EHCP ‘naming a secondary’ how does it work?

[Bearlionfalcon]

After a slightly sobering meeting about our dyslexic DD we have been told her primary school would support trying to get her an EHCP, she is in year four currently. She is bright and very keen to learn, loves reading now - but I think she is quite behind in writing / spelling and struggling with maths. In some areas she is way behind - spelling /punctuation and things like place value/ number bonds in particular. But verbally she presents as very bright. Anyway - I had a question about EHCPs. I have heard you can name a secondary school on them - is that right? This would be amazing for her as anecdotally there are two good schools near us which are good for dyslexia - an all -girls comp which we are not in catchment for, (catchment is tiny) and a small inclusive private school with good dyslexia support. I’d be happy with the comp, but would they allow us to name a different comp than the one we are in catchment for, if it’s not a ‘dyslexia specialist’ school (just a generally better school with better dyslexia support as well as better everything?!) or, alternatively, would they fund/ let me name a local mainstream private school (even if it’s not a dyslexia specialist school) on the basis that she would be in smaller class sizes and more 1:1 support there? Or, would it only allow me to ‘name’ a specialist dyslexia school (like fairly house) which I’m not sure would be ideal for her (it’s soo far away and I hate the idea of her not being in her community and having local friends as those things are important too.) I would appreciate any advice. Tia

If you're not here in support of parents, you should consider whether posting on this thread is helpful, I think.

@flawlessflipper is extremely knowledgeable and has been through the EHCP "process" multiple times.

The law is regularly, routinely, broken in this area. Look at the recent government debate. It was all transcribed on Hansard. I can post a link if anyone wants.

It's not typical for our LA. Here they don't attend all annual reviews or that would be all they're doing, but they do come to ones where we have a reason for inviting them. And of course the CWOs aren't the people who sit on panel - at least not in our LA. They have a more admin role.

I'm only a parent (and a teacher). I don't know how how this system works administratively (why would I?) I assume "CWO" means "case officer"?

All I can say is it's been pretty negative from my point of view and has devoured hundreds of hours of my time, unpaid.

I'm very grateful to the various SENCOs who helped me.

However, if I didn't have a well honed ability to detect when people in positions of authority are not telling me the whole truth, I would have given up ages ago.

And of course many parents do...

Sorry OP! I will stop derailing your thread.

All LAs do act unlawfully at times. If they didn’t, there wouldn’t be so many parents needing to appeal to SENDIST where the vast majority of their appeals are upheld. Neither would so many complain to the LGO. Where, again, the vast majority are upheld. Neither would so many need look to pre-action letters to enforce the law that SOSSEN has a waiting list and it takes perseverance to find a firm with the capacity to take your case on. Pre-action letters mostly work, although not as much as in the past because LAs know some parents will still have to find a legal aid firm with capacity to take their child’s case which kicks the can down the road. I haven’t posted they act unlawfully all the time.

I have 3 DC with EHCPs. I have also supported thousands of parents across the country over the years. So, yes, I have seen many LA practices that do not comply with the law. Among other things, I have seen that LA forms often ask for information that is not part of the legal test, information that many parents will not have to hand &/or are not user-friendly.

Why would I use ChatGPT? That is a terrible idea for anything SEN related, IMO. It often makes up legislation, misrepresents/misunderstands the law, invents case law, imagines barrister names… There are two perfectly acceptable model letters on IPSEA and SOSSEN’s websites that will suffice. Or one on Contact's website if parents prefer. No-one needs to invent another form.

@Needlenardlenoo just to point out, it is the AR meeting that LAs often don’t attend. That is only one part of the AR process.

@flawlessflipper I get that - there's paperwork I expect. I fill it in as a teacher and as a parent so I can imagine the LA does a form too. They must; they're spending taxpayers' money.

It's not great though from a parent's perspective is it? You get this plan, and then....silence!

CWO is case work officer.

In my experience the LA do far more than just fill in a form. Specialist teachers support schools, EPs add to the EHCP. Training is available.

