Eltham College, selective school with A* %39 GCSe results?

[larriss]

Hi all,

We will move to South East London next year Currently my kids are in state school in East London. But we will try to move them to the independent school when we move to SE. I am trying to find out which school we should apply in September and which area we need to move. We have twins in year 1 at the moment. So in September 2024 they will be year 3. . We moved to UK 5 years ago so I am not sure about “single sex schools”? All most all our friends here recommended us single sex school for our girls. I searched online as well, articles, reports also states that girls do better in girls only school especially in secondary stage.
My daughters are doing great in their schools right now, they are well above average in all subjects. When we practice for 7+ at home they also do amazing. I do believe they can even get a offer from all of the schools. But that doesn’t mean they need to be in top academic school but we will pay a lot of money more than 10 years so I would like to make sure that it is worth to go. Also, we need to move before December 2023 so I would like to decide which area we will be moving. In addition, as my twins are small I don’t prefer them to travel by school bus - I am planning to drive so I need to make sure I live close to one of these schools:

I liked JAGS - results, facilities looks great. With school bus girls needs to travel almost a hour (twice). I heard some girls had health issues because of the pressure of school. Is that true?

Allenys - results and facilities are so similar to JAGS but its coed. If it was for me, I think I would choose this school for me:)
Meanwhile I am not sure about the Dulwich area - never visited before. Is it nice place to live with kids?

Eltham College - they say its selective because its starts at year 3 (7+) nevertheless exam results are not good for selective school. A* %39 -
I can not imagine if their entry point was nursery (3+)- but still not sure if we need to consider it. Please let me know if you recommend it. Plus, we are not Christian. Do you its going to be a problem for our girls? Also the bad presses about this school, are they true story?
I visited Eltham/Mottingham area I didn’t like it a lot. Am I wrong?

Colfes - its coed, big school with large green space. But when I visited I didn’t like the Junior side of the school however senior side was better. The disadvantage of this school is students needs to take 11+ exam to move to senior side. Its looks like it is a academic school but results also not so good when we consider that.

Blackheath High - smaller than other schools I think. Its girls only school. Entry point is 3+ and A* GCSE results are 34%. They say its not selective as girls in juniors can move to senior side automatically. But results are so similar with Colfes and Eltham College? - which they say they are more selective in 7+ and 11+?
I liked the Blackheath/Greenwich area. Green space, Greenwich park and Blackheath-Lewisham DLR is so close to city. (Transport is important for us my husband is working the city).

Colfes - its coed, big school with large green space. But when I visited I didn’t like the Junior side of the school however senior side was better. The disadvantage of this school is students needs to take 11+ exam to move to senior side. Its looks like it is a academic school but results also not so good when we consider that.
Colfes school in Lee, also close to the Blackheath.

What I don’t understand is how come Eltham College is more selective school but results are so similar to Colfes or Blackheath? I really want to know if it is worth to move Eltham? Also when I checked the official website of Eltham College and Colfes. Colfes results was better in 2022 but in league tables Eltham College always above from Colfes. Do you know the reason?

I will be so pleased if you let me know WWYD.

Thank you so much.

They're all good schools.

Dulwich/Greenwich/Blackheath all v nice places to live.

JAGS and Alleyns are more selective than the others. Think Eltham/Colfes/Blackheath all about the same?

@TJsAunt Thank you. So I think we need to decide if it will be “ coed or girls only school “ to help us choose which one to go but I believe thats the hardest decision x

I have children in both Alleyn’s and JAGS - both are very happy.
Re: eating disorders are more common in girls; girls schools have a lot more girls than a co-Ed, ergo more eating disorder in absolute numbers in the former but maybe not in relative numbers.

My sons were very happy at Eltham, the extra activities were great for music and sports and the school helped them achieve their DOE awards. You could live nearby in chislehurst, Sundridge Park, Bickley or Elmstead Woods. What's your housing budget. You could also look at Farringdons school.

We had the similar dilemma. In the end my daughter preferred Blackheath High, because of the easy commute and girls only environment. All schools are good and they all have pros and cons. But mental health and their happiness comes first. You know your daughters best, visit the schools and follow your gut feeling. Bright and happy children do well in all of these schools.

My daughter is at Blackheath High. She loves it. Its good mix of everything… I always liked JAGS and my daughter had an offer however it was too far for us so we chose it. Greenwich Blackheath and Dulwich all good places to live with children. I dont know much about Eltham area, sorry.

we DIDNT chose it*

sorry I typed it wrong!

There are free really good grammar schools in outer South East London Newstead in Bromley and Bexley Grammar (small catchment), Chis & Sid and Townley Grammar (also all girls). If the kids are reasonably academic, passing the Bexley test with some preparation isn’t that difficult. You can check the rough catchments on the Bexley education websites and Newstead has a big catchment of 9 miles. There are also now grammar school annexes in Sevenoaks - and you can access the Tonbridge Grammars and Newstead on train from there too.

If you are happy with state school now why move?

If your kids are clever, no I do not think it is worth paying top money for schools like Eltham College or Colfe’s when the grammars have better results. Make sure they read loads and tutor a bit either yourself or get someone experienced to do it in the run up to exams. In any event, I would use schools like Colfe’s or Eltham more as a back up if they don’t get into a grammar school.

