20% vat on fees

[namechangedforthisone35]

IF Labour get in and IF the 20% does get added to fees, how many private school pupils will be moved to state? I have three kids (one not school aged yet) and in private school. One of many reasons because I didn't want them in a class of 30. I couldn't afford the vat increase so would have to move them but then that class of 30 becomes, what, 40?! In an already strained and unresourced system?!

Wwyd?

Y - I'd have to move kids to state
N - I'll pay the vat

You don’t want to, that’s fine. Other parents take more of an interest and do improve things.

The funds will go into school budgets.

Schools have to fund the cost of EHCP applications from their budgets. NB not the actual EHCP provision once it’s approved, the application for one.

The funds will go into school budgets.

And so will more students

Same, work full time, DH works even longer hours so everything else falls on me. I'm just coping with everything as it is! But that's what we're saying, would all these parents of ex private school kids be joining the PTA, becoming governors etc? I assume most of them are working full time too if they can afford private school fees.

Not that many more.

Plus many schools are under subscribed at the moment, particularly primaries in London and this will go up to secondary in the next few years, but it costs the same to run a state school with 30 kids per class as 25 per class. Adding a couple more children per class has very limited incremental cost and brings full funding for each additional head, this opens up opportunities for more TAs, better resources etc.

Some will. Some already do 😉

One of the things whenever this policy is discussed is we get quite wide ranging opposition - it won't work, it'll never be implemented anyway, it is taking away something vital, I'm just going to move my kid to state because private is not vital.

I am very interested in this policy from a politics-watching perspective.

@Ilovemygoldfish with the greatest of respect, choosing to drive a cheaper car or not go an expensive holiday every year is not a sacrifice worth talking about. It's a decision you have made in how you are choosing to spend your money. An amount of money that most families don't have spare no matter how much sacrificing in other areas of their life they do.

I'm not asking anyone to apologise for sending their kids to private school. I am suggesting that the language of how you talk about this topic is really not helping your cause. Many of you seem completely unaware of what average earnings and sacrifices in terms of choosing what you can and can't afford is like for many. To be honest, I am luckily pretty unaware of many of those things too as we do ok as a family. No where near being able to afford private school but ok, no debt, food on plate, a car, cheap holiday. But at least I have some awareness that if I talked about making sacrifices to go on uk holiday every year I would be being a dick.

Life is all relative. If you get upset by it, don’t read threads on private school.

They exist; not talking about them isn’t going to change that.

It’s an incredibly niche issue.

The vast majority of parents aren’t affected let alone the population. Lots of wealthier parents will simply shrug and carry on paying.

Plus no one is going to sympathise that a wholly unaffordable amount of money for most people has gone up a bit.

Ironically, VAT is often not payable on foreign holidays………. For example there’s no VAT on flights (air passenger duty is often less than the equivalent VAT would be). I understand that there’s no UK VAT payable on foreign accommodation either.

Therefore, we will be in a position where parents choosing to spend money on education have to pay VAT, but families splashing out on a luxury foreign holiday will not.

It's a misapprehension that PTA members, particularly those in secondary schools, do not work full time or have 'proper' jobs. Many fall into this category and get involved because they care about more than just their own child's educational outcomes. Not everyone is as selfish as some posters on this thread.

Hypothetical scenario:
If you lived in a neighbourhood that wasn't perfect and couldn't move out would you build a protective barrier around your house or get together with your community and work for change? Some would do the former. Others the latter. It is this 'working for change' group that do and can make a difference.

It's not perfect. It never will be. However bleating about paying tax on your privilege is self centred and crass. Send your kids to private school if you want but don't moan about a little bit of levelling up that is long overdue.

It won’t be a niche issue to the sector.

Like any sector whacked with a 20% increase there will be damage, which is a shame as the benefits are likely to be low

Quite jealous that they have the time.

@Another76543 Yup, hadn’t thought about it that way, but you’re right!

Want something done, ask a busy person

It is beside the point whether it is revenue positive, negative or neutral for Labour. It’s an area which they believe should attract VAT (I have sympathy with this view) and so they want to change it. If the upshot is that ratios shift from 93:7 to 95:5 or whatever, so be it.

I'm not upset thanks 🙂
You could all save a lot of upset at fee raises though if you used arguments other than 'woe is me with all my sacrifices and hard working' and 'won't some one think of all the privileged people like me in the future that will have had the drawbridge of privilege closed on them'. You might even get more people on your side then.

The funds will go into school budgets

The (optimistic) estimates of how much the policy would raise amounts to 1-2% of the state education budget. It’s a tiny amount. The Labour Party have said they will spend the funds on 6,500 more teachers. I’m not entirely sure where these new teachers are going to come from though, as schools can’t even fill existing vacancies. People are hardly queueing up to become teachers.

Surely extra funding is the central point of it

If you think that won’t happen it really is window dressing and incredibly poor policy

Where will Labour get funding for any increase in spending they want to do?

@EnglishMenHaveTails you asked previously why ‘I just didn’t support my local school’ I’ve stated why.

The OP asked for opinions on her situation and for those of us also worried, can offer an opinion and share concerns with her situation, many of us may be in a similar position. This is support for a specific topic. I don’t jump on the style threads to berate someone for spending £5k on a handbag and ask them to check their privilege…You are stated in your previous post that you may have a touch of jealousy on this subject which I think has made you sensitive to the language used. !9 offence is intended but There can be no discussion about affordability (which is what the thread is about ) without mentioning savings or even ‘sacrifice’ - I.e what you may be going without in order to facilitate something else.

Not everyone is as selfish as some posters on this thread.

But I'd wager that the ones paying to educate their children in a separate school are as selfish as I apparently am. I don't see them suddenly caring about the education of all the other local children when they're busy panicking that their child now has to go to a state school.

What percentage of parents at most schools are on the PTA? Are all the ones that aren't on the PTA selfish?

I don’t think that is the central point, no

Political parties are at liberty to make changes in line with their political philosophy if they get into power. That’s the point of being a politician, for many.

So just because someone does something indicates that they are likely to believe in a particular set of mores doesn't prove that those who don't do anything don't. You can't prove a positive from a negative.

If these 'selfish' people are stuck in their home fortresses and start seeing the rest of the community working together to improve things then maybe, just maybe, they'll see the benefit of joining in.

Apologies *no offence is intended