Caring for elderly relatives? Pop in for support, a hand hold, advice, whatever you need.

[picklemepopcorn]

Carrying on from previous thread, IF I can work out how to link...

Come and offload your worries and frustration here, and share your experience and hard won wisdom with the rest of us!

I've come on for a small whinge about a dilemma. Dm is a 3 Hour trip away. It would have been DFS bday on Thursday so I planned to go down and stay.
However, she's booked Saturday night in a hotel miles away (aborted plan to meet my brother) and Thursday she may be going out (another long distance trip) with DN. Fine, no need for me to go.

But dn is flaky. If it doesn't happen, DM will be devastated (loudly and dramatically). If I go down, and the trip goes ahead, I'll basically have travelled for just one day (and I have workmen waiting to get into the house).

I wish there was an answer that didn't involve DM having made her plans better!

@picklemepopcorn a nurse came out and said to FIL that they wanted to speak to us alone first, he wasn't impressed! We went in and it went really well, we said what we needed to say, they said they didn't feel he has suicidal tendencies which we told them that on Saturday he had threatened suicide. Basically they are looking at discharge within the next few weeks once a care plan is in place. After the meeting he was quite negative towards us again but we just left.

We've come to the conclusion he will probably kill himself when he is discharged, and really, we are at peace with that, is that awful?

no does that's not awful at all. If we get Dm out of home and she chooses to do that - it's her choice and I respect it. I wont facilitate it beyond making sure she can get to the drugs of her choice, but equally I (probably) wont instigate/facilitate any more trips to hospital/care homes etc. It's so tough, but you, me, everyone on here, we all have lives to lead, people to love, and if someone thinks it's their time then I think we should generally respect that .

pickle that's a tough one - can you apply thumbscrews to the niece and explain the sitch? otherwise, in your place and given existing plans I think I'd make plans for the following week.

Thanks Yolo, and Does I agree with Yolo- not awful. Also, I think he is being very manipulative and will actually be better without you as his audience.

yes what pickle said re being manipulative. I hate being maninpulated, because I am not that way at all it takes me a long time to recognise it - and I think that prob applies to many of us? (that is not to say I am perfect, of course!!)

Huge sympathy and gin to does, yolo, and everyone else.
Pickle, I wouldn’t go but let dn know you will not be going. You can’t do it all.
Still standing after 3 consecutive days of intensive dm care..... Teflon reboot required....I have chocolate...😉😉

I think you need all the chocolate, saabdwich. I am researching Teflon spray guns though. Hang on in there, shortly I will be able to re-coat you all at a moment's notice!

3 days sandwich?? Today's medal is definitely yours!! No ideas how you are doing that !! 🥇

Now that's a marketable idea - Teflon spray booths much like spray tan. It could be a national franchise.

Thank you all! Spray Teflon??? Will that be like fake tanning??? 😮😮😮 sounds genius. No paper knickers required I hope??( not that I have ever indulged!)
You all deserve to share the choc I haven’t eaten yet...( hides wrappers)

Hmm. I admit I hadn't thought about all the practicalities, but I guess there are, ahem, some areas one wouldn't want coated with Teflon so paper underwear might be de rigueur.

We should probably enter the booth fully clothed, and in all necessary outfits. A few extra coatings on our exposed areas won't do any harm! And I'm not wearing paper knickers.

Long time lurker, occasional poster. Wishing I had realised what my MIL's situation could do to my marriage.

Five years of watching her decline while her DC were in complete denial, followed finally by an assessment and diagnosis of mixed dementia. Lots of professionals involved, all of whom agree that refusing all help is part of the illness, and then become complicit in it, so the poor woman is still just as vulnerable as she was before, if not more so as she has now lost capacity.

Now DH is coming out of denial and starting to understand the task before him and he can't cope. MIL needs far more care than 2 of her 3 DC can provide, but won't agree to anything, and they won't force her. DH is self-employed and if he's running round after MIL, he's not working, which worries him. I want to support him, but he won't let me near. He clearly can't cope and apparently now no longer cares whether I stay or go.

I guess something had to give, but I am devastated. I've been sat at work crying all day. Ironic isn't it, that MIL is so determined not to be burden that she has now destroyed us. Before she lost capacity, I was her golden DIL (she never liked my SIL). She would be mortified if she knew what had happened.

I have absolutely no idea where to go from here.

Oh, timeistight, even by the standards of this thread that is very hard to bear. Why won’t he let you near - can he articulate? Amateur diagnosis is a dangerous thing, but do you think he’s depressed? Would he go to counselling?

I see some parallels with our situation. My mother refuses to engage with any of the agencies or organisations which could help her and offloads all her rage and frustration on me. Counselling has helped, because it gives me somewhere to talk freely (although, if I had a choice, I’d rather my mother didn’t behave in a way that leaves me needing counselling, but that doesn’t seem to be an option).

Time, I am so sorry. Could you seek support from a carers organisation? Even just for moral support? Your dh sounds in a bad way.

time that sounds like a really hard situation. I agree - Carers UK is meant to be very good. Can you speak directly to MIL's GP/adult social services etc? Your poor DH sounds ground down, as do you... sometimes just getting some help in place is enough to make it all seem a bit better. Monica agree that not being in a position to not need the counselling would be better!

In other news, DB and SIL are being absolute saints, taking mum out yesterday and today so I havent seen her since Monday. I am trying to catch up with life/domestic stuff/work/my charity but I think I've been running on adrenalin for so long that it's taking me ages to get back up to speed. But I have to, because they will go home on Monday.

timeistight, as you know this is only manageable if it is sustainable.

