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Caught the school lying to us and GOSH about son's progress

389 replies

LolafromA · 30/04/2023 14:00

Hi everyone. Posting it here as I need an advice. Thanks in advance.
Long story short… My son who is now in Year 4 had speech delay. While still in Nursery we were told by SENCO to sort out the funding and apply for an EHCP. Which we did. Didn’t get the place in the same school so we got accepted to another one. Of course, the new school did not need our ‘funding’ and supported our son using their SEN budget. Now we understand how SEN budgets work so I know we got tricked. During Reception year my son’s speech was developing rapidly. He was a sweet boy, very compliant, had friends, loved going to school and enjoyed learning despite speech problems. The teacher described him to me as having a ‘math head’. Which made sense since my brother is Physicist and my husband Cambridge Uni graduate (Astrophysics).
We got a place eventually at the school that we wanted (that advised us to get an EHCP) and my son started Year 1. He settled well and we received positive feedback about his academic progress. The teacher said he just needs to be more independent but they will work on it.
Now a month later during Parent Teacher meeting I mention to the teacher that my son is being assessed by GOSH (2nd opinion) for High Functioning ASD and I will be bringing forms to fill out about his behaviours etc. The teacher seemed surprised that our son has been diagnosed with ASD (my son is in Year 4 now and I am still not 100% sure but at the same time I realise that I am probably surrounded by aspies in my family (math gene is strong). My brother reminds me of Elon Musk a lot - very inteligent, based in Silicon Valley, studied Physics, Optical Engineer, geeky etc.
Now since I mention ASD, things change at school. All of the sudden I am invited for a meeting with SENCO, teachers and S&L Therapist and told my son needs one on one in Math and English lessons four times a week, lego therapy, of course S&L therapy. The amount of funding needed I was shown £12k costs.
At the same time my son (Year 1, has just turned 6) was assessed by GOSH professionals and the tests showed my son’s spelling is as a 9yo, Math - 8 yo and Early Reading Skills - 7 yo.
Because of Covid lockdown I found out these results only at the beginning of Year 2. It all made sense to me because I could not understand how this clever boy needs so much support. Remember I had to teach him during lockdown myself.
Year 2 started and I would ask my child if he has a TA. He would say that no and he is learning together with the whole class. I started questioning TA arrangements with the school and was told that my son has TA now. Later turned out TA was spending only 20 min twice a week with my son. Smoke and mirrors I know… Then another lockdown started from around Xmas. Again I got to witness my boy how easy he is to work with, how amazing memory he has, reads a text - answer questions correctly, comprehends etc So after the lockdown I started calling Local Authority as I felt we are being exploited. His EHCP was bringing the school extra 3k (top up funding). I ceased EHCP at the end of Year 2. Speech Therapist was giving him identical English lessons that I had to teach my son during lockdown myself. So I realised it’s another ‘smoke & mirrors’. The school tried hard to pursue us to keep an ECHP however I followed my gut feeling and told them to stop all the support as my child doesn’t need it. And guess what? My son had a good Year 3.
Meantime GOSH sent Educational Psychologist to observe my son (beginning of Year 3). Around Xmas I get a report from
Gosh and I can’t believe what I am reading. See below.

Cognitive and Academic Development
L cannot maintain independent learning without support and prompting. Mr X reported that L is reading at approximately a year 2 level (1 year behind). However, comprehension is a significant struggle; L struggles with inference and even simple retrieval of information he has read. Even with modelling, he struggles to answer basic questions.
Friendships and Relationships
Mr X reported that L had one friend, and that if that child were absent one day L would probably be on his own (e.g. during breaks), as he would struggle to join in socially with the other children. Mr X said that L does not have good social skills and only has one friend.
Mr X informed me that L previously had 1:1 support most of the time but now does not. Mr X feels that Lukas does need 1:1 support as he is unable to work independently without support.

Meantime a month before that above feedback to GOSH, SENCO’s reply to us:

In terms of verbal interaction, we would be looking closely at how he is doing so in the classroom.
There is no dispute that he is interacting well with his close friends in the playground. I also added into the annual review report about vour observations of him in the playground with other children.
Indeed, LA may feel that the TA support that L requires can be met by the class TA. I have made it clear that he does not need full time 1:1 in the classroom. It is quite normal to prompt other children from time to time, L just needs a little more than this. Mr P (Year 2 teacher) said that L is a lovely child to have in the class and easy to work with.