What is it that you want the LA to do once the plan is in place? Nobody from the EHCP team comes to ARs with us unless there's a big issue. I get them involved if a school aren't doing what the plan says, ef they decide the child doesn't need the intervention time, or the TA support outlined and redeploy the TA support half the week. Other than that it's down to us and the school, and family, to make sure the outcomes are being worked towards. It would be interesting to know what other ongoing support you would like from the LA.

@Needlenardlenoo oh I appreciate that. I was just pointing out the meeting is only one element because some parents think the meeting is the AR.

Invites and updated advice and information should be circulated at least 2 weeks before the meeting. Then the meeting. Within 2 weeks of the meeting, a report should be circulated. Within 4 weeks of the meeting, the LA must inform parents if they propose to cease to maintain/maintain as is/amend and if they are going to amend, send the amendment notice at the same time, then finalise within a further 8 weeks.

Although, sometimes it is easier if the LA doesn’t attend the AR meeting.

On the point of writing EHCPs. I have re-written many an EHCP. Many who have responded to a draft will have re-written aspects of it. Anyone who has ever appealed the content of an EHCP will have re-written aspects of it via the WD process. Drafts are often inadequate. They are often vague and woolly, not detailed, specified and quantified. It is common for HCP that trains or educates to be in the wrong section or omitted completely. It isn’t unusual for them to be C&P jobs - which is why it isn’t unheard of the have the wrong name/pronouns (and I’m not commenting on gender here)/age and numbering that is wrong. Some are written by AI now.

Im following this with interest. Our local secondary is not great but sadly we live out in the Fenland villages and its our only choice. My eldest will be fine there as she is a very solid middle of the road student, my middle DD has ASD, situational mutism and probably ADHD although we haven't had the formal ADHD assessment yet as she found the ASD assessment totally overwhelming. Shes currently in Y4 and we are thinking of starting the EHCP process as she is very far behind with her writing, school are trying to organise a dyscalculia assessment as she is far behind in maths and has no number recall. There are a couple of autistic schools in our county, at least one for children who are only a couple of years behind academically which I think would be great for her, however I don't want her to be held back I still want her to have the opportunity to do exams if she is able but I don't want her pressurised if she can't.

Ita such a challenging system to tackle as a parent who has no knowledge of any of it. You want to do the best for your child but its hard to know what the best is and so much information to get through.

I would have liked:

1. Them to do the ECHNA when I requested it rather than make me force them to do it via a tribunal.
2. Then I would have liked them to carry out the assessment in a timely way without me having to chase every professional and report myself.
3. Then I would have liked them to issue the EHCP without my forcing them to do it via a tribunal.
4. I would have liked the EHCP to have been clearly and concisely written with SMART targets so it's easy for teaching staff to follow and for me and the SENCO to know if it's being followed.
5. I would have liked some advice on suitable schools in our borough that could meet the needs of my specific child (that's all I ever really wanted).
6. I would have liked this advice BEFORE the 31st October regular school application deadline (I mean, I did request the ECHNA in October of year 5 and it's supposed to take 20 weeks).
7. I would have liked a check in after a term of secondary to see how it was going (because they should know that the year 6 to year 7 transition is the biggest risk time that an autistic girl develops EBSA).
8. I would like a named person with a named email who looks after my daughter's case.

I'm only expecting the level of professionalism that you (mostly) get from the NHS (my daughter also has some medical needs).

That's not unreasonable is it?

I would have liked our LA not to try to place my child in an enormous comprehensive where they’d expect him to arrive at every lesson five minutes late, leave five minutes early, and learn by standing in the corridor and looking through the window in the classroom door. Genuinely this is what was offered.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/special_educational_needs/5309128-ehcp-support-thread-no-5?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=app_share @WafflingDreamer post on here and we'll help you. Year 4 is a good time to make the ECHNA request.

Fenland is hard. My uni friend grew up there (her dad sent her private out of area. No SEND as far as I know but the mum had a life limiting condition so all very difficult.

I should have clarified @zonder but who's "us"?

What's your role? You don't seem to be a SENCO, a teacher or work directly with EHCPs?

Whatever your role is, I suspect my LA either doesn't have it or doesn't carry it out regarding DC whose EHCPs name schools in other LAs.

