Dreamer of dreams,born out of my due time, Why should I strive to set the crooked straight. Wm Morris

[indignatio]

Hopefully the link from the other thread will work

My stats

ds is 4.5 - summer born
In reception class

Has issues with:-
Easy distractability (school work and practical tasks)
Concentration problems when not totally engaged by something (95% of the time)
Fidgeting
Getting "lost" in the middle of a complicated sentence/explaination.
Bossy manner
Isolation at school
Poor eye contact
Repetition of sentences until he hears the acknowledgement
No herding instinct

On the positive
Very loving boy
Exceptional reader for his age
Good at maths
Lots of "home" friends
If gripped by something, can concentrate on it for ages

dx:
teacher initially thought he might have dyspraxia - no longer thinks so.
I consider that he has more add traits, but would not go so far as to say he has add.
SENCO to informally assess him next week and then meeting to be arranged with parents, teacher and senco shortly thereafter.

Not sure what else I should put in.

Hello Sphil, Hallegarda and castles.
Very good to here this thread appears to be losing its relevance to you all .
Would it be possible for you to do a little recap as I can't properly remember the ages and idiosyncracies of your dcs?
My dd (age 6 Yr 2) is having a 'better' phase at the moment, but still not what other people think of as 'normal' iykwim? She is much happier at school now than at the beginning of the year and I am enjoying seeing her increasing independence and emotional maturity. She still seems incapable of not falling over and not chewing stuff, but on the other hand is champing at the bit to be allowed to read the 4th HP book, so some of her brain wiring is in the right place
Just out of interest, what have you bought/what have your dcs asked for presents for Christmas?

Aargh! I meant hear, not here.

(plus bump the thread of course)

Bionicle figures, Zoob Car Designer, an ant farm and Lego Star Wars for the PC because mean mummy won't let him have a PS, Nintendo or Wii yet.

katepol, see my very lengthy post of 19 March (on first page of thread) for DS3's details. We did have a spreadsheet (e-mailed to contributors only for obvious privacy reasons) giving ages and idiosyncrasies of some of the children on this thread, but I doubt I have the latest version (mine has four children on it). If someone can find the latest version, would you like to join in?

DS3 (age 8, year 4) didn't ask for anything in particular for Christmas. He will be getting a computer game (a castle simulation one) and a Rubik's Cube (with handy instruction booklet). We don't have a PS, Nintendo or Wii and have every intention of continuing to avoid them.

sphil, are you getting that lovely space-age ant farm with the blue gel? (I'm afraid we have the little blighters living free-range in the kitchen wall...not an ant-farm escape, don't worry).

No - I looked at that one but bought a normal earth one in the end. I was worried the ants would get all sticky!

Hi all. I posted here a while ago now about my dd (now4.11) She has settled into full time school very well and is really enjoying it. She has some TA support. My concerns at the moment are at home. Her focus on anything(about from TV!) is terrible and she has a gang of imaginary friends who are driving me to distraction. She never seems to be in the real world. Help! Will this soon pass?

Yours and others posters just sound like lovely normal little people at school to me. Enjoy the holidays!

Hello and Happy Christmas.

Just wrote and then lost a long post about dd1. Will do the short version now.... was just saying how great she was in her Christmas play tonight. She managed coordinated dancing and everything and only 'went dreamy' at the end when she was tired. (She was the angel staring off into the middle distance, facing to the side rather than to the front and forgetting to sing, with her halo slightly askew .)

Overall she's doing well, though she announced last week that she thought she was the most unpopular girl in Year 3 (typically, she had given it a lot of consideration and thought that there might be a boy or two even less popular than her). Was a bit , but I think that these things come and go even with kids who are less ... how can I put it? ... exhausting to be around than dd1. She seems happy overall, though, and her teachers are fab, which helps a lot.

She has got a DS lite for Christmas, but her use of it will be severely limited and I will carefully vet what games she gets. She has also got 'Twister' (should be hysterical!) and lots of books and things. What she asked for? All she wanted was 'a piece of art'. Quirky as ever! She hasn't got one, but her request was prompted by an art shop opening up in our town, and I am thinking of getting her something for her room for her birthday.

Happy Christmas to all you dreamers.

Can I gatecrash please?

I've read (most of!) this thread with interest but there's an awful lot to absorb.

