Private Vs State school

[Ilikepinacoladass]

I know this is a controversial subject. But genuinely trying to decide if private is worth it.

I see loads of comments saying things like I didn't send mine to private because I went to a comp and was at the same uni as loads of privately educated people and got same results etc.

But surely the GCSE / A-level results speak for themselves? Lots from the comps won't have even made it to uni whereas maybe they would have if they'd gone to a private school?

A-level results from 2023
56.5% got A/A* - local private school
39% got A/A* - local grammar school
20% got A/A* - local state school

I don't want to waste money, but I do want the best for my child (as we all do!) and trying to decide if having more local friends / a free education / short walk to school etc (state school) would be worth the potential loss in opportunities a private school would offer.

I think you have to consider that private usually have some form of selection process if not entrance exam so will have the cream of the crop. Private definitely has a lot more support as they have the funding to do so. My 6yo is excelling in maths so gets taken out to do two extra lessons a week. He wouldn't be recieving this in state. We chose private for ours and they will board from 13+. Partly about the support but also the experience. Far more sport and me and DH both had the time of our lives boarding. We want ours to have the same while also recieving an education to help them acheive the best THEY can, not aiming for all A*, just what they can acheive with the right support.

@Janedoe82 But even if the teachers are the same surely being in a class of 20 Vs 30 helps?

honestly I think the value of the “old boy network” is hugely exaggerated beyond a few of the public schools. What I think is more important is the “you can’t be what you can’t see” factor, whereby if you’re at a school where all your friends’ parents have professional, high paying jobs, that becomes normal in your mind and seems more achievable than if you don’t know anyone who is (. Eg) a barrister, a judge, a surgeon, a hedge fund manager etc).

I think contacts are more likely to come from your parents than your school and that’s the same whichever school you go to.

I had one child at private and one at a state grammar, the child at the grammar got better teaching. In fact we had to get a tutor in one subject at the private school!!! But that’s a lowish ranking private school not a big name

Private, 100%.

The people who say things like ‘bright kids thrive anywhere’ or ‘I went state and my friend at the same uni went private haha what’s the point’ just don’t get it.

Private school is not about what uni your child eventually gets into. It’s not even about what grades they get (although all children get higher grades at private than they would have in state)

It’s about the difference between:

(1) Being taught in a portacabin / one room all day together with 30 other children, by a newly qualified teacher, getting zero exercise, in an underfunded under-equipped school, where bullying is not dealt with and 99% of the teacher’s time is spent trying to control the bullies and disruptive children and giving them special awards for not punching anyone today, or

(2) Being taught in class of 4-15 children, moving around different rooms throughout the day, being taught by experienced specialists in a beautiful well funded building, where the teacher’s time is spent teaching, good behaviour is rewarded and bullies / disruptive children are asked to leave instantly, and children get a good exercise class at least 3-4 days a week.

I infinitely regret the years I asked my child to put up with state education and I’d rather sell my house than go state for senior school.

Depends on the school and the cohort hugely.
DH and I met teaching at a private school, we would not send our DD to one. The management were vile, the parent were vile and I don't think the kids did any better than state tbf. Bullying rife.
He now works at a state school, it's outstanding, he loves it, ofsted 6 weeks ago was glowing, it's a great affluent catchment, there's no need for us to go private.
The local private kicked a kid out because they had dyscalculia, so of course their grades will be better. They can pick and chose their kids.
Not all states are that good. Not all private schools are great either IMO.
We both went to ok state schools, both professionals (me twice as I'm also a qualified accountant, stealth brag) , all our friends are professionals. We didn't do too badly.
Personally if you have a decent state school, save your money for a private tutor which will make way more difference.

The only serious bullying we’ve experienced was a teacher at the private school - bullied a friends daughter so badly they were worried she would kill herself. Never seen anything like this in a state school. In fact the teaching at state schools near us is generally excellent but we are Shropshire maybe different elsewhere

It depends on the child and the school options - both private and state. We have one in each at secondary stage. One had two years at state secondary and was miserable (not enough dyslexia support, disruptive classes and health issues at the time).she is now at private and loves it. Other is at state and also loves it (and would probably not suit private).

Not that it is particularly relevant but I went private ( part scholarship) and DP was state. We both left school with similar qualifications.

Depends on the comp, not all kids are in classes of 30. Our bottom science sets in the school I work at are very rarely above 20 in year 10&11. Middle sets tend to be about 25. So you need to find out what the school actually does with class sizes.

