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Elderly parents

So bloody exhausted waiting for someone to die 3

1000 replies

StiffyByngsDogBartholomew · 26/03/2024 10:46

Carrying on from our first two threads..
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/elderly_parents/4967638-so-bloody-exhausted-waiting-for-someone-to-die-2

OP posts:
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10
HoraceGoesBonkers · 21/08/2024 13:00

I ended up cracking a few days ago and replied to a message from DM about Dad's medication saying it would be better to stop treatment as he wouldn't want to go on like this.

Cue a big message back saying she wouldn't discuss it by text, asking me why I didn't like her and why I'd blocked her, and demanding I support her.

I'm afraid I had a bit of a go when I replied. I've had years of this, and during the last few months when I've reduced contact she's contacted me at work over a work project then escalated this into demanding we go and visit, randomly turned up at my house unannounced and shoved stuff through the door, and now got in touch when she knew we were away (which is why I'd blocked her - she's got considerable form for having a drama when it's someone else's birthday, holiday, illness etc etc).

Dad being terminally ill has been awful as it gets weaponised continually, if you don't want to deal with her you are being "uncaring" towards Dad.

I'm going to phone her tonight which I'm not looking forward to. But Im going to reiterate she needs outside support and counselling, I'm burned out.

When I did go and visit a lot more she wasn't happy either and was nasty about me behind my back.

TheShellBeach · 21/08/2024 13:44

That sounds very stressful, @HoraceGoesBonkers

I haven't got any brilliant advice, but lots of solidarity.

Donenow1 · 25/08/2024 10:18

I used to do care in the community and tbh have seen whole families brought to their knees by one elderly person. And the lies they tell, oh my, the utter lies. I know two older ladies, both nursed their husband's for years. Both husband's now dead, the bereaved wives, quite frankly, have blossomed and bloomed and the mantle of stress has been lifted from them.
Returning briefly to what I said about the elderly lying. My friend's Mother, at home with Alzheimers was a very very plausible liar with regard to her capabilities and was quite capable of keeping a facade of normality with NHS staff, even hiding any disablement aids away when visitors came. Some of you may think this abusive BUT now I would advise that if the lying is bad then you covertly film them on your phone to give a true and correct picture to the Doctor. My friend's Mother is now luckily in a Nursing Home.

HoraceGoesBonkers · 26/08/2024 07:36

Thanks @TheShellBeach We;ve agreed to just communicate about Dad although there was lots of pushing to "talk things over" and "we are family and must work together". This, translated, means I need to do what I'm told.

Of course all of her awful behaviour could be explained away. I hadn't bothered trying to sort things out before as no matter how outrageously she's behaved she's never sorry and there's always some reason.

I did feel very relieved at first but the day after I spoke to her she tried to video call me. I think she'll have been trying to spring Dad speaking to me which I've asked her repeatedly not to do because I'll pick up the phone in case somethings happened then he'll mumble incoherently for a second or two and it really is very hard to understand him unless I'm in a quiet place. Any boundary I try to put in place must be attacked.

I've ended up posting on Stately Homes as I think a lot of this is more about toxic parents than elderly parents...

Some of the stuff she said was so twisted and untrue I did wonder if she might have dementia. But she's been like this for a long time. Also, the GP is sometimes the focus of her behaviour (she will turn up at the office and try and doorstep him) so he's well aware of what she's like.

Tara336 · 26/08/2024 09:47

@Donenow1 videoing is good advice as my DF was extremely abusive and violent towards us and I didn't realise DB was actually filming it. Although DF behaved menacingly towards anyone who entered the house from SS, carers and GP no one had seen how he was treating us and it was helpful to be able to show it. It also helped to re watch during moments of doubt when we visited him in the care home and he was behaving calmly. DF was a bully before dementia and made our lives hell I'm not sure any of us will fully recover from our treatment at his hands. But although DM is lonely in some ways she is a lot happier and having the time of her life doing the things she wasn't allowed to do when DF is at home.

TheShellBeach · 26/08/2024 11:49

How is your dad now, @Tara336?

