part time teachers HELP with parents evenings on days OFF

[GordianKnot]

ok so i do three days
parents eve always on day off
dont mind dointg EXAM classes at all, but in KS3 is complusory subject so its tough titty really.
so i said " are you goign to pay me or not expect me in"

teh solution they propose is that my LOVELY HoD reads out what i write down

dont know what do do

MmeBlueberry, working in the private sector is a wholly different kettle of fish- they can pretty much do what they like. Not every school community is as wonderful as yours, so there needs to be legislation in the state sector.

I would never, ever work in a private school- and I doubt they'd have me

"At the end of the day, it seems that it's usually the employee rather than the employer who benefits from part time - most part timers I know don't want to work full time, or don't feel they could cope with it, rather than wanting full time, so it's in their interests to remain marketable!"

I presume you must be talking about primary school teaching? In secondary, it is a different kettle of fish where schools may want a part time teach to fill in those few hours that cannot be filled by the full time staff, but is not enough to make a full time job? (For example, I am the only person who teaches my combination of subjects and it makes up 3 days a week - there isn't enough work there to sustain a full time job, not that I'd want it to be full time, mind). So it does suit my employer for me to work fulltime, because I can be flexible in my hours, if they're in a fix - who do they get to plug the gaps in the timetables (if someone leaves for example) - oh yes, the part timers!

It is / can be beneficial for both parties, providing there is give and take on both sides.

Incidentally, I always do parents' evenings and open evenings, but I don't stay beyond my teaching hours for training, generally.

sorry, for me to work part time.

MmeBlueberry - presumably you volunteered to help out with the School Production and, I agree, such things make the world go round.
If you had been told that you must do it, had no choice in the matter and then didn't enjoy it / feel any benefit then, perhaps, you would have felt a little exploited. Your good will may have even been taken advantage of.

I think this is the situation which part-timers can easily find themselves in. You want to feel part of the establishment and make a valuable contribution but it does seem a bit odd that I attend INSET unpaid and the person next to me is paid. Some of my colleagues have negative gain by having to also pay for 1 or 2 days' extra childcare.
Part-timers often feel a little on the ' back foot' and don't want to jeapordise their jobs so don't make a fuss.

I like my job, it's a good school to work in and I've been round the block as far as teaching is concerned so I know how fortunate I now am. So I don't complain about being expected to work way outside my contract. But I think I'd be justified if I did.

Surely teachers do not scan the room looking for who is being paid and who is not. When I worked part time I did not give a hoot if I did hours I was not paid for, that is the nature of the beast.

"that is the nature of the beast."

No it's not.

has this thing kicked off yet?

There's still time, ninah... there's still time.

It is, I finished work tonight at 6pm, I have been working on sonme figures since getting home. Tomorrow I am on a tutorial for a course to update my subject knowledge, I then have a private study to do for most of the day. Sunday I will be marking mock papers for most of the day. I could say that I am not paid for Saturdays and Sundays so sod the work. You do the hours you need to do to get through the work.

Well it depends, if you are having to pay for the privilege of attending inset - e.g. £25 x no of children with a CM on days you are not paid for and normally spend with the dcs - you might begrudge being there. That's why the new rules protecting part-timers have come in, to stop them being exploited to financial disadvantage. There are also p/t staff who have 2nd jobs which also makes attending on other days just completely unfeasible. Although saying that, given directed time, part-timers are a good source on unpaid form-time cover.

Also have to say there isn't an after school meeting yet that I've missed through being part-time that I thought 'darn, I should have been there' and couldn't be summarised for me in 5mins

I don't know anyone that is a jobsworth - thannkfully.

Have been reading with interest and would like to say I support tethersend in everything she says. The burgandy book is there to support and protect teachers. I for one have worked for more than one headteacher who is happy to exploit staff with the old "but the students will miss out..." line, and it's reprehensible.

I currently teach part time - and officially as supply at the moment (and I HATE it, btw, but my DTs are pre-school and it works for us as a family. But I hate feeling on the periphery of things at school - just goes against my nature) but have happily helped out with school play rehearsals, done extra duties today and yesterday as OFSTED have been in, and plan lessons for the cover supervisor who teaches the same classes I teach on the days when I'm not in. I AM a team player, and I CHOOSE to do these things. tethersend is right though - there is a massive difference between volunteering to do extra and being told you have to.

twinset - I'm afraid I've always been of the opinion that teachers like you massively disadvantage the rest of us. There is nothing professional about your "but I do it for the children" approach. It's vile, and sycophantic.

Btw, one of our Assistant Heads is part time - 4 days. And she is FABULOUS. She came in on her "day off" this week (ofsted - volunteered, as she felt it was important) but absolutely will be taking an extra day next week to make up for it, and so she bloody well should.

