Private Vs State school

[Ilikepinacoladass]

I know this is a controversial subject. But genuinely trying to decide if private is worth it.

I see loads of comments saying things like I didn't send mine to private because I went to a comp and was at the same uni as loads of privately educated people and got same results etc.

But surely the GCSE / A-level results speak for themselves? Lots from the comps won't have even made it to uni whereas maybe they would have if they'd gone to a private school?

A-level results from 2023
56.5% got A/A* - local private school
39% got A/A* - local grammar school
20% got A/A* - local state school

I don't want to waste money, but I do want the best for my child (as we all do!) and trying to decide if having more local friends / a free education / short walk to school etc (state school) would be worth the potential loss in opportunities a private school would offer.

I agree I think it would be more subtle than literally friends giving each other jobs. Probably just more the opposite of falling into the wrong crowd.

That true, it also happens in grammars too from my experience

Yes I would agree there’s a benefit to being in an aspirational environment but I’d disagree that you only find that in a private school. There is one comp locally that is highly aspirational and were we in catchment for it I’d have seriously considered it. Sadly we’re not, and our local school is the one that teachers refer to as “spicy”.

Having experienced both I feel the difference is aspirations. Being in the private setting where aspirations were definitely higher and being surrounded by other students motivated to work definitely suited my son who would conform to what was around him and led to all 9/8s and A* x 3 at A level and into a competitive uni. He also accessed excellent sporting opportunities and other opportunities to that he would not have accessed in the state sector. If finances are not an issue I would go private. We have no regrets whatsoever. Sometimes people say oh he is bright he could have done that at state but I really think he wouldn't have although we can't ever know. I just know his personality is such that he would have settled for what was normal.

Some privates are more selective than others.

My DS had a "spiky profile" and was dyslexic and dyspraxic.

He was set 1 for maths and science, bottom set for any language he ever tried to learn and moderately shit at English.

The private let him drop languages completely, had amazing SEN support, and he was in a class of 15 for English GCSEs which really helped him pass.

I teach in the state sector and I am fully aware of how much support there is for dyslexic and dyspraxic students, never mind how arsey some schools can be about not doing a languages gcse.

I’ve read somewhere that the biggest factor that impacts children’s attainment at school is parental involvement. Naturally, you will get more involved parents at private schools (as they’re shelling out so much money for it). Educational selectivism isn’t just through private schooling though, engaged parents (those with the financial means to do so) will move into catchment of good schools. In short, the whole system is unfair. But for the purposes of this thread, you’re comparing apples and pears.

The absolute biggest predictor of a child’s success is a motivated mother.
It also doesn’t really matter how going to a private school would benefit a child with more barriers and they might do better- that’s irrelevant if your child has plenty of support.

If you can comfortably afford private, then go private. State schools are losing teachers like anything. Can't get top results in the local comp if they have no maths or science teacher!

It’s not possible to generalise. There are private schools I absolutely wouldn’t send my child to. However, I think a decent private school is worth every penny. Smaller classes, nice facilities, lots of extra curricular activities, a tailored education, happy teachers, motivated children who are keen to work hard etc all make school more enjoyable for a child
and, therefore, more likely to reach their full potential. These things are more likely in a private school in my opinion. I say this as someone who went to a state school.

The key is to pick a private school which suits your child, not necessarily one which gets the best result. A very academic school isn’t going to be the best environment for a child who struggles academically for example.

The private schools don’t have the children with learning difficulties, EHCP’s etc. The state schools have children from a much wider ability range. You are not comparing the same set of children. FWIW my son went to the local comp got 4 A stars at A level and 9 of them at GCSE. It did him good to realise not everyone gets those results, one of his best friends was in 6th form with an EHCP for a language disorder. He needs to live in the real world.

I think the children who benefit from private the most are the middling easily influenced ones. The ones that rise to the level around them need that environment to achieve. Mild SEN with a spiky profile also seem to better at private in my experience. Otherwise they form the forgotten middle blob at a state school.

