I want to throw in the towel please help

[LeeMucklowesCurtains]

I’m sorry if this is disjointed and makes no sense.

My dad has been in a care home since December last year, vascular dementia.

The place he’s in is £1200 a week. He’s got a flat to sell that’s on the market for 125 and about 40k in savings.

He moved to the home hes in a couple of months ago, he was in another home at first that the local authority put him into after the hospital admission where he was finally diagnosed with dementia after I had to put up a fight (he was quite far gone, but despite that, medical professionals kept telling me he was fine).

That home was awful, they were shut for a month due to covid so we couldn’t see him. When we did, he had lost stones in weight, he was covered in sores and bruises.

We found somewhere better and he’s gained all the weight back there and is doing better.

We were trying to set up deferred payment, I don’t know what happened but things have been lost in translation with the finance side and they called sent me an invoice for the 12,000 he owes since being there and said they would start legal proceedings if it wasn’t paid.

I managed to sort that out and we are speaking to them again trying to set up deferred payment (I took my eye off the ball as I’ve been going through cancer investigations) but I’m so confused going forward.

Going with the care home as it’s interest free for deferred payment rather than the council.

His flat has been on the market 6 weeks, I’m terrified something will go wrong and it won’t sell. The market here is awful.

When I was speaking to them today I was asking about worst case - he doesn’t get the money etc.

Apparently I signed a form as guarantor. I can’t remember what I signed, it was the day before a scan I was having and I was terrified and my dad was sat in the room screaming and hallucinating and I just wanted him moved in there and out of the place that had neglected him.

My husband has hit the roof over that, what if something went wrong and we lost the little we do have because of my dad.

We’ve only just managed to buy our first house in our 40s with a massive struggle, we don’t have a pot to piss in to be frank, what if they came after me for money?

I’m so stressed that honestly, at this moment i just want to revoke the power of attorney, call adult social care and make it their problem. They can move him where they like, sell his house and keep all his money, I can’t do this anymore.

I don’t know what I am doing, I am so sick and it’s all just me, no one will explain anything or help me. Everyone just wants things from me all the time.9

I’ve not even done anything about stuff like his council tax, I don’t know how to sign his shit old car over to me. I need to keep it as it’s all he talks about all the tim and if he didn’t see it on my drive once a week when he comes here, it would cause him so much distress.

He only completed on his flat in December. The sale of his last place and buying this flat near me took almost a year because of the other people in the chain messing around - he was showing no signs of dementia when he was first moving here, he deteriorated so fast. so land registry isn’t even in his name yet which is what caused the problems with the care home and the deferred payment - they didn’t believe it was his to sell. I’ve sent them relevant paperwork.

Everything is such a huge mess and I don’t know what to do. I can’t cope with it all and seeing him like this.

I’ve spoken to three solicitors who have all told me different things too.

And age U.K. which is who everyone recommends to talk to we’re all but useless and told me something different to everyone else too.

Oh my love, it sounds like a nightmare situation for you. First of all, you need to stop visiting your father every day. Whether you go or not will make very little difference to his behaviour. The vascular dementia is the cause. You need to put your energies into sorting out the financial issues.
Firstly, has your father had a DOL assessment via the LA? if he is being held in the home against his will because he’s not safe, this should be done urgently. Contact the a]care home and ask them, if they don’t know, contact adult social services.
Secondly, if your father has been assessed as needing full time residential care, and he is not currently able to pay for the home he is now in, he will not just be thrown out and sent to live with you. He will be placed in somewhere where the LA will have to pay for his place. Again, you need to speak to social care about this.
when you say you applied for POA, was this before he was diagnosed? If not, I’m afraid it may not be granted. And I know from experience that if it isn’t, the banks may not engage with you. Nor will the house be able to be sold if he’s not able to have capacity. Once again, speak to Social care about how to apply to the Court of Protection for urgent guardianship.

My Mum's care home is £1200 a week - not an unusual amount where she is.

I agree with Blankets - it's not up to you or your DH to manage his behaviour. They should be requesting specialist help if they can't manage him. Honestly I would let the care home know that as of next week you will be calling in for 30 mins 3 times a week. And that you expect them to request referral for specialist assessment and treatment

Rereading I see you are going with the homes deferred payment service, can the social worker help you with that?

I also think you should both stop visiting for a while as firstly it might allow your Dad to settle easier and secondly it sounds like you and DH need a break and some headspace to focus on the practicalities. Any good care home would support you in this with regular updates for reassurance.

Put your own life jacket on first.

OP have you got your POA certificate back from Office of the Public Guardian?
If you have, make an appointment with a branch of your Dad 's bank and take the POA paperwork in with you, they should sort it out for you right away.
Sorn your Dad's car and leave it on your drive so he can see it when he visits, try to ignore him going on about buying a new one, just say something like, "we'll have to look into that", to pacify him.
I'm sure his flat will sell soon but ask the Estate Agent why they think it isn't selling very quickly, you might need to drop the price.
Is the Financial Office in the care home? You need to physically go in and explain to them about the situation, that you are waiting for his bank to release his money and his flat to sell but they will be paid immediately that happens. If the Office isn't in the home, speak to the Manager and they should be able to help.
They just need to know that you will be paying them as soon as you're able to.

Lots of good advice here but just wanted to add that you are definitely not stupid - you are buckling under the weight of your own life, personal and financial concerns and your DF's best interests. Throw in financial insecurity and anyone would be overwhelmed.