I think calling somone you don't know vile and sycophantic is rather over the top not to mention wrong.

I do not disdvantage anyone, I just recoignise how lucky I am to have a job that I adore. What on earth is wrong in recognising that teachers do it for the children? You only survive in the kind of schools I have worked in if you feel that way.

wastwinset, just because you volunteer your time in such a way does not mean others should be compelled to do the same.

Nor does it make you a better teacher than someone who does not volunteer those hours.

It is not the "nature of the beast"; legislation proves otherwise. It may be the nature of your beast, but it isn't mine. Nor should it be anyone else's.

EvilTwins, were you KembleTwins in a previous incarnation?

Maybe I have worked in odd schools but I have never really stood out as someone who over volunteers her time. It is the nature of the beast in the schools I have worked at.

tethersend - yes I was.

twinset - no idea where you've taught, but I too have taught in schools where children are disadvantaged, unmotivated and have to deal with situations I would never ever want any child to be put in, yet I still don't feel I can be taken advantage of.

I just find your "do it for the kids" attitude a bit worthy. And therefore a bit arrogant. Like you think you're better than everybody else because you were "called" to this particular "vocation". Sorry, but yuk. There's more to it than that.

And no, I don't know you (such is the nature of MN) but I've certainly worked with others like you. And oddly enough, we've never got on.

Not true, dh works in a very, very tough school and is an exceptional teacher according to Ofsted - the reason? Not because he 'does it for the kids' in some sentimental do-gooder kind of way but because professional he likes doing something well, as nearly any professional would, has a captive audience and a passion for his subject. He's also been known to tell SMT "no" when they expect above and beyond.

My own school is much nicer place to teach but as a consequence teachers are much more exploited.

DR Your DH sounds fab. Am not keen on sentimental do-gooders in teaching.

I don't think it is being a 'jobsworth' to work for the hours you are contracted for. Teaching is different as the contracted hours aren't clear cut, but my job is. And bully for you for not claiming your travel expenses. I don't have the luxury not to. I make sure I claim everything due to me, and in return I am a loyal employee and work my hardest while I am there. When I go home, that is my time. That is not to say I walk out the door at 5pm every night, I am flexible where possible, but if I do more than my 8.5 hours I make sure that it is recorded. That is what I am entitled to. Fortunately my career prospects are not determined on whether or not I claim my expenses.

When I worked 3 days and DH worked 3 days if I had to do training or something across the whole week I did my very best to arrange for DH to have the time of and we would both make it up later, and vice versa. I give as much as I take from my employer.

I think working in companies where you are consistently required to work unpaid time is a mug's game. Maybe in 'industry' people often do this, but I would bet on the fact that these industries make sure they bill their customers for exactly the work they have done. Win win for the company I'd say.

And would you call a lawyer who bills every phone call and letter a 'jobsworth'?

I have not said I think I am a better teacher than everyone else. I do think that having a sense of vocation is not something to be ashamed of though.

Anyway I guess had better get back to being vile and sychophantic as I have work to do.

Or GPs who charge to sign passports? I would make a lot if I started charging.

I have always worked ft since having dc - I honestly think it's easier than doing 80% of the job for 60% of the money...

The Pay & Conditions are quite clear re: pt teachers & parents' evenings. My place always has them on a Thursday, tries to jig things so that pt-ers work on Thursday, & pays people/tells them not to bother if they don't.

Tbh, if I have something to discuss with a parent I wouldn't wait till parents' evening - I'd be on the phone or writing to them.

Theoretically I have 60 sets of parents to see in 2 hours next week (core subject - English). OK, that's unusual - I've got 2 classes in this year group; usually it'd be 30 kids & the actual uptake more like 20. When you've got 2 minutes per child, it does become nonsensical.

I've missed one parents' evening in 10 years (caused by dh booking uncancellable work stuff t'other end of the country without consulting me, the arse), rang the 3 parents affected, had an unpleasant conversation with the Head about it...posted on AIBU here & got a right virtual kicking!

Anyway, my argument is: if a teacher's pt (or for that matter ill or has another emergency), the sky won't fall in if parents know they won't see her on a given parents' evening - she can ring them or arrange another time to talk face to face. It's unreasonable to expect anyone to spend the evening of a day in which they don't work (or work in that particular job) doing a parents' evening.

It's not about professionalism at all, if we take 'professionalism' to mean 'keeping the students & parents informed' as opposed to 'martyring oneself in an inefficient manner'.

No disrespect to twinset - if her MO works for her then good for her - but it isn't an obligation & certainly shouldn't be an expectation.

raven - I agree about full time being easier - I decided to go back full time after having my children too.

I now do 120% of the job for 100% of the money.

RavenAk, how have you found working full-time easier than working p/t? What's your secret? Cannot contemplate the marking/prep load i.e. devoting Sunday to marking if you have young children.