Attending Church, purely to get to a certain school

[sleepydad3000]

They're aren't many things I feel so strongly about, but this issue is one of them. I am currently looking at schools for my daughter. I am a non religious person and my partner is a none practising Catholic, doesn't go to church at all anymore.

I personally think it's wrong on a moral level to exploit a church for 6 months or however long, just to get your child to a certain school. It's almost like, "Oh hi, yes thankyou, I've got what I needed, you'll never see me again!"

2 schools near me are both decent, 1 outstanding and 1 good (Ofsted ratings) interestingly enough, the NON Catholic school has the higher mark as of 2017.... just saying. Both schools are great in my view, religion aside. But I'd feel awful and wrong and like I was cheating or manipulating the system, just to get my girl to a certain school, and then waving bye bye to the church after, as I know for a fact, my partner and I have no intention of going to church afterwards.

Margo - yours is a widely held and very common misconception. If you only read MN it is pretty easy to fall into the trap of thinking faith schools are state schools with added religion. They aren’t!

Another way to think about faith schools: they are church schools with added state

MariaNovella I do not have any misconceptions. Unless, they are independent schools, they are predominantly state funded regardless of whether the land on which they are built is owned by a church or not.

State-funded faith schools are usually voluntary aided (VA) or voluntary controlled (VC) schools. This means that they get some of their funding from a religious organisation but they are still state-funded.

There are also state faith schools which are run similarly to other maintained schools, although often, the governing body rather than the local authority is responsible for matters such as deciding the admissions policy and appointing staff.

You are very confused about ownership, Margo, and its importance. The fact that the state funds running costs is neither here nor there to ownership.

I'd do it without a second thought if it was benefitting DD. I think it's far more morally corrupt that churches can control school places, so I wouldn't feel guilty for playing the system.

No, I'm not confused about ownership and nor am I confused about who is funding the schools.

I disagree with the state funding of faith schools. Faith is a private matter for individuals and not something that the state should be funding.

I also disagree with religious apartheid and state funded schools being able to discriminate or segregate on the grounds of religion.

You may disagree about state funding of faith schools. What alternative do you suggest? That church schools all become independent schools?

Or should the state compulsorily purchase all church owned schools? If so, how do you suggest the state negotiate that with the churches? Let alone raise the cash...

I suggest that state does not fund faith schools whose entrance requirements discriminates or segregates on the basis of faith.

I feel far less strongly about someone pretending to be a member of a church than someone purposefully renting somewhere just to get their child into school or using a relatives address (thereby depriving a genuine local child of a space).

At least faking church attendance isn't massively dependent on wealth and is an equal opportunity scam which doesn't actually harm anyone for a decent schooling place.

I'm with Margo.

I suggest that state does not fund faith schools whose entrance requirements discriminates or segregates on the basis of faith.

Then, by implication, church schools must charge fees.

I doubt the catholic school would be the right choice as every day is filled with religion in some form

Catholic schools vary. Some are less religious than you might think.

Also the priests aren't daft. They may not sign your paper as you and a hundred other parents will suddenly be rocking up to church for six months for that very same reason

If the priest won't sign you have an excellent case for appeal. They are not allowed to make this kind of judgement. If you have fulfilled the stated admission criteria you are entitled to priority.

No MariaNovella state funded faith schools do not need to charge fees. What leads you to that conclusion? They need to be inclusive and stop discriminating and segregating on the basis of faith.

Then, by implication, church schools must charge fees.

Yes. Or close. Or be taken over/bought out by the state and run as a non-faith school.

But the state should not be funding schools which discriminate on faith grounds. It's a historical anomaly with no ethical justification. The state continues to do it because it's the relatively cheap and easy option.

I think the whole concept of giving priority for state funded school places on the grounds of church attendance is absurd, but have no particular moral issue with people adjusting their behaviour to meet the eligibility criteria. I don't think churches do either - they could easily object to the practice if they did but I think they quite like bums on seats, whatever the underlying reason for it.

Margo - the state does not own church schools. If the state withdraws funding from church schools, the only alternatives are for the church to charge fees or for the schools to close.

And the state has been paying for the maintainable if faith school buildings since 1944 (ish).....

Dioceses and parishes also contribute to maintenance.

MariaNovella I am not arguing for the state to withdraw funding, I am arguing that faith schools open their doors to all the pupils in their area and stops discriminating and segregating their admissions on the basis of faith.

As I said, in My Glorious Reign, anyone who wants a faith school will not be able to apply to non faith schools. Because, obviously, if the faith element is so important to you, you wouldn’t want to, would you? If you don’t get a faith place, there will still be school places left for you at the end of the admissions process.

The fact that church schools are free at point of access and are, in many areas, the only school available creates a lot of confusion in people’s minds about ownership and governance.

Margo - and why would the church that owns the school want to do that?

MariaNovella the state funded faith schools are free at the point of access because they are state funded schools. There is nothing confusing about that at all. For them to be inclusive and provide education for all the children in their community, they need to stop discriminating against children on the basis of faith.

“Margo - and why would the church that owns the school want to do that?“
Oh, I don’t know-justice? Fairness?