I wondered if anyone else had a child like my dd, and could offer any opinions, or experience, or really any helpful suggestions of any sort.

DD is 6 and is currently in the equivalent of UK Year 3 in a French school (she is in a class one year ahead of her peer group). She is doing very well academically. However we have had constant comments, really since she started school, that she does not pay attention, is easily distracted, spends a lot of the time in a dreamworld, talks too much, and fidgets a lot (falling off chairs is her speciality). Up until now teachers have been prepared to put it down to age but based on her last report (have yet to speak to the teacher) it seems to be becoming more problematic.

At home she is capable of sustained concentration in some circumstances (especially if reading or doing arty/ crafty activities) but otherwise she is easily distracted, concentrates poorly, is very disorganised, and is generally a rather "difficult" child (impulsive, flies off the handle at the slightest provocation, poor loser, bad at taking turns, talks over people etc).

We are starting to wonder whether she has the inattentive type of ADHD.

Does this description ring any bells with anyone?

Alison, it has occured to me that DS3 might acquire a label of ADD were I to go looking for one. As would I, both my parents and at least two of my grandparents, all of whom have held down good jobs and do not have major mental health problems or addictions etc. As DS3 makes far more progress and is happier when treated as capable and given responsibility rather than when regarded as someone with a "problem", I'm steering well clear.

AlisonC, I am not sure I can specially help, other than to say - join us and read all about the other dreamers & chair-fallers-off - my best ideas are often stray inspirations sparked off by other people's posts.

I don't know anything accurate about French schools, but I know the common view is that educational expectations are more rigid & conformist than in the UK - could it be that it's just a setting which doesn't suit her, rather than being a bigger issue? It will be interesting to see what the teacher says when you speak to her.

If there is a bigger issue here, the only thing I am sure of from our experience, & talking to others, is that improvement does come, but slowly - be ready to be very very patient.

And - as encouragement - there is a lovely old thread somewhere on MN where posters themselves said whether or not they were dreamy, vague, distracted children - and I have to say that many of my favourite (clever, perceptive, articulate) people on here turned out to have been exactly that kind of child. (The time for emerging from the fog tended to be puberty.)

Next I'm going to do a separate post on rejuvenating this thread for the new term.

Welcome to a new term!
Er, I said WELCOME. Um ... are you listening? What are you drawing? Well, put it down. Down ... Ears on now? Excellent.

I thought it might be nice to reignite our thread by saying what hopes & fears we have for our dreamers this term - a sort of objective-setting, & then we can report on how things go?

I'll start: the end of last term was funnily mixed for us. Ds had a nearly-glowing report, and won the class cup (for big improvements in "socially appropriate behaviour" - which sounded a bit po-facedly technical read out at a prize-giving, but is indeed true ) - but, just a few weeks before that, the follow-on school we hoped he'd go on to said (after he'd done a trial day there) that they'd take him only with a full-time shadow. Which was a bit depressing.

So we are still a bit in limbo, but with the nice feeling that his current school are enjoying him (and with a meeting planned with the other school, so we can see exactly what they think their issues are).

In that light, my hopes/plans for him this term are:

• to do more sporty things;
• to learn to ride a bike;
• to get into the swing of writing properly (stories, comprehension); and possibly
• to find a French club so that he can catch up a bit (it was in a French class at the other school where he was hardest work).

Hi Bink and everyone else. Havent posted much here lately as I'm not sure I have anything new to add but I like the idea of having hopes and dreams. Dt2 is doing ok. I had parents meeting in October and teacher said he had made progress but still has problems getting stuff done. He is getting some reading and maths support twice a week which is good. He was doing ok with reading but I think last term saw a lot of children including Dt1 really taking off in terms of becoming fluent and free readers. Dt2 finds it hard to stay focussed on a book . Although he knows or could sound out words , once he has read a number of pages his focus goes and he loses the plot a bit.
Teacher says he is good at spellings.He is a bit funny on spellings. For example if I say spell "night" he may get it right but he may say "nite". However if I say what word is
"n-i-g-h-t" he would always get it right.
Also say,he reads a sentance with "night" he may not recognise it but if I say"spell it out" he will know what it is.
Sometimes he could get all his spellings right but if I ask him to reread them, he wouldnt always recognise them especially the ones that are not easy to sound out. i wondered if that was related to the visual processing problem that was being discussed on the thread sphil started about writing , although if I remember correctly her Ds is a good reader. Anyway enough rambling
My hopes for dt2 are for him to:

