My Aunt wants me to take on lasting power of attorney - I don’t want to

[WeekinWeekOut]

She’s 84, lives alone, has no children. She’s mainly in good health but has some blood pressure issues.
I’ve always got on with her ok, but she lives hundreds of miles away and I see her once every couple of years for a day or two. We go for lunches or the theatre and then say goodbye and communicate sporadically for months at a time.
I’ve got 3 teenage kids and a full time job. I’m looking forward to some me time in a few years when I can retire. I don’t want to end up in a position where I’m having to deal with blown over fences or water bills in a house hundreds of miles away, let alone taking on sorting out the intimate care for a woman I consider fundamentally as pleasant but not close. She’s not really asked me - more told me that there is no other option and presented it as a non discussion matter that she has always assumed I knew I would have do. How much work is involved and an I going to spend a lot of time on motorways? Am I blowing this out of proportion? I want to say no but I don’t know how. I feel sick just thinking about it.

@Datafan55 I think this is about relationship building. The elderly people I do quite happily get involved with are not necessarily related to me but are the ones who've taken an interest in me as a child, been a trusted sounding board as a teenager, been interested in university studies and jobs after that. So not about money, although one did lovely things like send a supermarket gift card when I started university or took me out for a meal when they were on holiday in the area or posted me some bulbs when I bought my first house.

It's the same thing I've tried to cultivate with my Godchildren as they head off to university. I'm not there to tell them what to do with their lives but I am interested and I do care.

The OP is too far away.

I know from elderly friends who have had health issues that people are needed to keep an eye on carers, care homes and even hospitals. There is a lot of elderly abuse and neglect that goes on. So people local to the elderly person are needed to keep an eye on them.

Also not every elderly person is willing to make it easy on the person who has POA for them.

Oh yes, it doesn't just come overnight. Although it can be uneven on both sides sometimes and one side can see it one one, the other, another! - eg in this case possibly the aunt has been trying to see more of the OP -
I’ve always got on with her ok, but she lives hundreds of miles away and I see her once every couple of years for a day or two. We go for lunches or the theatre and then say goodbye and communicate sporadically for months at a time.... I like her but she’s never been special to me and up until this last week I wouldn’t have had a problem saying ‘no sorry, not convenient ’ if she’d asked me to come and stay for longer than a night or two if she needed help with something - I’m just not that close to her.
I mean I'm sure it isn't convenient with jobs/kids etc, but the aunt possibly sees her niece as a key family member.

Tough one Op, I don't know what Id do in your position given your life is so full on & you're so far away!

I think i'd accept POA but be clear with her that everything you're doing will be remote and she'll have to pay for practical / physical day to day help if that becomes necessary. I'd also get her to pick a care home now whilst she's fully capable and execute that wish when the time comes. Good luck whatever you decide!

I'd also get her to pick a care home now whilst she's fully capable and execute that wish when the time comes.

If she does that then she'd need to review her choice regularly. The character of care homes can change, and doubtless their costs too.

True @ErrolTheDragon but at least she'll have an idea and so the choice won't be so overwhelming when the time comes.

I’m obviously doing it wrong, then It’s the financial one that takes my time. The health and welfare one just gives me more weight in conversations I’d be having anyway

Me and OH are in the same position - we have no children, only nephews and nieces who all live a fair distance away.

Both of us have been POA for our parents (and I am still going through it ten years on). My mother has dementia and I spent a huge amount of time and effort over ten years dealing with financial institutions, medical staff and carers, and regularly making very hard decisions.

For that reason, me and OH decided against asking our nieces/nephews to take on the role of attorney. We feel it is not fair on them to put them through it, and have appointed our solicitor as financial POA.

But again, none of what you've said they do comes under the responsibilities of POA.