On the other hand OP if you are really rich and can afford a nice house in Dulwich or Blackheath and send them to eg JAGS or Blackheath High within walking distance and still be comfortable and have holidays, go for it. But no way would I move to Eltham to not the nicest area (it is fine, but Dulwich and Blackheath definitely nicer) and pay for somewhere like Eltham College when there are free state alternatives with good results.

Dulwich and Blackheath are both nice to live in. We live in Dulwich and have happy DC at Alleyns. The 7+ for JAGs and Alleyns isn't a sure thing even for a bright child but if you move to Dulwich you can also apply to Sydenham Girls as well as well the the state schools are really strong including at secondary. The Charter outperforms plenty of private schools academically and you also have Kingsdale.

As you have girls you have more choice with g d s t schools. I would factor in where you actually want to live and then take it from there. It is not easy to get from one part of south London to another.

@Stopsnowing yes thank you, I searched online really like the overall comments/feedback about gdst schools. I don’t want them to be in hothouse school. I already know that they will do well anywhere with nice learning and environment. I need to just decide between coed or single sex schools x

Eltham College 2023 GCSE A* is 56%, a reverse trend towards the national result decline. It just demonstrated that for a lot of these mid range mild selective indepedent schools, the results can be very volatile which reflects the ability of the year group. It has little correlation for your DCs year group in many years later.

@BNP nope its only %30

@Lola8858 an A* is both an 8 and 9. An A is 7, so @BNP is correct - it's 56%

I believe @larriss was talking about the highest grade which is 9. Because EC GCSE exam results was %39(grade 9) last year.

The parent’s expectation is higher than a top great for a third of the students, they would have to find a school that is more selective at older age and be able to get in. JAGs, for example will have 50% at top grade if that is what parents think it makes the difference.

Eltham’s GCSEs are always less impressive than it’s A levels.

Thats because they kick out the under performers on GCSE results day (the under performers they selected and educated for the last 5-8 years) and then recruit a load of bright girls in with sixth form scholarships……

@TJsAunt agree. That’s what I don’t like about Eltham College

' I do not think it is worth paying top money for schools like Eltham College or Colfe’s when the grammars have better results'

Is this true though, I've been looking at the GCSE results of Colfes Vs grammars and Colfes consistently seems to get better results?

Which Grammar Schools?

Newstead 2023:

• 39.1% of all grades awarded top Grade 9


• 67.6% of all grades awarded at Grade 9-8


• 85.4% of grades awarded at Grade 7, 8 and 9


• 30 students gain a minimum of 8 Grade 9s


• Average Point Score (APS): 81.83

St Olaves 2023:
“In summary, 91% of the grades secured by pupils were grades 9-7, with 50% being at 9 and 76% being at 9/8. There are some excellent individual results, which include 9 students securing all 9s. Our overall percentage of grades 9-7 was almost identical to last year, and higher than in 2019, despite grading standards being adjusted to reflect the grade distribution of 2019 as part of a return to normal following the disruption to public exams during the pandemic.”

Dartford 2023:
“Students achieve extremely well at GCSE and their progress is outstanding.
In 2023 our students achieved outstanding results:
22% of all grades were a grade 9
73% of all grades were 7-9
49% of all grades at 8-9”
Results tend to reflect the underlying ability of the cohort. If you have an intelligent child, they can go to the above and do just as well (and sometimes better because there is big academic focus there, shorter holidays, less distractions). St Olave’s and Wilson’s are the most selective so will have the best results. It is as simple as that. And the schools are great too and free. And offer extra curricular. Tends to be right for very naturally able boys. Wilsons 2023:Headline StatisticsThere were 184 students in Year 11.

% Grade 9: 60.7%

% Grade 9-8: 85.1%

% Grade 9-7: 94.9%

Pass rate: 99.9%

St Olaves is different as it's super selective and does get better results than Eltham and Colfes. But the other grammars, Chis and Sid, Bexley Grammar etc don't.

For instance: 2023 GCSE 9-7
Colfes 79%
Chis and Sid 65.3%
Bexley Grammar 65.8%

You are viewing this too simplistically @Scotcheggsontoast

Colfe’s does a lot of Combined Science and some iGSCSE.

Bexley GS for example, does mainly separate GCSEs for Science. That is harder.

The 7-9 measure is simplistic.
https://www.bexleygs.co.uk/_site/data/files/users/curriculum-statement-pdfs/068BAE867F7B5E06551A2824353A0C60.pdf

You can see from the detailed stats that Bexley Grammar offers a range of languages, Latin, a child was allowed to do 12 GCSEs etc. It is a very good state school. And offers IB.

'Latin, a child was allowed to do 12 GCSEs etc. It is a very good state school. And offers IB.'

Do these things not apply to Colfes / Eltham too?

Not saying BG is not a good state school, but not sure I would agree with the original comment of - why go for Colfes or Eltham as grammar schools get much better results?

Interesting to look at the results in a more detailed way, like you say.

Bexley Grammar does seem to do separate sciences for nearly all pupils, whereas Colfes is about half (61 out of about 110 pupils).

For Latin
BG - 50 out of around 191 pupils took it, 12 of them getting a grade 9.
Colfes - 26 out of around 110 pupils took it (so at both schools around 25% of pupils), 19 of them getting a grade 9.

I am in the decision making process myself currently so interested to hear any more views on the subject!

Another thing to consider is that at somewhere like Colfes, half the senior pupils have been there since age 3 or 4. So it is less selective than somewhere like Bexley grammar which has selected all pupils at 11. So the value added is potentially more.