Is this the end of Latin in state schools?

[Edmontine]

Depressing news:

The Guardian

You can now, but that’s relatively recent. When I was young you needed Latin and Greek A level to do Classics at Oxbridge. Students would start ready to translate the Aeneid and the Iliad.

As fewer state schools offered either language, the intake became heavily private school dominated, so requirements were changed to encourage state sector students to choose Classics.

I have no idea what it was like as a GCSE in the 80s - but it definitely wasn’t considered an easy O’ Level in the 70s!

Yes, that’s a four year degree course at Cambridge which is only open to a very few high-achieving candidates, who have on average three A-levels in other related subjects, generally all at A*. And in which you spend an additional year - at the cost of the full standard rate of university fees and maintenance - doing high-intensity immersive language training in very small groups. It probably costs students who do this four year degree around £25-30k in additional fees and maintenance just for that year.

Of course, that’s very accessible by lots of people and students all across the state sector, isn’t it! Well done, you’ve identified a complete straw man of a point which actually works completely against your argument!

Information about the ab initio Cambridge Classucs degree:
“There are different versions of the three-year course depending on whether you have two ancient language A-Levels or one, and there is a four-year course, whose first year focuses on Latin and then Greek, for those who have never studied either ancient language, or who have less than A-level experience in Latin. This course is unique in the UK in enabling students to take both Latin and Classical Greek from scratch to a high level.”

This is very wrong today (and I doubt it was ever true). Latin GCSE and A-level both have a very small number of entrants (some of the figures are upthread for you), and is well known amongst admissions tutors for being particularly hard.

I did GCSE Latin in the 80s and by no means was it considered and easy A. My school was a comprehensive rather than grammar but we had to pass two tests and be put in the tops sets for other subjects to be considered for Latin.

I know different athority areas had different standards but the other school in my area offering Latin as a subject had the same requirements as I mentioned in previous paragraph as well as my school.

If that was true (it isn't) then we should obviously be encouraging ALL schools to offer Latin as fast as possible and make it compulsory.

What kid wouldn't want an easy A grade at GCSE?

How short sighted of the government not to enable state pupils to all walk away with an effortless top grade.

Indeed. It’s never been true that Latin was the easiest subject in which to get an A.

I did Latin GCSE at a state comprehensive. Like a pp you had to be in one of the top two sets to be able to study it from, I think, the second year of high school in order to then go on and choose it as one of your options. I did three languages at GCSE on top of compulsory English and three at A Level (including English Language which studied the evolution of English and grammar).

I believe studying Latin to GCSE was extremely helpful to me when studying French and Spanish which have their roots in Latin. In the same way studying modern foreign languages covers cultural matters, so did studying Latin. When I was doing my A Levels and on a French exchange I had learned enough about the Romans previously to be able to translate the information in a French museum from French to English and give some background to other students who could translate, but didn't understand what some of the artefacts were for.

Latin is not an easy GCSE or A-Level. I think this misconception might arise from the fact that the average grades for Latin are high nationally. That's not because it's easy, it's because a) it's only offered as a subject at a minority of schools which tend to be more academic b) the kids who choose Latin tend to be ones who are already academic high achievers.
So the schools offering it aren't your average school and the kids choosing it aren't your average student.

Latin is a very nice "objective" subject for a humanity/language which would likely make grades easier to pick.

The easiest A level (and GCSE) is obviously maths, minimal homework, no essays, no faff, easy A*. ;-)

... if you have an aptitude for maths and are highly intelligent, of course.

I don't understand your first sentence.

I have no idea what you mean