How smart do you need to be to pass 11+

[Mumofgirls12341]

My 9 year old is in year 5 and preparing for 11+ and I was just wondering how smart does a child actually need to be in order to secure a place? We’re aiming at London super selectives Latymer, HBS and Woodford County Girls School.

DD has always been exceeding/greater depth since reception but I wouldn’t say she is exceptionally bright - does she have a decent shot? I have heard of people saying it’s almost impossible to get into these schools so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

@yousf - I do not think just one outcome is possible. However, I do believe that most professional parents can do some basic maths.

Your Guardian data are incomplete and cannot be used for anything, but of course you will keep refusing to admit it.
And it's fine. We're not losing money on this bet.

Your narrow belief has you convinced that professional parents see education as nothing more than a financial transaction. It's almost as if you think they’re depositing money in an educational bank and expecting a guaranteed return on investment.

Obviously, you are the one who refuses to accept any data points or media that you don't agree with. It's OK confirmation bias is norm.

@yousf - can you explain why you actually care? Have you got children in such a school? Or do you intend to send them there?

We have enough school places in London, apparently. So everyone will just get shifted around one notch. And top private schools will be even fuller with rich internationals (as long as they keep coming). So what?

The kids in our state primary who normally would have passed Stage 1 simply did not this year. So they will go to a slightly less competitive grammar and those kids will go to comp etc etc. In the end, most will reach their innate academic ability anyway, because their parents will make sure of it. It is the kids at the bottom of the rung with parents who do not care or those with SEND that we need to worry about. What happens at the top is just a pass the parcel.

I studied statistics and I'm sorry I cannot accept incomplete data sets. And I despise Guardian in this case for feeding people half baked manipulations in support of rubbish policies.

I would be interested to see proper stats though when it will become available - I'm generally interested in data. Not on MSM for sure but you usually can get info on gov web sites. Much later of course.

You don't send your kids to private school and keep talking about your beliefs on the private school and grammar school with narrow-minded justifications. It makes anyone want to offer you a perspective beyond your narrow imagination.

Well, you will probably need to study statistics further. The key to statistics is making inferences from a sample of data. Also, confirmation bias can lead an incompetent statistician to interpret data in a way that supports their preexisting beliefs or hypotheses.

What narrow perspective? My youngest will be perfectly fine in the two excellent state comps that we have also put on our CAF. In fact, post Covid if I had to homeschool I know we would be fine either way. I don’t need anyone to tell me what to do with my own DC.

The only reason I am on these threads is because I have noticed an increased bias and rhetoric against grammar schools (and even church schools) and I fully intend to fight my corner. That’s it.

@Araminta1003 Your narrow viewpoint aligns exactly with biases against any non-grammar schools, including private or non-grammar state schools. When you hear many voices in public not in line with your narrow viewpoint, you find yourself increasingly cornered.

I repeat @yousf - what type of school do your own children attend? Do you even have a Year 6? Do you have actual experience right now of either going through secondary or Sixth Form transition?

This is primarily a chat site for mums sharing anecdotes for getting into schools and what it is like on the ground right now. Not three years ago or in 5 years time.

We would like to actually help the OP. So go elsewhere with your pseudo intellectualism, you can name change as many times as you like. It won’t make a difference.

Thank you for lecturing me :)
As I said before, I don't need to have beliefs in this case, real life is more than enough as a proof.

Let's look at your example of two girls not putting HBS as first choice on CAF form - I wasn't asked to fill in CAF to apply for HBS so why would those girls need to have it on the forms at all, in whatever position?

Of course, as a parent I have direct experience in both the state and private school sectors, primarily covering secondary education, sixth form, and university. I believe that's exactly why many people here call you out — your narrow belief is based on a very limited personal experience.

In case you don't know, the school email the applicants who pass first round to put in the first place in the CAF form.

This doesn't make sense - so you as a parent have direct experience of secondary schools but not the primary ones? Were your children born 12yo?

Ah OK I didn't know that as DD didn't pass. Thanks!

No problem, glad that I don't need to give you lecture on comprehension skill too. In case you pick a typo and saysnit doesn't make sense

You can jot down as many random thoughts as you like. It won't change the fact that your point is unintellectual and unsound.

How very nice of you. I actually thought you were AI but it cannot be that charming.

@yousf - why do you think your experience is more relevant than my experience with my 4 DC? It makes no sense.

Anyway, to get back to the OP. Any very bright child has a fair shot at the 11 plus. Tutoring and some prep is required but I have seen lots of parents go over the top with prep for not much gain. It is better to try a few schools and think well in advance about order of schools in the CAF. I have done this 4 times now and the tricky bit is ordering the schools on the CAF, especially if they have passed everything and they have done a couple of stage 2s with no certain outcome at that point. Whether you get a top grammar school is often down to how other people ordered their CAF form. So if not everyone put HB first and only 300 went to second round and they only take 104, you can do the Maths. A parent who put it first on the CAF will get it over another parent who did not who got a better score. So there is a fair amount of chance involved.
As usual, all the parents I know have been texting each other over the holidays panicking about CAF order and checking what others are doing and trying to aim to get friends into the same school. And yes, that includes for superselectives.

Not as nice as someone assume kids are 12yo at born

@Araminta1003
What makes you so confident that your experience, mostly based on anecdote, is more representative than others? Simply having four DCs doesn't make sense.

**

And for HBS obviously there are also those in catchment who are pretty much guaranteed a place if they passed Stage 1 anyway.
And then there are also more and more FSM places across grammars (and they can change the Admissions criteria every year so always read it carefully) and then there is the competition from private school kids or those who would have gone private in previous years. Yet these are unknown quantities, at this point.

So best to just get hold of good practice materials including recommended past papers for Stage 2. Note if you are not in catchment for HBS, there is not much time for last minute Stage 2 preparation!