The private schools don’t have the children with learning difficulties, EHCP’s etc.

This isn’t true. Plenty of private schools have children with EHCPs or those who need SEN support.

https://explore-education-statistics.service.gov.uk/find-statistics/special-educational-needs-in-england

These stats show that 4.9% of children at private schools have an EHCP. That’s actually a higher percentage than the average of 4.3% across all schools. The percentage of SEN pupils at private school is also higher than the overall average.

These stats show that 4.9% of children at private schools have an EHCP. That’s actually a higher percentage than the average of 4.3% across all schools.

There's a difference between numbers who need help, and numbers who get it. For parents who are themselves disabled, depressed, neurodiverse or lower functioning, it can be impossible to navigate the system to get help for their child.

Miggymoggymoo22 · Today 19:40

Certain private schools are all about the academic, so much so they will have regular testing and those who continue to not perform are asked to leave so as not to bring the overall scores down

I’ve heard of private schools not allowing students who got poor GCSE grades to stay on for A levels, but which schools do regular testing? How regular? Each term or each year?

Yes I’m sure there are more children who don’t get the help they need. However, my comment was in response to a poster stating that private schools don’t have children with learning difficulties. That’s simply untrue.

Another way of thinking is that if you can theoretically afford private, then you'd technically be blocking the space at a good state school for a child whose family can't afford it.

Can afford it, but it obviously involves sacrifices/ not spending the money on other things! I don't think any has a duty to go private just because they can afford it.

You've described my 9 year old to a tee here which is why we're trying to move him to private next year (awaiting assessment results). Behaves impeccably, falls under the radar and is struggling with numeracy. We have a tutor who suspects ADHD due to focusing, attention issues. Easily influenced by those around him and is in a very disruptive class. It saddens me that we're going down this route but it genuinely feels right for him. Like OP it will involve sacrifice (we have a DD too) and this isn't a grades thing. It's a better all-round outcome thing.

@Ilikepinacoladass "It still doesn't reassure me that a child from affluent parents will do just as well in a comp as they would do in a private school though"

In my experience (over a very long time!) they do. The tragedy is that the kids who would actually benefit from what a good private school can offer don't have a hope in hell of going to one.

That is incorrect. There are many private schools which are SEN.

Honestly it very much depends on the local state offer BUT the state sector is under so much pressure, you only have to read the posts by teachers on this topic. This isn't going to improve any time soon and we weren't prepared to send DD to any of the very poor local state secondaries.
So far very, very happy with private. DD is thriving with 18-22 in each class and obviously the facilities are fantastic. Quiet and relaxed learning environment which is conducive to learning and any low level disruptive behaviour is stamped out immediately. She is flying and I honestly don't think she would have in classes of up to 35 with constant disruptions, she isn't a naturally confident child and I feel she would have disappeared into the background in a large school.
We saved up for the first 3 years of fees in advance of her starting as we pay out of our wages so wanted to proof her first 5 years there.
Ultimately if you have very good local state schools then it might not be worth sending private but we don't so it was a no-brainer.

You could split the difference and send the DC to a state boarding school.

For all the talk of the tax payer subsidising private schools because they are registered as charities (which is a fallacy as there's no actual cost to the tax payer), a free state education to those wealthy enough to afford to pay for it is effectively making the tax payer subsidise holidays/house deposits/nice cars etc.

Why is that ok?

I'm also a tax payer? Do you think the same about the NHS and any other publically funded service?

Maybe I shouldn't be commuting on the railways but go by private jet instead - to prevent taking up a seat on the train.

I think the same goes on it all schools, if students are not engaging properly with the education provided eventually they get asked to leave. It certainly happened in my grammar school. And people get asked not to sit certain GCSEs if they will clearly flunk them. That's not exclusive to private schools.

I certainly wouldn't want to send DC to a school which was regularly weeding out multiple kids each year though - and I'd like to think there'd be enough of a hoohaa made about it that the school would get a bad rep amongst parents!

Totally normal not to let people stay on for sixth form if they don't get the GCSE grades though.