improve his listening skills and be able to finish tasks unprompted

become more fluent at reading

become more assertive with Dt1 and not allow him to always be the boss

DT has started a second lots of Physio sessions. I think he is doing well in this area. He had a one to one session with the physio after the first sessions and she did age appropriate tasks with him and he seemed to be able to do them all. They are giving him a second lot of sessions but that will be it for a while anyway. Despite the experts saying that giving the physical side of things more attention , it doesnt seem to have done much for the concentration side of things. However he can do things like " copy a sequence of 3 and 4 actions " like "hop, throw and ball etc. Whatever he did it was age appropriate anyway which was surprising

I'll stop now

Bumping for hippipotomi...

OK - hopes and dreams for this term for ds:-

1.To lose the silly baby voice he uses on occasions (this seems to be an age trait rather than a dreamy one)
2.To be able to quickly think of 3 sentences when he needs to write/type something. The writing he is really quite good at, spelling is excellent, but deciding what to write could take all morning.
3.To convince his teacher that I am not making it up when I say that he is good at maths. Thus hopefully having the knock on effect of him being given some ability (rather than age) related maths to do at school.

1. Use Bink's two words strategy to ensure the message has been received

Notes to self to help ds

1. Make sure he is listening before asking him to do anything
2. Do not bark orders over shoulder whilst exiting the room
3. Cut down the use of the threat of less time on the PS2 - not sure about this one as it may naturally lead to cutting down the use of extra time as a reward
4. Use Bink's two words strategy to ensure the message has been received

Bike riding (without stabalisers) I shall save until the weather warms up.

Oh good - glad this thread has been revived (even if it has taken me two weeks to wake up to the fact!)

My first hopes and dreams for DS1 are exactly the same as Bink's first three: sporty stuff (especially ball skills), bike without stabilisers - actually WITH stabilisers first- and writing.

Am a bit peed off with school in fact - they have been promising OT input for writing since October. I haven't chased it up until now (DS2 is transferring to m/s from special school next month and we've been busy organising that). Anyway, I arranged a meeting for this week to see DS1's teacher and lo and behold, he came home yesterday saying he'd had a session with the OT TA.

I've found a good way to encourage him to write at home though. Each time he wants to go on the computer he has to write me a sentence (any sentence he likes) in a special exercise book. I then give him an amount of time based on spelling, punctuation, neatness etc. So far he's only written 'Please can I go on the computer?' but I'm going to start giving extra time for imaginative, creative sentences with good vocab etc. In two days he's moved from 'ples can i goonthe comput'
to 'Please can I go on the computer?' and best of all he's doing it willingly and even (dare I say it) happily.

One very positive thing though - I think he's finally cracked playdates. The last two we've had have been realy good - no input from me needed at all, no wandering off and playing on his own, good reciprocal play and conversation, arguments negotiated himself etc. Tbh I care about this more than all the other stuff put togther!

Thats a good idea about the writing sentences Sphil. I do that with spellings, i.e you can have such and such if you do 3 spellings for me. Must try that with the writing. Actually Dt2 said on Sunday he wanted to write 12 sentences and I thought Oh yeah right. However he did and he did them well although he is not great at the creative and imaginative sort of sentences. Still for the first time ever I had to say "you have done enough". I imagine its a one off though and i am going to try and encourage content as well as quantity going forward. His handwriting is not bad but if he makes a mistake at all or doesnt like the look of a letter he wrote he has to rub it out and then loses the flow. DT2 has started another 6 weeks of physio after having 6 sessions in the summer. He had an individual assessment after the first 6 and he seemed to be able to do all the age appropriate things that he had to do. This series of sessions will be it as far as I can tell.

I wish in a way that DS1 would take more pride in how his writing looks. He sort of lunges at the paper - there's very little sense of placing the pencil on the page and controlling it. If he makes a mistake he either tries to write over it or crosses out and then starts the next word right to it without a space. I'm very aware of the danger of promoting neatness over creativity and flow - but atm we don't really have either. I'm hoping the OT will have some ideas.