The attorney is in the position to make decisions on the behalf of someone who can't. That's basically all the job of an attorney involves. Signing things to give permission where the infirm person cannot. Anything else, anything involving carrying out researching or visiting is just something that a relative might feel they should do. It's nothing to do with POA. Any relative or friends can do that stuff (or choose not to) the sole thing that only the attorney can do is give permission for something to happen, or to handle the person's financial affairs.

As a pp said, if the attorney is a random solicitor, they're not going to be doing any of those caring roles or visiting nursing homes to choose one, or to ensure that the person isn't being abused .

Seriously, it's quite disturbing that so many people don't understand what an LPA is.

Seriously, it's quite disturbing that so many people don't understand what an LPA is. There was a report recently claiming a high proportion (might have been as high as a third) of attorneys were using money inappropriately, while still believing they were acting under the terms of the LPA.

Couldn't the aunt move nearer to her niece? I used to work for a solicitors that did POA and though certain people did them for their parents, a lot didn't (we didn't have the work I expected them to have) and though I knew a bit about them, I didn't really know how onerous they were.

I'm surprised it's only a third, to be honest.

Are you actually POA for someone in a care /nursing home ..
Be I can assure you ,they do not buy any toiletries,..I have been expected to take her to dentist, opticians and hospital
The home loose her clothes and I'm constantly buying socks tops nightys.
Plus her weight has fluctuations and again I get phone calls saying she needs new clothes .
She had lost capacity,so I had to choose the homes ,and move her when not suitable,and by not suitable i mean ,refusing to call the doctor, refusing to allow her water tablets to stop her legs swelling incase she wet herself.
I've spent hours on the phone with consultants,I've been expected to be in the care home for doctors visits I ve had to argue with the home and mental health team who put her on such strong medication it made her bladder and bowel just empty throughout the day randomly,and such strong medication she was so confused she was eating face cream..,when I insisted they can't leave her on the medication because she was having falls and her face was black and blue ,i got told to move her somewhere else if i didn't like how they were doing things .so that was the second move ,just to get her of the dreadful medication,that they put her on to keep her calm and make her easier to manage ...never mind if shes wetting herself ,pooing her pants ,falling and hitting her head numerous times ,,as song as she is easier to manage thats all the care home cared about.
I've had to organise and pay for her funeral in advance and attend meetings with social services and fill in tons of paper work when her money ran out to pay the home ,and I had to fill in paperwork and submit bank statements,that the bank refused to give me ,to try to get the council to take over paying for her care ,, council decision was to move her to another home ,so 4 homes in 3 years ,and I would yet again be expected to move all her possessions and her .
Seriously, unless you have been in this situation of POA ,when the person has lost capacity and there is no one else to help ,you have no idea of what is expected of you

Ok
But the care home assume that the POA will be involved and taking them to appointments , because if the home isn't doing it ,who is ..
Seriously this is a frustrating thread .
All 4 homes ,have assumed I am responsible for everything..
And try telling them at 8 o'clock at night when they phone you again ,to say she's fallen ,or she needs you to send in different slippers ,or the doctor is coming in the morning and they want you there
Only a hard hearted bitch would be able to keep saying,sorry I'm not responsible for that ,I'm POA ,and it doesn't involve xyz..

Yes, I have POA for elderly relative in a nursing home. And, yes, the home buys all toiletries, do all the organising and taking to appointments etc. SW appointments etc (six monthly) by phone or Zoom.

I was very very clear when I took it on that I was there to make decisions, not to actually do things. I can't! This isn't a close relative - they're someone I saw maybe every other year or so for most of my life. And as well as being distant in terms of relationship, they are physically a very very long way from where I live so I can't just drop in with toiletries or clothes. As well as a young child and demanding FT job I have three other POAs which aren't activated yet but that's another reason I can't get over involved with this relative.

It's probably easier for me as if the home 'assumed' I was doing this stuff, they'd quickly find that it didn't happen! It's easier for the home for a relative to do things but yes carers can take to appointments (they charge for this). There are people in homes with no relatives at all and a solicitor doing the POA and I very much doubt the solicitor is running around buying toiletries or dropping clothes off.