So after reading the GOSH report I go and speak to Mr X and ask how come my son’s reading is a year behind. Mr X replies ‘Don’t worry about L’s reading. His reading is fine!’ I said ‘Well I have just read Gosh report and it said this and this. Mr X suggests to speak about it all via Zoom when Parent Teacher meeting happens.
PS My son always had a group of friends and is a popular, soft spoken boy, polite and its all written in the End of Year Reports.
So during Parent/ Teacher meeting Mr X tells me my son scored above average in comprehension tests, has a group of friends, very good in mental math, has good vocabulary etc
I contacted GOSH and emailed all the correspondence (evidence) from SENCO regarding my son. Emailed all the evidence of how my son scored top mark 40/40 in Phonics and what Mr X said about his comprehension, friendships etc
GOSH right away arranged joint Zoom meeting with Mr X, SENCO and me. And all lies have been exposed. Complete silence from SENCO! They did not even try to defend their previous feedback.
GOSH said kids like L fly under the radar, his ASD case is subtle, he will do well academically and when he is a teen he may find it harder to fit in, may get depressed.
By the way GOSH Educational Psychologist in his report said he doesn’t see any anxiety in my son and that L is a very happy child from what he observed during PE lesson. Also at the end of Year 3 Mr X (Year 3 teacher) reported my child as very confident.
So Year 4 starts (this school year) and during Parent/ Teacher meeting Mrs F starts throwing hints at me how L has ADHD. I know.. lol I explained to her that he definitely does not. I studied and educated myself on both - Asd (subtle cases) and ADHD. SENCO gets called in. Complete silence from her. I leave the meeting saying how it’s time for us to have a meeting with the Headteacher which we did. I was furious! We had a meeting, brought up conflicting feedback to GOSH and was told it was Mr X’s opinion at the time about my son’s comprehension. Basically they had an answer for everything eg it was teacher’s opinion.
So I ended up requesting Subject Access Request (all educational records of my child since Year 1). Have a look at the image attached. My son never had comprehension problems!!!! In fact he scored high average!
My question here on Mumsnet would be - what do I do now? Report the school to Local Authority, Ofsted, Dept of Education? I complained to the Chair of Governors but received a reply with little answers. Mainly he advised to contact LA and was opologetic.
Every time my son has assessments now I ask the teacher Mrs F to email me his results. My son is excelling academically, she said he is mixing with the boys and girls, has a close group of friends which obviously I always knew since I organise playdates, meet with his friends/ parents in the playgrounds. I see how he interacts. You would not even know he has ASD but as I mentioned earlier, lets see how his teenage years go. Maybe that’s when I will see the symptoms.
As of now I need a realistic advice on what can be done to expose / stop the school doing this to another family.
Thank you.

OP posts:
AbbaG12 · 01/05/2023 12:26

LolafromA · 01/05/2023 12:13

My son is well behaved over all. No disturbing behaviours reported in Year 4 (this school year)! So it seems the school misinterpreted it last year! My son was just messing about with his friends.

Do you want your son to stay at the school?

Do you want some wya of reporting the school?

Shinyandnew1 · 01/05/2023 12:27

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 12:22

God knows, two hundred posts in and it's not any clearer. I actually feel really sorry for the school I bet they are counting down the days.

Me too.

To be honest, the post is so identifiable (even without the OP later adding her son’s actual name), I suspect the chances of someone at the school having already seen it are extremely high!

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 12:30

@Shinyandnew1 well there will be very few parents willingly give up an EHCP for a start. They might not be the golden ticket they are purported to be but they are a way of ensuring that your child gets the support they need in these cash strapped times if you make sure they are enforceable.

Samee20 · 01/05/2023 12:34

@LolafromA ask yourself- what's your end goal and what do you wish to achieve? Do you feel the process of diagnosing your child was not justified? If yes, then you do need to speak to the medical professionals or speak to a parent whose child has been diagnosed with the same to know if something has been missed out. It will give you more clarity and peace of mind.
If you feel the school is exaggerating his needs then you do need to change his school, as one of the poster has written where she was facing the same and she put her child in a different setting and she was happy with it. As your child is in year 4 now I believe this has been going for atleast a few years now. So it's time to make a decision for your child and for your peace of mind. X

spanieleyes · 01/05/2023 12:36

Presumably the OP is aware that , during lockdown, schools didn't have to provide the entitled provision from an EHCP, so the fact that the TA was only providing SALT during lockdown isn't surprising. We had all our SEND children in during lockdown but only around half the TAs were available during this time so we did the best we could, which is all we were required to do!

elliejjtiny · 01/05/2023 12:39

Personally I find this whole situation really weird. In my experience with one child having an ehcp, 1 being assessed for one and 2 needing one but with no chance of getting one then it's extremely hard to get an ehcp or a diagnosis of autism or adhd unless the child's needs are extremely severe. My 15 year old is obviously autistic to any professional who sees him and he attempted suicide at 12 but he is still a year away from being assessed for autism. My 9 year old with a learning disability and an IQ of 48 only got an EHCP in year 3. I see many children like them who struggle with inadequate funding. This is the first time I have heard of a child getting too much funding.