And how's your mum doing, @SierraSapphire? Did they discharge her in the end?

SierraSapphire · 26/08/2024 13:09

Aw, thanks for remembering and asking @TheShellBeach - so they discharged her from hospital, in what I considered was an unsafe discharge - they sent her home alone in a taxi at 7pm on the Thursday when I had already told them I was not going to be there, although in the end she coped okay. She then pressed her lifeline at 4am on Sunday morning and they called an ambulance for her, and she died of something completely unrelated to any of the more recent issues just under 24 hours later, just over a week ago. I saw her the day after she was discharged, and DD and I spent all day with her at hospital last Sunday. The surgeon was lovely and said he would talk to us about operating, though he was clearly trying to dissuade us, given her condition and the fact that she would be severely disabled afterwards everyone agreed that this was not a good plan, so some common sense there! We didn't quite get there when we got the call just after midnight to come back in, she died much quicker than anyone was expecting after her admission, although obviously in a way that was good.

So there we go, it strikes me there are two ways of waiting for people to die on this thread, one is when they are clearly at the end of life and on a palliative care pathway but they take a long time to actually go, my DF was a bit like this. And the other way is the way of my DM where they nearly die many times over an extended period (5 years in our case) but have period of being okay in between.

I feel okay, I think I am still in shock, but she was 91 and she lived independently at home other than those hospital admissions right till the end which I call a good result really. But honestly, I think it will take a while for my sympathetic nervous system not to be activated all the time. @thesandwich said to me on another thread, the crisis is over now, which made me cry at the time because it has been one crisis after another for five years, and this is what brought it home to me that I no longer needed to live in a state of crisis.

I have very mixed feelings; obviously my mother dying is a loss, but it's also a gain and a complete mental shift that I no longer need to consider in my long or short term plans. I did wonder whether there's a need for a further thread, if one doesn't exist, for people who are graduating from this one to get our heads around what can be a huge change!

Hope everyone is doing okay, you think it's never going to be over, but then one day it is. I discovered after DM had died that DD had made some recordings of her talking about her life, this is one thing I regret that I could've also done. I also sort of regret lots of other things, when I was annoyed or impatient or said no, but I'm not super human and my needs are also important and I did the best that I possibly could in the situation in which I was in.

Donenow1 · 26/08/2024 13:13

Tara336 · 26/08/2024 09:47

@Donenow1 videoing is good advice as my DF was extremely abusive and violent towards us and I didn't realise DB was actually filming it. Although DF behaved menacingly towards anyone who entered the house from SS, carers and GP no one had seen how he was treating us and it was helpful to be able to show it. It also helped to re watch during moments of doubt when we visited him in the care home and he was behaving calmly. DF was a bully before dementia and made our lives hell I'm not sure any of us will fully recover from our treatment at his hands. But although DM is lonely in some ways she is a lot happier and having the time of her life doing the things she wasn't allowed to do when DF is at home.

I'm so pleased Tara that DM is at last having a bit of life back. Tbh I dread to think how many elderly spouses and children are living like you were. What I will say is that whilst in a Care Home environment they may appear calm it really is only a matter of time before the facade slips. I've seen violence and horribly racist comments to Carers. I might also advise that should DF ever ask to return to the family home for a day out, even if DM would possibly cave to that idea, I would utterly block and prevent any attempt of that. Quite frankly in your situation it's far too risky for you all. Unfortunately if violence comes with Dementia things can escalate and get dangerous very very quickly.

TheShellBeach · 26/08/2024 13:25

@SierraSapphire I'm very sorry to hear that your mother has died.

You're right, I think, about a "graduates" thread. There are a lot of women on this one, and the previous ones, who would benefit from further support.