I have lots of sympathy, and no solutions, but a few tips:

1. If professionals are not helping, the words "carer breakdown" can help. They can be quite happy to leave things to family if that is what the elderly parent suggests, but may focus if they fear family might walk away.

1. Counselling. Many many people on this board have found it useful to sort out their feelings. Its not just the frustrations/stress of the here and now, but your DH will be dealing with grief and long buried feelings about parents and siblings.

1. The relationship has changed. Your husband is parenting his mother. I found Eric Berne's Transactional Analysis, useful. For important transactions he needs to be the parent, which both he and his mother will find difficult. A decade in, and my mother is effectively my naughty toddler, which sounds awful but is essentially me taking her objections on board but then explaining why something (trip to the dentist, shower, coat when raining etc) will still happen. (Sadder still she now accepts this, but often thinks I am her mother or older sister, neither of whom she liked much. DB who chooses not to carry any of the burden, in contrast, is seen as the six yerar old she loved so much.)

1. Be prepared to lay down conditions, that will make the situation sustainable. It will help no one if your DH gives too much of himself.

1. Be ready to spring when there is a crisis. My mum would not have even cleaners or a panic button, and I received no support from my sibling who simply said "she values her independence". (He never visited so was unaware of how much her flat had turned into a filthy hovel.) She had a fall (luckily outside) at which point DB pushed her into signing a POA (but insisted I was it) I dropped everything and moved her into very sheltered housing, which is perfect, and hired carers. Lots and lots of screaming, but a few months later (I had told her it was temporary "until she was better") she was in one of her more lucid moments and thanked me. I also called her bluff one time when she went off on a rant about wanting to move home, and said she could. She immediately backed down. She is quite social and liked having people around.

1. Get as much in place as you can. The important one is POA. At the point when your MiL is capable of a decision but not an informed decision, ie not taking on board the burden she is placing on others, consult the people around you and then make a sensible decison on her behalf, which is in her best interests. Also look at Attendence and carers allowances. The first is important as it can unlock the door to Council tax exemption, and other benefits, and is in effect a proof of her disability. Get someone experienced to help you, as it is painful having to admit/detail all someone's failings. Try your best to get her used to people coming in, even if it is only a cleaner who might be persuaded to do some shopping or even take her to routine doctors appointments. Ask various professionals about alternative accomodation she might look at, or adaptations she might have. (SS should be willing to assess her home for the latter - and do ask, as being known to SS will help inform any future discharge decisions.) Professionals wont be able to recommend places, but can suggest some. Visit them all as they will include the ones they like in the list. And ask everyone who regularly visits a mix of elderly accomodation: priests, plumbers and the like. They may well have a view on whether management are switched on and helpful.

1. Your role is probably to be supportive and sympathetic. I almost went under, but small things like DH and teenage DD baking the cake of my choice ready for when I returned (I was doing a six hour round trip a couple of times a week, often staying overnight) helped a lot. DM had to be my priority so I was very lucky that home became a sanctuary. DH was also useful in occassionally talking to my mother and confirming that she would have to go along with what had been decided for her, as he was better able to keep the conversation dispassionate.

1. I also used her memory loss. I got sick of having a detailed discussion leading to a decision, and then having to start all over again the next day. DM was reluctant to admit her problems. So instead I approached it with a "surely you remember. We discussed this yesterday, you decided you wanted this to happen for this, this and this reason." and allowing her to take pride in her sensible decision. I also wrote down answers to her frequent questions "where has all my money gone", "why am I here" etc. so she did not fret when I was not there.

1. I found Hugh Marriotts "The Selfish Pigs Guide to Caring" really useful in allowing me to acknowledge the big mix of emotions, not all worthy/nice, I was feeling. I did not like Oliver James' "Contented Dementia" nearly as much, finding is too prescriptive, but there were a number of tips in there that I still use. Essentially the best way to get anywhere with someone with dementia, is to keep them calm - even if it means the odd white lie.

Needmore - wise words, thankyou, I think a lot of what you've said will help many others in similar situations (& definitely me!)

Time I don't really have anything to add because you've had some really good advice already, so just offering strong, waterproof (Teflon covered) shoulders & some .

Some really useful ideas there, NeedMoreSleep. Thank you.

Am popping in to see Dad this morning & then I'm going away on my own for 3 nights!

The plan is to refresh, recharge & come back feeling more able to ride the sea of elderly parent waves, rather than be mercilessly thrown around by them! Preens at poetic metaphor this early in the morning.

Wishing everyone as peaceful weekend as possible xxx

Have a lovely weeekend, UnderTheOakTree. That metaphor is very apt!

Wise words from needmoresleep.
Under, that sounds excellent. Have a wonderful time. Love the metaphor!!⭐️⭐️
And big dollops of Teflon to everyone else.

under have a lovely time!

Sounds like a very wise idea under really hope you are able to rest and regroup as you so deserve it.
I've had a strange week of meetings and making arrangements for her funeral. Also visiting Dad who just seems to have given up now. DB continues to be very difficult and we no longer contact each other directly.
We are now heading off for our long awaited family holiday. I have very mixed emotions about it. Everyone has advised us to go ahead and I think they feel it's good timing. It's possible our last family holiday as DS is now 18 and hoping to join the army soon. I don't know how I feel, worried about Dad and scared to be away from all the people that have been talking sense in to my head. Not sure time for thinking is a good idea. Also scared to then go home and face the next part.
Anyway, for now I hope you all get some time to be kind to yourselves over the next few days. Thank you for being there!

Whatever, sounds like a great plan to go. Completely understand your reluctance, and fears but you need this so much.be really kind to yourself, and we are here if you need us.