The only way you can make a private vs state judgement is in respect of a particular child, and specific state and private schools. It’s impossible to generalise.There are too many variables.

You’ve got to look at individual schools some are much better than others. You’ll get better sport and music private.

Honestly, if you can afford the fees, that gives you complete freedom to choose so look at each school on its merits, how each will suit your child's personality, strengths, social opportunities etc.

Private will not automatically be the best but check them out and see what you think. Ask your child for their opinion too. Try to arrange taster days.

Thanks everyone, it does seem to be the case that you can't generalise.

And as many people have mentioned it not just about the results, it's any extra opportunities/experiences that the school might provide.

I think for the schools I'm looking at it does seem that the private will offer significant advantages (academically as well as sports / art / drama etc). I take the point that some state schools won't have 30 in a class for every class, but overall the class sizes are definitely smaller at private.

I still think there must be a section of students that would have achieved better results if they had the opportunity to go to private Vs comp. And the difference in results isn't all down to the fact that grammar / private schools are selective. (And as mentioned the private I'm looking at is only semi selective anyway)

It absolutely depends on the exact schools you are comparing and how much money you have. If school fees are inconsequential in your budget and the private school is well run, not too small, has values that match your own, and doesn't fudge its exam results then it's almost certainly going to offer something more for a child without special needs. However, if paying school fees means you're going without something else, then it really depends on how much value the private school is adding compared to what else you could buy. If the state school is very good, then by going private you're paying a lot for a very small difference.

Kids with special needs who can manage in mainstream almost always seem to get better support in state schools, despite the funding challenges.

1,000 times this. The old boys network excuse is such a silly cope. Is my dentist friend from school supposed to be able give me a leg up in software development?

@bogoffeternal That's maybe a bit too simplistic. But being around more professional parents etc could help, in terms of shaping what the child aspires to be / and connections made that way / advice given along the way.

@Ilikepinacoladass "The private I am referencing isn't highly selective, half have been there since 3+"
It is selective by definition. One of the best indicators of academic success is having affluent parents. All state school pupils have affluent parents.

@Ilikepinacoladass Those are environmental factors. I think you're defining old boys network too broadly. The original post claimed "a potential 'old boy network' to give him a leg up in the future."

Around a quarter of the students have some kind of help with fees - but yes point taken that there will obviously be a lot more affluent parents and this gives an advantage in itself.

It still doesn't reassure me that a child from affluent parents will do just as well in a comp as they would do in a private school though

It makes sense to me that having more friends in high up professional roles could help career wise (or friends of their friends knowing someone who's hiring etc)? It's obviously not going to be true in every case / profession / network though.

We did it for the experiences, exposure, sports etc.

@CurlewKate
Exactly, they do. And the kids don't massively hang round with the parents anyway.
OP you sound like you just want to go private so ignore what any here has said and just do that rather than extolling the mainly imaginary virtues of private school.
Personally I'd prefer my child was happy.
Yes they prob get better results (in some cases) but that's because they are drilling it into the kids from day dot and because they ARE selective. Massively. Our local private school gives out handwriting sheets to three year olds in pre-prep, so so wrong, their hands aren't even developed enough to be writing. But as long as they make the connections and are round professionals right

Yeah, I see what you’re saying but I think IRL it really doesn’t work like that because your peers can’t help you that much given hiring protocols at the majority of large companies. I worked for 2 FTSE 10 companies plus and a major asset manager and there’s no way I could have just got a mate a job. The best I could have done was highlight a vacancy and maybe get them a first interview but I’d only have done that if I thought they were actually good. Honestly, most big companies are really trying to avoid this contacts stuff. They’re all about diversity and atypical hires.

I remember being around friends parents quite a lot in school actually? As we often went over for dinner after school etc.

Yes being happy is the most important thing for me too that goes without saying, if I thought the private was a hot house type place I wouldn't be considering it. And would be happy to move him if he wasn't enjoying it.

A big part of the appeal if the facilities/ sports / clubs / drama which I would have loved as a kid!

Some are more selective than others.

You say they aren't highly selective but do you know how many are managed out? How many are directed away from sitting their GCSE's at the school? How many are told to enter exams as external candidates in case their grades aren't up to scratch?

All of this and more happens in many private schools. You can also have less recourse to robust complaints procedures too. Lots of money spent on PR for admissions that don't live up to the hype etc. etc.

It all depends on the child and what is the best setting for them and that isn't always obvious, especially as both schools and children can change so much and sometimes rather dramatically....

I say this as a parent of children in both state and private and also having experienced both myself.