Flowers
Tara336 · 26/08/2024 15:00

@Donenow1 we have all agreed to not let him home, we do take him out but only local to the home and he has stopped asking to come home with us thankfully. He was complaining about other residents in the MH unit hurting him, but when the staff paid close attention found DF was actually starting the trouble and the other residents were retaliating. We Are not safe around d him he still has nasty moments towards us but not physical anymore just verbal and shows of temper (thumping fist on table etc). When he was at home, he pinned me in a corner and held a the flame of his lighter to my face, hit SIL with his heavy walking stick, used it to block doors to stop us getting in or out, pushed my DD, hit my mum.. I was protected by the fabulous male SW who finally got us help when DF tried to lunge at me and hit me from across the table. On one occasion we had to lock ourselves in my car as we were scared of his rage and had called for help. It was a year of hell tbh, its hard to visit and not still feel wary of him.

funnelfan · 26/08/2024 15:47

for those wanting another thread for the next stage, @thesandwich started one last year. It’s been quiet since though. www.mumsnet.com/talk/elderly_parents/4827943-calling-fellow-cockroach-cafe-um-graduates-going-through-probate-advice-and-support-thread

thesandwich · 26/08/2024 18:44

@SierraSapphire sending 🌺
Thanks for the thread bump @funnelfan Maybe there’s a need for a beyond the cockroach cafe- moving on thread?

Donenow1 · 26/08/2024 20:38

Tara336 · 26/08/2024 15:00

@Donenow1 we have all agreed to not let him home, we do take him out but only local to the home and he has stopped asking to come home with us thankfully. He was complaining about other residents in the MH unit hurting him, but when the staff paid close attention found DF was actually starting the trouble and the other residents were retaliating. We Are not safe around d him he still has nasty moments towards us but not physical anymore just verbal and shows of temper (thumping fist on table etc). When he was at home, he pinned me in a corner and held a the flame of his lighter to my face, hit SIL with his heavy walking stick, used it to block doors to stop us getting in or out, pushed my DD, hit my mum.. I was protected by the fabulous male SW who finally got us help when DF tried to lunge at me and hit me from across the table. On one occasion we had to lock ourselves in my car as we were scared of his rage and had called for help. It was a year of hell tbh, its hard to visit and not still feel wary of him.

Dear Lady, under these circumstances if you wish to cease visits have no guilt whatsoever, there are some people you have to cut out of your lives like a cancer to save your soul.. I have had to cut out a much older half sister due to her behaviour... her Brother and I are worn by it all. Save yourself and do what is best.... FOR YOU X

Donenow1 · 26/08/2024 20:52

I have to say, when I read all these posts, and the utter desperation and sadness it's heartbreaking, truly heartbreaking... I have two jobs, one in admin, and one where I have returned to what I came from... that of Farmer... I hope that in years to come, when I am infirm, very old and likely to be a problem to my Daughter that nature does the right thing... as I say to my husband... one day a Ram or Bull will come.... and do the right thing...I'd have it no other way..

SierraSapphire · 27/08/2024 06:08

Thanks for the link @funnelfan - I read through all that and it's given me some pointers around probate, I did it for my DF but it will be more complicated for DM because of the house. I wasn't part of the Cockroach Cafe threads @thesandwich - though I did have a complicated relationship with DPs and I did dip into them sometimes, but yes, I was thinking more of a thread about rebuilding our lives after caring for someone for so long, not quite sure where to put it though, is it still elderly parents, it seems broader than that.

Tara336 · 27/08/2024 06:18

@Donenow1 thank you so much. I visit when I feel up to it, maybe once a month maximum other family members visit (a little) more often. DB rarely visits as he was also on the receiving end of a lot of abuse. We have been tokd that DF is nearing the end now, but i dont know what that means in practice, it is weeks or months. I have made a point of having the best year possible this year to make up for lost time as it was mentally and physically exhausting dealing with DF and SS. I'm sorry that you have had to cut contact with your half sister but you are right when you say we have to protect ourselves.