I suggest you spend your DF's savings on the current bills - £40k will cover him for over 30 weeks and buy you time to breathe. In the end what you can do for DF will be limited by circumstances beyond your control so be kind to yourself. You are doing your best. If you have to move him out of the current home in order to remove yourself as guarantor so be it. It might be a good idea to look for alternatives now in case that should happen.

So sorry you are going though this. Its sounds like a nightmare.

I have no practical advice OP but I just wanted to say how sorry I am that you're going through this. You and your husband sound amazing.

Can you get yourself removed as guarantor. And get him moved to a cheaper care home?

I have the POA paperwork.

I went to HSBC with it. They don’t deal with it in branch. We had to send all documents to an email address. They are dealing with it, infuriatingly slowly.

Flat isn’t selling as quite frankly, we live in a shithole. No one really moves into the area and locals are priced out. My dads flat is lovely, 5 years old, show home decorated. But it was on the market for 10 months before he took it as there are not many takers here. There are two identical flats in the block that have been on the market, both with different agents for 6 months.

If i’d known things would have turned out like this, he would never have bought it.

All the care homes here seem to be 1,200 a week.

The one he was put in by the council, it was dire, mostly funded people but if he wanted to stay there self funding it was still 1,200.

If I move him again I think it would deteriorate him further. He thinks he’s in prison - genuinely. This home are great.

Its just the finance people, based elsewhere.

Yes, he’s been assesed. He needs 24 care. He’s been deemed to lack capacity.

POA was applied for before he was diagnosed, that’s all fine.

I am selling the house on his behalf with the POA, that’s all sorted and everyone is happy, solicitor etc. They are happy with the completion statement as land registry not updated yet.

I fear you are going to have to be very organised, have folders, follow things up, chase, Email, reminders. On all these different things.

I did this re ds1, years ago. I chased emailed phoned 8 or so different routes/depts/organisations at the same time.

No - the care home are great.

I mean if we don’t visit everyday, when we do see him it’s unmanageable for US. He gets worse.

They are really good with him there. He’s always been a very difficult person, the dementia has just magnified it.

If your solicitor has agreed to your selling his home, you have the poa approved then the bank need to release the funds. I would keep trying the bank head office complaints dept or get your solicitor to on your behalf. The bill needs paying if you have proof. I would suggest the home manager sends the bill and requests directly to your solicitor. Failing that go to your local MP and newspaper. The bank are earning interest on his money.

The solicitor is only dealing with the house sale. Not with anything else.

It’s just bog standard solicitor through the estate agent who will deal with the sale. They won’t do anything else and I can’t afford to pay one to do anything else.

I made a complaint to the bank last friday. Will chase it up tomorrow.

I know but the poa is onviously ok if the solicitor is happy and if it sells the money from the house sale will need to go somewhere and the bank have frozen his account. Have you asked the solicitor if they can help, you are being threatened with legal action if the bill is not paid and it wont be paid until the bank release rhe funds. You dont want to end up paying legal costs or getring into financial difficulties, your solicitor may be able to be the liason between the carehome and the bank,

Sorry if I have missed something.

As you have the POA you can release his savings. HSBC should be taking days/weeks to do this. Of all the big Uk banks I visited only one took 1 week. The rest was done there and then right in front of me.

With regard to the car. Have you put its registration on WeBuyAnyCar or similar. They will take it off your hands. My Father actually stopped driving himself. He had an old banger but it didnt stop him pestering the life out of people to try and get a 'good' price. Friends, relatives etc were called for a good few months. In the end my sister stepped in and it was sold for £400. He went on about that for months and months.

Its really this boundary thing. You need to do what is good for YOU. Otherwise you will be run ragged!

I know he might be upset to not see it but he is never going to drive it again and he might not even realise its gone. Even if he does you are only putting it off regarding selling it.

Might be worth contacting your local MP. They will often advocate for their constituents and there is usually a shorter turnaround for replies from public bodies - like Councils.
Would also agree that it's not your responsibility to manage your Dads behaviour in the home. That's what he's paying £1200 a week for. It might even be the case that your visits are unsettling for him. My MIL is in a care home with dementia and we visit maybe once a week or less and keep it short or else she gets agitated about leaving and wants to know when she's going home. She's happier and more settled when we visit less. I would also reconsider the wisdom of having him in your home if he starts fires. Plus it's probably not helping his agitation.
Vascular dementia goes in step changes and to be honest, he may be less combative once he's less aware of the dementia but it's very unpredictable.

HSBC poa policy
it would seem the bank are not following their own policy. Could you print this off and take it into the bank and show them?

I'm so sorry this is such a struggle.

Is it option to sell the flat to a fast sale company? They buy hard-to-sell property, typically giving about 60% of sale value. But they can complete in two or three weeks if necessary and pay all fees. I don't know if that would cover your commitments, but it would get that problem off your back.

There are lots of dodgy companies, but when I had a property I wanted to be rid of which wouldn't sell on the open market, I used one called Quick Move Now who were OK.

It will be a long time before the flat sells.
The bank will be sorted before that.

There is only one account too, all his money is in his current account.

Dh is going there tomorrow lunchtime.

The form it brings up is the form they kept arguing with him about it being the wrong one.

If your father needs nursing care as well as standard care you don’t have to pay at all your council should foot the bill.

It’s his behaviour with us when we see him, not with them.

If we don’t see him it’s worse when we do.

When he comes to visit here, it’s manageable. He stated a fire in the middle of the night when neither of us could stay up any longer to supervise.

He comes for a few hours on a sunday and sits on the sofa, that’s actually fine.

He doesn’t need nursing care. He can feed himself, he’s not incontinent (has the odd accident maybe once a week as he had colon cancer, but that’s been going on for years).

Just needs supervision, help with washing and dressing.