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 12:41

@spanieleyes it sounds like your school did a lot more than most. D was in independent specialist then so she went to school throughout as normal as did everyone in her school. Special schools were closed here throughout and many children in mainstream with EHCPs weren't given places either. Our LA decided when the regulations were relaxed that they only needed to make a weekly phone call to meet their duty to children with EHCPs.

Sirzy · 01/05/2023 12:41

I have only read your posts but it comes across as your playing down his needs.

most parents have to fight authorities for that level of support, it’s not given out like candy! Nor are diagnosises given without there being clear evidence.

spanieleyes · 01/05/2023 12:42

@hiredandsqueak
We were nominated for an award for our lockdown provisionđŸ˜‡

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 12:44

spanieleyes · 01/05/2023 12:42

@hiredandsqueak
We were nominated for an award for our lockdown provisionđŸ˜‡

Well deserved from the sounds of it and from the experiences of many I know.

FloatingBean · 01/05/2023 12:50

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 12:44

Well deserved from the sounds of it and from the experiences of many I know.

@spanieleyes I second this. Many schools washed their hands of all/the vast majority of DC’s with EHCPs during lockdown. DS3 was offered a place but my DSs were shielding so didn’t attend, but many locally weren’t offered places when they needed them.

LolafromA · 01/05/2023 12:51

Shinyandnew1 · 01/05/2023 12:20

So, what do you actually want to happen?!!

One thing for sure is that I need to contact GOSH (to report that disruptive behaviours were not a symptom of ASD). I need my child to get reassessed for ASD one more time even if it’s privately done because he is so developed in comparison to when he was diagnosed. I can’t believe how positive I am about ASD??! I just assume he is going to be good in Math, Science, maybe will be a bit geeky. Things don’t make sense as of now. I will wait until he is in Year 6. Who knows maybe by that time ‘the wheels will fall off’.
I know I should not worry about something that didn’t happen yet so I will go with the flow when it comes to getting ECHP reinstated.
Also I don’t want to change schools since my son formed all these long term friendships. He is happy at this school. So I will be easier on school and will be less paranoid. :-)
Trust me I don’t even think of ASD on a daily basis. We just seem to live normal lives. However I do doubt if my son is diagnosed correctly because how normal he is!

I appreciate all your advice. I am a foreigner and don’t understand how the UK educational
system works. I have better understanding now.

I will be deleting this thread.

Have a good day everyone!

OP posts:
Sirzy · 01/05/2023 12:51

We where very lucky that Ds school provided him with 1-1 via teams (he couldn’t go in as sheilding) obviously not the same as doing it in school but meant he didn’t miss out as much as many did. She even managed to keep up the schools OT program!

spanieleyes · 01/05/2023 12:56

@Sirzy
We had a child with an EHCP who was shielding, he did online work throughout. He couldn't cope with full time online provision, it was too much for him, but he did 2-3 hours daily. His 1:1 did speech and language, physiotherapy along side the " academic" subjects. His 1:1 was also shielding, so it worked out well!

FloatingBean · 01/05/2023 13:00

DS3 (and DS1 who has EOTAS) had online provision including therapies but they struggle to engage with online provision/appointments so it didn’t work well, but I appreciated the effort of trying.

spanieleyes · 01/05/2023 13:02

Why do you need him to be reassessed? It's not as if he walks round with a visible label on him, you need never mention it again unless/until you need to.
My son has an ASD diagnosis, the classic Aspergers type, good at maths, socially awkward, lives independently, works but develops anxieties- mainly over his health. When he went to university, he never mentioned it, didn't need to. He didn't mention it when he began work but, as his health anxieties grew, he explained why. There may come a time when your child needs the diagnosis, maybe not. But if it is there, in the background, it might come in handy one day. A diagnosis isn't handed out without reason.

hiredandsqueak · 01/05/2023 13:08

@LolafromA You have had two assessments and two diagnoses from two seperate providers. GOSH are considered experts in the field so not sure yet another assessment is warranted. FWIW my dd has never misbehaved in her life, she's never raised her voice or refused to do anything that she has been asked. She definitely has ASD even if she fits none of the stereotypical behaviours that you seem to think are vital for a diagnosis.