Tara336 · 27/08/2024 06:23

@SierraSapphire it would be a great idea for a thread for rebuilding our lives. SS asked me to complete some questionnaires after DF was sectioned then moved to the care home and one of the things I said was that after the complete chaos you are living through and it suddenly stops (or at least calms down) there is no support for the families everything is about the dementia patient and you find yourself looking back and thinking what just happened? I've been asked to go and speak to SS about it as they are interested in putting something on place but I don't feel like I want to face it all right now

AgitatedGoose · 27/08/2024 15:50

@SierraSapphire First of all condolences about the death of your Mum and hope you’ve got support to get through this. Personally I think you should make a formal complaint about your Mum’s discharge particularly as you’d made it clear to the ward that you weren’t find to be around. I think NHS staff and social workers for that matter are complete and utter chancers will push ahead with an unsafe discharge knowing that if it goes belly up any family are left with no option other than to step in. Whenever that happens they’ll turn it round and say that you made the choice to get involved and totally deny that they forced you into it.

Yes there definitely needs to be a thread for graduates of this one. I still feel stressed although I’ve only partially graduated from here as I still have my elderly step father to manage.

Donenow1 · 28/08/2024 00:27

Tara336 · 27/08/2024 06:23

@SierraSapphire it would be a great idea for a thread for rebuilding our lives. SS asked me to complete some questionnaires after DF was sectioned then moved to the care home and one of the things I said was that after the complete chaos you are living through and it suddenly stops (or at least calms down) there is no support for the families everything is about the dementia patient and you find yourself looking back and thinking what just happened? I've been asked to go and speak to SS about it as they are interested in putting something on place but I don't feel like I want to face it all right now

Tara. If you can love, delay Social Services until you feel calmer... I say this because your input to them might help others.. only a thought. Best wishes

Tara336 · 28/08/2024 08:57

@DoneNow1 I've kept the email request regarding it, no one else in the family wants to attend the meeting as they want to "move on" but SS said what I had told them in a long email was constructive and they were interested in some of the suggestions I put forward. I was hoping that giving them my thoughts would be enough but they seem to want to discuss it further.

When I feel ready I will talk to them but I'm not sure what else they think I can bring to the table

Donenow1 · 29/08/2024 02:12

Tara336 · 28/08/2024 08:57

@DoneNow1 I've kept the email request regarding it, no one else in the family wants to attend the meeting as they want to "move on" but SS said what I had told them in a long email was constructive and they were interested in some of the suggestions I put forward. I was hoping that giving them my thoughts would be enough but they seem to want to discuss it further.

When I feel ready I will talk to them but I'm not sure what else they think I can bring to the table

Only do it when you feel ready but they obviously think your input is valuable, but, ONLY WHEN YOU ARE READY X

AgitatedGoose · 01/09/2024 19:36

Has anyone else stopped telling their elderly parent that they’re going on holiday because they can guarantee a crisis if they do. I’ve had this happen so many times and almost didn’t tell my elderly step father we were going away but felt guilty and caved in. We’re a week into a two week break and my step dad has caused an electrical problem in his house so I’m probably going to have to
spend time phoning round electricians whilst we’re away. I’m so sick of this!

EmotionalBlackmail · 01/09/2024 20:05

I keep any details of any of my time off work deliberately vague so I can't be called on to do anything or have to deal with some crisis.

I've never lied, but I've managed to imply I've only got a day or two off (separate days so I can't possibly go and do something) when it's actually an entire week. Or more! We all know how hard it is to book annual leave these days after all Wink

countrygirl99 · 01/09/2024 20:17

Ove just retired and I'm keeping very quiet about it. I'm even sticking with evening visits even though I could go in the day. But tbh that is partly because mum finds the evenings hard.

funnelfan · 01/09/2024 22:31

Has anyone else stopped telling their elderly parent that they’re going on holiday because they can guarantee a crisis if they do

very timely question @AgitatedGoose as we’ve got a week abroad booked for later this month for the first time since mum got bad and I’ve been debating whether to tell her. Was leaning towards “no”, and just telling the care agency that I’m only to be contacted for matters of life and death.

when we went away for a few days in the U.K. last year DB volunteered to time his visit to stay with her for a couple of days while I was away. On the face of it, good teamwork, but mum seems to have regressed to thinking he’s still a teenager not a middle aged man so I got phone calls saying “you’re brother has gone out and i don’t know where he is” every time he went to the shops or to catch up with old mates. She wouldn’t call him! It was the opposite of peace and quiet and relaxing.

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