't know how your partner puts up with this? Every weekend your mother is staying in your house with both of you. That's a huge imposition.

I agree with this, she is starting to treat your home as an extension of her own.

Good luck OP!

How old is she? And how fit and able to do things for herself? You said she's still driving so presumably reasonably independent.

Okay, so we took the brave step and it was my partner in fact that brought it up to her, which wasn't quite planned like that, but I was in the bathroom, so the conversation had been all sorted by the time I was back in the room! My partner was trying to save me having to feel all this guilt as I said to her about the scale back. I think to be honest, she seemed to take it a lot better because it was my partner who said that I needed a bit of downtime at the weekend, as I'm getting a bit frazzled with work and need to have some time out. She agreed, and even though my partner said to scale it back to one night stay instead of three, she suggested to come over on Sunday this week and then go home after dinner. I couldn't quite believe it. I don't think she'll do it every week to start with, but I'll take that step once she's got used to this. I live in hope she decides she has had enough of staying in and not wanting to do anything but clean, and go and find a social group or class, as it'll be good for her well being and independence. I expect a little mention here and there about being 'bored stiff' or 'i can't go round aimlessly around the shops on my own' or 'I enjoy gogglebox better when I'm with you because it's not as nice with laughing with you' - that's a heart tugger tbh (it's on on a friday!) I will continue seeing her in the week to have an outing if she wishes, and I will have to stop myself from this guilt I have over her being on her own. I've realised I am enabling her. I have plans to scale the one night stay at the weekend to coming over for dinner for a few hours on the weekend, but it's a step forward.

Although my partner has always been welcoming to her, when she was absolutely fine with it, I think he thought why have we not done this before.

It sounds awful, but after she left my partner literally threw his arms up in the air and shouted 'freedom'! It must of been really awkward for him due to it being my mum and not wanting to sound like he didn't like her.

Tough love and all that. I have hope she will carve out some independence through this extra time, and reflect and go out to clubs, learn a new hobby, etc.

Once again, thank you so much for your kind words and advice, it is very much appreciated
xx

I have hope she will carve out some independence through this extra time, and reflect and go out to clubs, learn a new hobby, etc.

She won't though, if she never did it before....

Your husband sounds like a saint.

Wishing you all the best OP. Aging parents are so hard to deal with....

My MIL won’t join any coffee mornings, the WI, etc etc. she says they’re ‘full of old people’ and even though she’s in her 80’s, she’s ‘with it’, therefore she wouldn’t enjoy their company, hence she’ll only do things with her adult children.
I just tend to stick to my normal routine and remind her there’s lots of things to do in her local area if she just got out and did them……….

Well done on making the changes. I notice you mentioned gogglebox is on a Friday .. if she doesn’t already have a smart TV it could be worth her getting one, then she won’t be tied to tv schedules and will have access to lots of films etc…. may even become an avid Tik Tok viewer!

Well done, sounds like progress. Don't relent though and go back to how it was, for the sake of your marriage you need time for you and your (extremely kind!) dh. Good luck to you x

Make it a routine to watch Gogglebox after lunch on a Sunday.
Well done OP, you are still doing a great deal having her on Sunday and seeing her on Wednesday afternoons. You are an exceptional daughter.