Shinyandnew1 · 01/05/2023 13:13

One thing for sure is that I need to contact GOSH (to report that disruptive behaviours were not a symptom of ASD)

I’m sure paediatricians at Great Ormond
St are well aware of the signs of ASD!

If you are saying that your child has had two separate multi-disciplinary teams diagnose him with autism but you think they are all wrong, then perhaps it’s them you need to be criticising, not the school?

Almahart · 01/05/2023 13:20

This thread is unbelievably frustrating to read.

Children with ASD can present as disruptive, either because they don't understand the usual rules of social interaction and shout out, or interrupt, or because they are overwhelmed and can't bear to be in the environment they are in, eg in assembly or a noisy classroom.

LolafromA · 01/05/2023 13:38

By the way is it normal for GOSH to put 2 diagnosis in my son’s records? They never mentioned Language Disorder to me but it says in their reports they diagnose my son with both - Language Disorder and a year later entry done (I did SAR all reports from GOSH) for ASD. I get an idea that first they thought he has DLD (Language Disorder) a year later - ASD (last year). That’s why I question my son’s diagnosis. What if it is DLD after all??

OP posts:
OneFrenchEgg · 01/05/2023 13:44

@LolafromA
i will be deleting this thread.

Just a heads up, this site etiquette is that people don't really get threads deleted unless significant privacy concerns/really gone nasty etc. I know other forums have self delete functions.
So if you do get this deleted for a second time you may find people less keen to engage if you post about the same thing again:

Because sometimes the advice is helpful for other people
Because it's irritating in 'Threads I'm On'
Because some people invest time offering advice (I appreciate some comments aren't helpful)
Etc.

liveforsummer · 01/05/2023 13:45

It doesn't have to be one or the other. People with ASD often have other diagnoses running along side.

OneFrenchEgg · 01/05/2023 13:46

You know what I do? I would go and see your local IASS and ask them to help with a plan of action/wait and see.

It's confidential, free, often knows local schools etc. I know there are criticisms but for this type of complex 'sorting out your thoughts' thing it's really helpful.

councilfordisabledchildren.org.uk/about-us-0/networks/information-advice-and-support-services-network/find-your-local-ias-service

Leftoverssandwich · 01/05/2023 13:49

It could easily be both.

OP, what does your son’s EHCP say he is working towards? What are his targets? What did you put as your parental contribution? The way you write about it makes it sound like you had no input at all. Were there annual reviews to track progress?

I have three children with ASD (and ADHD too) and only one has an ECHP. That provides for a full time 1:1 without which they would not be able to cope at school.

I would give anything for another of mine to have one, so they could access more specialist provision, but am not getting support from the school because they are not at crisis point ‘yet’. I suspect I am only one of many parents reading this thread feeling hugely envious of the support you have been able to access for your son.

Socially my kids were all fine in early primary. They now all struggle, to varying degrees, but have been bullied, excluded, no party invitations etc. The autistic brain in each of them has been unable to read the far more sophisticated social code to that develops towards the end of primary. My youngest remains hugely popular on the face of it, and to meet them you might well not think any issues at all present, but they are the one with 1:1 support.

Only one of them excelled at maths.

Your view of ASD is very, very specific. I can imagine it was reassuring at diagnosis and beyond to read about positive role models in autism. The people you mention are exceptional by any measure. But most people with autism will not be particularly exciting or remarkable, beyond the way in which we are ALL remarkable. I just want my kids to grow up as happy and well supported as possible to become themselves. That means accepting that they find a variety of things challenging and meeting the additional needs that result. An EHCP can make that so, so much easier through their school years.

LolafromA · 01/05/2023 13:49

OneFrenchEgg · 01/05/2023 13:44

@LolafromA
i will be deleting this thread.

Just a heads up, this site etiquette is that people don't really get threads deleted unless significant privacy concerns/really gone nasty etc. I know other forums have self delete functions.
So if you do get this deleted for a second time you may find people less keen to engage if you post about the same thing again:

Because sometimes the advice is helpful for other people
Because it's irritating in 'Threads I'm On'
Because some people invest time offering advice (I appreciate some comments aren't helpful)
Etc.

Oh, I see. Thanks for explaining. I thought you have a right to delete the thread. This was my first time posting here.

OP posts: