Caught the school lying to us and GOSH about son's progress

[LolafromA]

Hi everyone. Posting it here as I need an advice. Thanks in advance.
Long story short… My son who is now in Year 4 had speech delay. While still in Nursery we were told by SENCO to sort out the funding and apply for an EHCP. Which we did. Didn’t get the place in the same school so we got accepted to another one. Of course, the new school did not need our ‘funding’ and supported our son using their SEN budget. Now we understand how SEN budgets work so I know we got tricked. During Reception year my son’s speech was developing rapidly. He was a sweet boy, very compliant, had friends, loved going to school and enjoyed learning despite speech problems. The teacher described him to me as having a ‘math head’. Which made sense since my brother is Physicist and my husband Cambridge Uni graduate (Astrophysics).
We got a place eventually at the school that we wanted (that advised us to get an EHCP) and my son started Year 1. He settled well and we received positive feedback about his academic progress. The teacher said he just needs to be more independent but they will work on it.
Now a month later during Parent Teacher meeting I mention to the teacher that my son is being assessed by GOSH (2nd opinion) for High Functioning ASD and I will be bringing forms to fill out about his behaviours etc. The teacher seemed surprised that our son has been diagnosed with ASD (my son is in Year 4 now and I am still not 100% sure but at the same time I realise that I am probably surrounded by aspies in my family (math gene is strong). My brother reminds me of Elon Musk a lot - very inteligent, based in Silicon Valley, studied Physics, Optical Engineer, geeky etc.
Now since I mention ASD, things change at school. All of the sudden I am invited for a meeting with SENCO, teachers and S&L Therapist and told my son needs one on one in Math and English lessons four times a week, lego therapy, of course S&L therapy. The amount of funding needed I was shown £12k costs.
At the same time my son (Year 1, has just turned 6) was assessed by GOSH professionals and the tests showed my son’s spelling is as a 9yo, Math - 8 yo and Early Reading Skills - 7 yo.
Because of Covid lockdown I found out these results only at the beginning of Year 2. It all made sense to me because I could not understand how this clever boy needs so much support. Remember I had to teach him during lockdown myself.
Year 2 started and I would ask my child if he has a TA. He would say that no and he is learning together with the whole class. I started questioning TA arrangements with the school and was told that my son has TA now. Later turned out TA was spending only 20 min twice a week with my son. Smoke and mirrors I know… Then another lockdown started from around Xmas. Again I got to witness my boy how easy he is to work with, how amazing memory he has, reads a text - answer questions correctly, comprehends etc So after the lockdown I started calling Local Authority as I felt we are being exploited. His EHCP was bringing the school extra 3k (top up funding). I ceased EHCP at the end of Year 2. Speech Therapist was giving him identical English lessons that I had to teach my son during lockdown myself. So I realised it’s another ‘smoke & mirrors’. The school tried hard to pursue us to keep an ECHP however I followed my gut feeling and told them to stop all the support as my child doesn’t need it. And guess what? My son had a good Year 3.
Meantime GOSH sent Educational Psychologist to observe my son (beginning of Year 3). Around Xmas I get a report from
Gosh and I can’t believe what I am reading. See below.

Cognitive and Academic Development
L cannot maintain independent learning without support and prompting. Mr X reported that L is reading at approximately a year 2 level (1 year behind). However, comprehension is a significant struggle; L struggles with inference and even simple retrieval of information he has read. Even with modelling, he struggles to answer basic questions.
Friendships and Relationships
Mr X reported that L had one friend, and that if that child were absent one day L would probably be on his own (e.g. during breaks), as he would struggle to join in socially with the other children. Mr X said that L does not have good social skills and only has one friend.
Mr X informed me that L previously had 1:1 support most of the time but now does not. Mr X feels that Lukas does need 1:1 support as he is unable to work independently without support.

Meantime a month before that above feedback to GOSH, SENCO’s reply to us:

In terms of verbal interaction, we would be looking closely at how he is doing so in the classroom.
There is no dispute that he is interacting well with his close friends in the playground. I also added into the annual review report about vour observations of him in the playground with other children.
Indeed, LA may feel that the TA support that L requires can be met by the class TA. I have made it clear that he does not need full time 1:1 in the classroom. It is quite normal to prompt other children from time to time, L just needs a little more than this. Mr P (Year 2 teacher) said that L is a lovely child to have in the class and easy to work with.

So after reading the GOSH report I go and speak to Mr X and ask how come my son’s reading is a year behind. Mr X replies ‘Don’t worry about L’s reading. His reading is fine!’ I said ‘Well I have just read Gosh report and it said this and this. Mr X suggests to speak about it all via Zoom when Parent Teacher meeting happens.
PS My son always had a group of friends and is a popular, soft spoken boy, polite and its all written in the End of Year Reports.
So during Parent/ Teacher meeting Mr X tells me my son scored above average in comprehension tests, has a group of friends, very good in mental math, has good vocabulary etc
I contacted GOSH and emailed all the correspondence (evidence) from SENCO regarding my son. Emailed all the evidence of how my son scored top mark 40/40 in Phonics and what Mr X said about his comprehension, friendships etc
GOSH right away arranged joint Zoom meeting with Mr X, SENCO and me. And all lies have been exposed. Complete silence from SENCO! They did not even try to defend their previous feedback.
GOSH said kids like L fly under the radar, his ASD case is subtle, he will do well academically and when he is a teen he may find it harder to fit in, may get depressed.
By the way GOSH Educational Psychologist in his report said he doesn’t see any anxiety in my son and that L is a very happy child from what he observed during PE lesson. Also at the end of Year 3 Mr X (Year 3 teacher) reported my child as very confident.
So Year 4 starts (this school year) and during Parent/ Teacher meeting Mrs F starts throwing hints at me how L has ADHD. I know.. lol I explained to her that he definitely does not. I studied and educated myself on both - Asd (subtle cases) and ADHD. SENCO gets called in. Complete silence from her. I leave the meeting saying how it’s time for us to have a meeting with the Headteacher which we did. I was furious! We had a meeting, brought up conflicting feedback to GOSH and was told it was Mr X’s opinion at the time about my son’s comprehension. Basically they had an answer for everything eg it was teacher’s opinion.
So I ended up requesting Subject Access Request (all educational records of my child since Year 1). Have a look at the image attached. My son never had comprehension problems!!!! In fact he scored high average!
My question here on Mumsnet would be - what do I do now? Report the school to Local Authority, Ofsted, Dept of Education? I complained to the Chair of Governors but received a reply with little answers. Mainly he advised to contact LA and was opologetic.
Every time my son has assessments now I ask the teacher Mrs F to email me his results. My son is excelling academically, she said he is mixing with the boys and girls, has a close group of friends which obviously I always knew since I organise playdates, meet with his friends/ parents in the playgrounds. I see how he interacts. You would not even know he has ASD but as I mentioned earlier, lets see how his teenage years go. Maybe that’s when I will see the symptoms.
As of now I need a realistic advice on what can be done to expose / stop the school doing this to another family.
Thank you.

During GOSH assessment Dr C says to my son ‘I went to the seaside last weekend. I had my favourite meal there’. My son goes ‘What was that?’
I requested to see ADOS brochure where she did markings and was refused. I did request SAR and there were lots of black colored pages. No ADOS. I sent an email to GOSH asking about it and the doctor shared only score results.
But what I am saying that my son read 1 social cue after all! So confusing…

She said something because of ‘copyright reasons’ or something like that. I can word exactly what she said. But, yeah, I was not aloud to see it. She emailed me only scores. Eg Task 1 - 2 points, task 2 - 2 points. Something like that.

That is so awesome! 😀 DD1 told the assessors off in her ADOS. She said "I don't like waiting!" She's polar opposite to DD2.

But it doesn't have to be all or nothing, if a child got one social cue it doesn't mean they didn't miss others. My example above where dd spoke as she did, it was precoccious, it was obviously echoing something she had heard and not typical speech from a not yet two year old, her speech showed none of the usual local accent it was cut glass RP. So yes on face value she spoke long and complicated sentences and was able to get her desires across but a SALT recognised her speech for what it really was.

I just told my (very definitely autistic) child that I’d had a lovely dinner tonight. They immediately said ‘what was it?’.

The spectrum nature of ASD means that it’s not helpful to look to compare your child against others if looking for evidence of something (although often reassuring if there IS some commonality).

I think you do need to work through where the diagnosis came from again, down the road now you’re not just trying to absorb it all. Can the team as GOSH offer to talk you through it again? If you feel after that that it really doesn’t match your son now he is a bit older, then can you open a discussion about what you think doesn’t fit against the things specific to your child that led to the original diagnosis?

Every area will have a score that is 'allowed' and a score that is diagnostic. If he got a diagnosis, he scored above the threshold for the areas.

Only clinicians that are trained in providing the ADOS are allowed to buy the scoring sheets, manuals, etc.

I remember Dr C put some colouring pencils, some old radio, a little box and a fidget spinner on the table. My son right away went for a spinner!
The funny thing was while my son was being assessed both - Dr C and another lady who took notes were wearing facial masks. :-) Considering my son had somehow read faces etc during the assessment. Weird. :-)

The puzzle task really surprised me with DD2, she is articulate yet when she needed the remaining pieces she didn’t ask for them even when the assessor repeatedly moved them out of reach.

DD2 was the same! The assessor put her hands around them as DD2 worked with the pieces. DD2 just looked discombobulated. Eventually, after a few minutes, DD2 said something, but it was agonising.

DD2 told them that she was going to live with husky dogs in Alaska because dogs don't put demands on you like humans do 😂

I think this ongoing battle between consultant specialists and school yearly reviews is actually a very dangerous process , after schooling 2 generations of send family it is clear that in 30 yrs this funding grab has overridden medical diagnosis and parents/carers concerns , the tactics used to distort these reviews knows no boundaries, seating placement ,pushing buttons of both pupils and parents to breaking point and spreading misinformation to teachers is only a very small part of our experience,the problem then extends after school age and beyond often with unsafe mechanisms preventing ability to request or refuse medical treatments , send pupils become send adults and the pathway to independent living may be restricted by flags raised during education , often the person bears no resemblance to their local authority medical notes which have likely been distorted throughout their education !!! So an intelligent adult has been labelled as a small child as to having no ability to gain education yet they are also labelled as not being disabled !! Preventing support and possibly preventing access to medical tests and the rights to refuse treatment !! So when a parent is flagged as abusing their child if they dare to ask for a second opinion it is incredible that this unfazed inhumane practice has been tolerated for so many decades and the staff that are forced by these cruel practices have failed to protect these vulnerable children!!

Hi everyone. So update from me since my son is graduating Primary this year (Y6). Ok, where do I start? GOSH were right, that my son will do well academically and interact with others but a but differently (might be literal, for example). Yes, my boy is doing really well. No anxiety (yet)!!:-) He has the same group of friends (6-7 boys/ girls). He is really confident. He is with above average intelligence and he knows it, haha. In SATs he is predicted results - Reading 106, Maths - 113, SPAG - 112. Did he ever need EHCP? No!!! And I doubt he will ever will. He is natural in Maths and Science. In leavers book he wrote he wants to be Airspace Engineer or Quantum Physicist and Yourtuber (he already has his own YouTube channel and those subscribers are growing!). What I found out about my own family that my brother is autistic (old Asperger’s). It’s all genetic. Goes from generation to generation. And I understand it now. My brother is highly paid Principal Engineer at Silicon Valley (Optical Physics). He was also speach delayed as a child but very intelligent. Now I see the autistic side of him. I just had to educate myself about it. It’s Bill Gates, Elon Musk type of ASD. My kids dad undiagnosed but most likely Autistic too. Cambridge Uni grad (Natural Sciences and Astrophysics). My 7 yo (I have two boys) also was speech delayed and the school also pushed for an ECHP and I refused. Guess what, my child caught up in all areas as well. These kids just develop differently but academically they are so more than ok. Very loveable, well behaved, has friends, very sociable child, happy, good memory, good at maths, etc These kids are teacher’s dream! Oh, my 11yo is in top set in Maths. I am well aware how teenage years might be more difficult so we will see. Btw all his friends turns out are neurodivergent too! They talk between themselves about neurodivergence. Lol There is no shame to be geek anymore. Kind of cool!

@LolafromA I'm so glad you're happy. Be aware that things can and do change. My DD's were ok ISH until year 9/10, then completely fell apart

Did he ever need EHCP? No!!!

LAs don’t issue EHCPs if the legal threshold isn’t met (and even when it is they often refuse).

EHCPs aren’t just about academic ability. Academically able DC can have EHCPs.

Yes. So he had it when he was in Reception based on speech delay only. The moment his speech developed that was it and he didn’t need it anymore. The way I see it, that the school doesn’t want to spend money for S&L therapy, even if it’s minimal. They had to exaggerate and lie to us parents for him to qualify. However nothing made sense to me. I see everything clearly now. When I refused an ECHP for my 2nd boy, they ended up giving him S&L sessions anyways and his speach developed rapidly on its own anyways. The school and school’s therapist tried to exploit us again saying my son has verbal apraxia. I mean what the heck?? How come he is fluent now with no therapy??lol At that moment I quit the speach therapy and did not allow any reports to be used. They are exaggerating and faking it. You read the report and see ‘hidden messages’. The teacher was confused herself when confronted and asked to clarify. Maybe it’s a coincidence but the Head is ‘retiring’ now. As I said few ears ago here, we complained to governors. Some things improved since the complaint eg., the school started reporting NFER results to parents. In the past four years ago (Year 2) the school didn’t want us to know that our son is doing well in eg NFER tests.
Anyways all is good now, no more games from school, honest reporting etc.Boys of my boys enjoy school.
I am aware about teenage years and it’s scary but we will go with the flow. He is moving to a great secondary school and I see him thriving there.
My brother is 8 years older than me and growing up I don’t remember him having any issues during teenage years. His generation, our parents generation went undiagnosed. Somehow they made it. My son is so similar to my brother, same hobbies, same abilities for understanding Science, Maths.. They are really good kids, good people.
I will update it here again in a few years or when the wheels fall off.

Your post said DS didn’t ever need an EHCP. LAs don’t issue EHCPs if the legal test isn’t met. EHCPs aren’t issued solely based on the school’s word. DS might not meet the threshold for an EHCP now, but he clearly did when it was issued.

I have two boys and both had speach delay. Identical development, different personalities, although my older one said recently he is both extrovert and introvert, haha.. No other ‘problems’. The school pushed us parents to apply for an ECHP in both cases solely on speech delay grounds. Thats it. Both boys developed their speech and were both fluent before their 7th birthday.
GOSH told me kids like my son fly under the radar as they do well academically and have friends. They may struggle or maybe not when they are teenagers. Dr Clark said ‘you don’t need to worry about him (my son’; he is going to be fine.
To conclude - both of my boys just needed longer to develop. I don’t think about it anymore, but if I remember well, the school can’t apply for an EHCP unless they prove that they spend a significant amount of money on your child. So yeah, one of my sons had it because we parent applied pushed by school, second time with the second child, we did not. The outcome is the same. They speak and they are well behaved, fast learners, happy etc. That’s it.

None of which changes the fact the LA would not have issued an EHCP unless the legal threshold was met. Being academic, well behaved, happy having friends, now speaking fluently, etc. don’t mean the legal threshold wasn’t met.

the school can’t apply for an EHCP unless they prove that they spend a significant amount of money on your child.

This is not true.

I remember how the Head during the meeting said to us ‘Speech Therapy is expensive..’. They play the parents and the system to get that extra funding from LA. I fully understand it now. During covid I homeschooled myself my son (Year 1) and I remember myself thinking ‘god he is smart’! He was so easy to teach. His brain processes information fast I assume and it stays there.
I don’t know how EHCPs work. As I said I don’t think about it anymore.
Ours was all about S&L. In Year 2 because it was covid and I used to sit next to my son during the therapy and think how it’s becoming a waste of time and LA’ resources as the therapist had nothing much left to teach, sound ‘th’..:-) I knew that was the end of it and I ceased it. I remember in Year 4 teacher wrote in his end of year report how he has a talent for Maths. I see him a lot like my bother. If I had to choose famous person, I would say Bill Gates, Elon Musk type. Just geeky kids who happen to love maths, science. But then, as my son said recently, ‘I want to socialise too’.:-D Very interesting profile of ASD.

Again, that doesn’t mean the legal test for an EHCP wasn’t met.

And SALT provision isn’t detailed, specified and quantified in F of an EHCP just because a school wants it to be.

You know, I have no clue what was met or what was not.. I just know our story, our experience. My child's needs were 100% exaggerated. Eg he needs an adult to sit next to him during Maths lessons (£4000) and English lessons (another 4k). So I ask my son (Year 1) is anyone sitting next to you during lessons?? My son says no..!!
Apparently he was learning just like any other kid. Then lockdown started (unexpectedly) and I got to witness how he is learning. Nothing made sense of what the school was telling me. Did he need a person sitting next to him??? 1000% NO. They are 6 year olds for gods sake, learning independence etc.
For an ECHP a child must have SEN needs. Once my son started speaking (comprehension was never a problem) that was it. Zero sen needs. At the Reception year, yes, we knew our child is speaking but 90% we cant understand of what he says. He was put on ASD pathway or whatever it’s called. He was assessed by GOSH (Year 1; just turned 6) and his speech was still messed up. And then in Year 2 he was fluent. In Year 3 I quote the teacher ‘he has very rich vocabulary, excels in SPAG’. Now we don’t even look back.

You said an EHCP wasn’t ever needed. That obviously wasn’t the case because the LA wouldn’t have issued one if it wasn’t. That was my point. Not about now.

The way I understand EHCP was unnecessary. Anyway what it is? Just a document telling the school to provide S&L therapy to my child?? The school obviously doesn’t want to spend money but they know how to get that top up. So they tell the parent that your child is struggling and needs £12K of funding. The parent obviously agrees with whatever as long as the child is supported. But then like in our case, covid starts, you do schoolwork with your child and you start questioning, how come he needs that much support??
I found it weird that the old school (Reception year; we moved to the closer one) didn’t push us to apply for an EHCP, but the new school told us to apply and ‘to sort out funding’. So I thought at the beginning that with an ECHP we ‘unlock’ extra funding for our son's S&L therapy. Meantime the old school just used their own budget.
I hope it’s clearer now..

That shows that you don’t understand EHCPs.

It isn’t weird that some schools don’t suggest an EHCP and others do. Quite common. Not about playing the system.

I definitely don’t understand EHCPs. But as the Head of the new school said ‘you know S&L therapy is expensive’…. Well, what does it say to me? That they don’t want to spend money from their budget.

It tells you the HT is explaining the system to you. Beyond the normal NHS offer, SALT is rarely funded at a school SEN support level. It is only funded with an EHCP if the provision is detailed, specified and quantified in F - and that doesn’t happen just because a school says so.