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Original poster

The age-old private vs state debate

88 replies

mistressploppy · 17/05/2010 20:04

DS is only 7mo but I can't decide about schools for him; here's the low-down....

We live in a pretty posh village and the local school is small and has a very good reputation. Small class sizes (actually mixed age classes, that's how small it is). It's also about 3mins walk from our house. However, the expensive Prep school is also 3mins walk away. DH went to this school. It has a great rep too; it features in those glossy schools inserts you get in Tatler

We can afford the Prep school.

Trouble is, I am a bit of an inverted snob. I went to a big city state school and got good results, went on to uni etc etc. Had a fab time at school. DH - not academic like me - went to posh prep school and even posher boarding school, messed around, got nothing! (But has a fab job now)

I'm worried that if DS goes to a posh school he'll only mix with mega-priviledged kids and won't have a rounded perspective. We're so lucky that we're in the catchement for such a good primary. But should I deny him the chance to go to a school with more opportunities if it's within our grasp?

OP posts:
BelleDameSansMerci · 23/05/2010 07:22

mistressploppy - thank you for starting this thread. I've been stressing about this for some considerable time too. My DD is now nearly 3 and I've been dithering about whether to go private or state. Private would be manageable (actually cheaper than her current nursery fees) but I haven't really seen one that feels right for her. It turns out that our local state Primary School (Ofsted "Outstanding") may well be better all round and I can then save the cash for when she's older.

Anyway, thanks again - this thread has really helped me.

piscesmoon · 23/05/2010 07:31

Your DC is so young that both schools could have changed out of all recognition by the time he is old enough! I would put his name down for both and wait and see which school would suit him best when the time comes.

Clary · 23/05/2010 12:21

ladyinmauve "well known to be appalling" doesn't sound like a very reliable source to me so excuse me for taking that with a large pinch of salt.

I'm no especial apologist for Ofsted but to suggest that only outstanding schools should be considered any good is ludicrous frankly - and would cause problems in my neck of the woods where only about 3 schools out of 40-odd in the city are outstanding!

Where are these local schools that have been rated "very good" anyway? As I said, there is no such rating - it goes outstanding then good then satisfactory.

belledechocolatefluffybunny · 23/05/2010 12:26

Which school was that clary?

belledechocolatefluffybunny · 23/05/2010 12:26

Sorry, which school was put in special measures?

Clary · 23/05/2010 12:32

In Mickleover, Ravensdale Junior story here at end 2008. Should make it clear that school is now out of SM see here

belledechocolatefluffybunny · 23/05/2010 12:37

I don't think Ofsted reports give an accurate reflection of the schools anyway to be honest, they just cause anxiety in the staff. A week spent in a school isn't going to give a true reflection, open day's don't either. It's just a snapshot. Asking parents who have children there doesn't help either, people are biased. It's never easy.

Thankyou for that clary I may have something for you if you are freelancing.

Clary · 23/05/2010 12:38

ooooh what! I am very freelance (ie doing no work so welcoming anything !)

belledechocolatefluffybunny · 23/05/2010 12:40

I've not heard back from them yet

mrz · 23/05/2010 16:59

LadyInMauve there isn't such a thing as a very good rating

LadyInMauve · 23/05/2010 19:28

OK, having checked the reports the rating was "good". I was quoting TJP with "very good".

My sources of knowledge comes from having close friends who have had DCs at the schools (and several have now moved them) and from looking at schools when deciding on schools choices. Short of actually sending my DCs to each school for a year at a time I don't quite know how I can get further knowledge.

Having said that, I was unable to sample these schools first hand as the LEA offered my DD no places at all as (and I quote) "you are not in the catchment area of any LEA schools, everyone who lives in your road goes private". So I was forced to go private.

I think the point is that OFSTED reports really don't tell you much, schools of very different standards can get very similar ratings - you need to see the school in action and talk to the kids there and the teachers.

Clary · 23/05/2010 22:00

well ladyinmauve I certainly agree with the last bit of your post there - you do in deed have to see the school in action and and talk to children and teachers.

Shocked that your LEA told you that. I would have appealed. That really is appalling!

LadyInMauve · 23/05/2010 22:52

Could have appealed but was made clear to me that I was only one of many in this position and it would have taken months for an appeal to be sorted out. Had the choice of leaving my DD out of school for up to a year or pay up.

This happens every year with my LEA. The true extent of the crisis in supply of school places here is not generally known as those who can stretch to paying give up and cough up.

Clary · 23/05/2010 22:58

Where are you? Didn't Camden have a situation where there just weren't enough school places?

But still I thought the LA were obliged to offer you a place somewhere?

seeker · 23/05/2010 23:04

The LEA has an obligation to offer a school place - it may not be the school you want, but they must offer a place. It is ridiculous to say that because everyone else in your street goes privat you have to as well. What if you couldn't afford it?

LadyInMauve · 24/05/2010 00:15

I know they have an obligation and we could have enforced this - eventally. But by the time it was enforced DD could have missed a year of school. As we could afford it we bit the bullet and went private. Then she was settled in new school, didn't want to move her.

I am sure the LEA are relying on the fact that a lot of parents in this area can stretch to the private option if pushed. If not they would have an absolute crisis on their hands as they cannot come anywhere near to providing a school place for all children in the borough. A friend has just got onto local council and is very interested in looking into this issue.

Clary - not in London but in south east. Don't want to say exactly as would give away my position!

Clary · 24/05/2010 00:17

That's really shocking LiM. Someone should contact the local paper about it tbh.

LadyInMauve · 24/05/2010 00:17

eventually that is

LadyInMauve · 24/05/2010 00:19

I think my friend on the council is planning on kicking up a mighty stink about it fairly soon. In the process of collecting evidence from parents at the moment.

mummytime · 24/05/2010 05:20

We used to have something similar near me. It caused chaos the year my son went to seniors, as School A had the previous year been allowed to offer over its PAN because it always loses 10% to parents sending their children private.
In my sons year they were not allowed to offer over their PAN, and from a change in the way places were allocated several roads became part of the catchment. Almost all children from these roads go private, but suddenly they were all offered places at School A.
A couple of children from these roads did go to school A. However most were still going private, so turned down their places. This meant there were huge numbers of pupils then being offered places off the waiting list, which affected all other schools.
My own son was 25th and was offered a place (before the appeals were even heard).

But our local council reportedly said when they built a huge estate, "we don't need new schools as if they pay that much for a house their kids will be going private".

bloss · 24/05/2010 05:41

Message withdrawn

LadyInMauve · 24/05/2010 08:27

I agree bloss, choice of school is entirely about the individual child and what the parents want from it at a certain stage.

One of DDs friends at her last school ws Finnish and her mother moved her older DS to the local state primary from their prep as she felt he was under too much pressure which did not sgree with him and, as they would be moving back to Finland in the next couple of years he would be fitting back into a system where formal schooling does not start until 7 so had no worries about him moving on to the next stage.

It worked out really well and both Dcs were well advanced on their contemporaries once they moved back to Finland and her DS was much more relaxed and happy.

Wish I had had the choice but apparently state education is not allowed for the likes of us!

LadyInMauve · 24/05/2010 08:32

mummytime - so mine is not just an isolated case, then.

Is definitely becoming more of an issue as a lot of those parents that the LEA assumed would go private need to access stste education due to the financial situation now.

This year's round of secondary entry will see the s**t hit the fan as they have already admitted that secondary places are tight, have been debating building a new secondary for years, has been put off mainly I feel because they are relying on the exodus to private. But a lot of those parents are trying for grammar entry this year.

camaleon · 24/05/2010 10:03

'... definitely becoming more of an issue as a lot of those parents that the LEA assumed would go private need to access stste education due to the financial situation now'

Wow... This is a real killer of any public service. They are only good and provide good quality when those who can afford something different still use them. This is true for public transport, health, etc. Any government at any level (local or national) operating a policy on public services addressed only to those 'who cannot afford to go private, are killing the service. In this case, education.

This is different from the fact that some people can go private, others not. And private and state schools seem to offer different things.

seeker · 24/05/2010 12:29

Are people really saying that their LEAs have said to them specifically "There is no school place for your child - you will have to go private"?

Really?

Or is what happened that the parenst concerned didn't like the look of the school they were offered, and were therefore "forced^ to go private.

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