My LA "exports" 20% of its EHCP kids. I don't know if that's usual. I mean it can't be? What a merry-go-round!

I don't want to go into detail as I don't want to be outing. I'm an advisory SEND teacher working for the LA and as part of my role I'm very involved with a lot of EHCPs, in supporting children getting them and in supporting schools in following through on the EHCP once granted.

Id love your answer to my question about what you would like the LA to do in terms of support post EHCP.

I answered it @zonder?

Can we please stop de-railing the OP's thread now?

IPSEA has a template letter that covers the legal tests. Anything else is superfluous.

I'd like them to actually make sure that what they are responsible for gets done. DD2 is having annual review in 12 days. My LA use a hub.

• Not one invitee (except me) has accepted the invitation
• The school have not provided their report yet
• 90% of the provision in DD2's Plan (highly specified, including level of expertise of therapy staff) has not been given
• The old caseworker has been invited to the meeting, but the case has been handed to a new caseworker
• The LA have a banner on their homepage if the Hub, saying that because there are so many young people with EHCPs, although caseworkers are invited to meetings, they're unlikely to turn up.
• DD2 is in a transfer year and is going to need highly specialist provision next year, so they really do need to be thinking of what will meet her needs.

Now, I could/should have taken action earlier and made complaints and sent pre-action letters, and used the judicial review process, etc., but frankly, with two other children with high needs and EHCPs, I'm a bit worn out.

DD1 had annual review in March, was off-roled by her college, then it took until September for her very poor EOTAS package to be put together, half of which isn't even in place because of waiting lists, and the EHCP hasn't been finalised.

Again, I could do the c/PA letter/JR, but I'm just exhausted and burned out by the system. Hence me being on MN at 23.30 instead of sleeping because my brain is too fried to wind down.

I'm sorry to hear that, @Lougle. You can only do so much.

These are public servants. They should be serving the public.

Some of the things I would like my LA to do include:

• Providing the SEP within DSs’ EHCPs without having to enforce it.
• Paying the DPs for DS1&3’s EOTAS/EOTIS packages on time without having to be chased. And not auditing me every half term, which is far more regularly than others, as punishment for daring to successfully advocate for DSs and enforce their rights. They have never found fault yet continue to do so. It is vindictive and a waste of the LA's time, my time, the EOTAS/EOTIS co-ordinator's time and the pay-roll company's time.
• Completing ARs correctly without having to enforce them. For us, the problem is compliance with the timescales after AR meetings. DS1&3’s EOTAS/EOTIS co-ordinator we have as part of their packages and DS2’s SENCO complete the reports, then the LA takes their time, too much time, to complete their parts.
• Making the necessary amendments without having to appeal.
• Complying with SENDIST’s directions and Orders correctly and on time without me having to do anything.
• Accepting they have a transport duty without constantly quibbling. Fulfilling that duty by paying DS2’s PTB without having to be chased and paying the DPs for DS1&3’s transport (not technically a PTB because of how my LA fund transport for EOTAS/EOTIS DC) without having to be chased.
• Paying complaint and LGO settlements on time.

@Needlenardlenoo I didn't see your response as you tagged me in a later post and my notification took me straight to that.

To you and @Lougle I totally agree that the system is rubbish, and relies on parents understanding the system and being able to fight for what their child needs.

I do think expectations of CWOs aren't realistic as their role is really administrative. IME the job of making sure the plans to meet outcomes in the EHCP is usually with the school, using funding to get in place the support, and accessing training or support from the specialist teachers in the LA SEND department. That's a mixed bag.

I think we're agreed on that. It's a rubbish system. When it works, it's in spite of itself.

Is it a reasonable expectation that parents know how the SEN team works and what their job descriptions are?

At one stage I went through every named person listed on my LA website for SEN. They were all off sick, on leave, or no longer worked there, with out of office messages pointing to each other.

When writing to parents, my LA use only generic letters so everything is signed "SEN team" with a generic email (which is never answered unless you phone, are lucky enough to have someone answer and make them sort through the inbox - "oh yes - I see your email from last Tuesday...")

It's a system designed to keep parents out.