Id suggest pushing back if you don't want to do all this and tell the home they'll have to organise it and you'll be visiting on x date.

I wasn't able or given chance to be clear I wasn't doing things .
I've had the current home telling me xzy is my responsibility because I'm POA .I've had to fill in ,all about me books ,with all information about likes and dislikes , despite me not seeing this person for 20 plus years .
I've had a nightmare with her bank ,.. trying to pay thousands to a care home in cash , because they wouldn't let me do transfer in branch , because they wanted confirmation from the solicitors that the POA paperwork I had in my hands at the time was authentic..
The gas , electric and water wanted it in writing to shut down the account..BT was a nightmare..I had to clear out her entire house..the solicitor did nothing to help ,.she went in to hospital,and never went home ,I had with a 8 hour round journey to clear her house and get it sold and move her to a rest home .
Well I'm glad not everyone has had it as difficult as me ,but my advice to anyone considering POA is don't do it

This is really difficult as if she doesn't have a POA, then all transactions have to go via the Court of Protection at significant costs, and importantly time.

I have POA and has not yet been utilised but if it ever does, I know it involves significant work. In essence it enables you to run all their transactional life, ie bills, bank etc. However, if someone is in need of it being activated, they are also prob not able to live independently. It is a useful tool if you live near, their mobility is limited and enables you to do things on their behalf. This isn't your situation.

Practically it prob isn't going to work unless she was moving into a home. You could accept it but be clear you will only act is certain circumstances. I assume she has no other familiy.

I think @Springcat people need to take on POA with their eyes open. I was careful that relative had dealt with house first before they went into a home. I wouldn't have done house clearance or house sale at that distance.

But mine has moved home once and been transported by the first home. Again,
not everyone has a relative to move
them.

Homes are short staffed and will
Try to get relatives doing as much as possible but do push back and explain to them what POA actually involves. What would they do if you had flu, broken leg, car out of action?

I have PoA for my father. I visit at least weekly, but the home takes him to appointments. Until recently it bought toiletries, and still does if I forget (I’ve taken in one lot) - I just get an extra item on the monthly bill. Really, the PoA has caused me very little work.

Financial PoA is more work, because I’m actively managing his savings to make them last as long as possible.

I don’t think I’d be happy to do it for someone I didn’t know well. It’d be that that would concern me more than distance

@Springcat

if you didn’t exist, and your relative had appointed a solicitor to take POA for her, do you think they would be doing all the things that you are doing?

who would take her to appointments?
who would buy her toiletries?
who would buy her new clothes?

the home would. And present the bill to the solicitor, who would pay it because this is what having the POA allows them to do.

i think you are confusing the caring role that you have chosen to take on with the legal obligations of having POA. Homes are very short staffed and will always try and push tasks onto relatives. But you can choose to say no.

I;d be okay to do that for a childless aunt, on the assumption that any assets are being left to me/my sibling (and not some friend)

If i need it done - as a childless person - i'd ensure that person is recognised in my will to cover their time/effort - whether a % or a fixed amount of cash. (same as i'd do if i included an executor who wasn't getting my estate )

@rickyrickygrimes this thread is crazy. So much confusion re: LPA.

@rickyrickygrimes I agree. An LPA does not have to do any 'caring', just a lot of time consuming admin and decision making.

I have LPA for my mother who has been in a care home for 7 years and have never taken her to an appointment - all the healthcare professionals visit the care home anyway, I can't think of any appointments she needed to go to. But she has had several visits to A&E after having falls and I did not go with her, I simply never offered. One of the carers accompanied her and I arrived later as a visitor. The medics do want to speak to you (whether as attorney or nearest relative) but if you can't attend they can do that over the phone.

For those saying they would act as attorney if they were left something in the Will as compensation - good luck with that, any money my mother Willed me was long ago swallowed up in care costs.