However, he tells me that he's been 'moved up a handwriting level' at school (whatever that means). And that his teacher is always telling him he's doing well. The meeting tomorrow will be very interesting!

12 sentences! I think someone would have to revive me if that happened

' the next word right NEXT to it'. Maybe the OT can give me typing lessons...

Oh we get the no spaces too. However sometimes he realises that he hasnt left a space and rubs out all that he has done and we have to go through the torture all over again. I know 12 sentences sound good but I think they all started with "I will" . he wanted to write about going fishing with his Dad and he wanted to write "I will catch a big one " lots of times having forgotten that he had written it already. So a start middle and end to a story is a while off yet. However am pleased that he stayed on the task for as long as he did. We get the lunging too. Dt2 never sits down properly. He sort of leans across the table with legs on the chair. I put it down to not having a proper desk for him but I suspect he is like that at school too.

Yep, spacing a problem here too. Do you do that thing of getting him to imagine a nice round letter "a" in the gap between each word? It seems to help ds, as it's a bit more tangible than "don't squish it all up".

(I suspect I would get War and Peace in a computer-minutes economy. I wonder if I should try it ...)

DS is the same as yours Indignatio "deciding what to write could take all morning". He was just doing his homework which he wanted to do and it was hilarious how he kept going off at a tangent and talking about totally unrelated stuff. It seemed to take him ages but when he actually did it, it was fantastic (imo ) Quite frankly I'm pretty amazed that 5 year olds are expected to do joined up writing but maybe my memory's gone!

I too am more concerned about the social stuff Sphil. It is encouraging to hear you have cracked play dates. If I remember correctly your DS is a bit older than mine? We had one last week (instigated by the other mother as always - going off at a tangent here but she actually had a mild dig at me about not being pushy enough with DS!). Anyway it was totally great (imo again!) but after about an hour DS really wanted to do his own thing. I whipped them all into the kitchen for tea but any other suggestions for dealing with this?

Another thing: not sure how you all feel about alternative stuff, but anyway ... I felt a bit desperate and took DS to a homeopath in early Oct as he seemed to be getting one ear infection/virus after another. He's not been ill at all since. I've also been taking him to a cranial osteopath. Now it could be total coincidence/age etc, but the overall difference in him is quite incredible. Extremely calm, focussed, "hardest working child in his class" according to teacher, understanding/language has flourished. His anxieties appear to have vanished, he told me last week "I'm not frightened of anything" - the list used to be endless: rain, dogs, pigeons(!), a crane one day, an aeroplane the next. I don't wish to bang on, but ...

Sorry for ramblings. Wonder where DS gets it from?!

Hi all. Sorry for the very brief bump-and-run earlier, but was at work and rushing.

Went to a meeting at dd1's school last week about the SEAL curriculum. It was very interesting and I'd be interested to know if any of your schools do this. I think it's a technique that will work well with dd1 and I am trying to use it at home too, though with varying degrees of success. I think it's going to take me a while to get used to it (especially the not saying please bit!) and not to revert to normal 'shouty' behaviour, but I am going to try. I am simplifying massively, but basically there are three steps.

1. State the obvious. E.g. 'Babybell, you haven't got your coat on.' The idea here is to avoid pointless questioning (I do this a lot!) along the lines of 'Why haven't you got your coat on? Don't you realise that we're all ready to go to school? Do you want to get soaking wet? What do you think you're doing? Do you think we've got all day? Blah blah blah-dee blah?'.

1. If this doesn't elicit a response move to stating the behaviour that you want. Don't phrase it as a question and don't say 'please'. Rather, say 'thank you'. The idea here is that 'please' sounds as if you are pleading (see above, re. questioning) whereas 'thank you' implies a positive response. Hence: 'Babybell, put your coat on now. Thank you.'

1. If the first two steps don't work you move to the vocabulary of choice. 'Babybell, you can choose to put your coat on now, or you can choose not to. But if you choose not to, we will be late for school and you will also be choosing to [insert 'punishment of choice' - e.g. spend an extra five minutes practising your spellings tonight]'. The idea is to make them understand the idea of rights and responsibilities. I'm not sure I'm explaining this well... I'll google and see if I can find a better explanation.

Anyway, I think that this will work well with dd1, even just at step 1, because she most often doesn't even realise that she's not doing what I want her to be doing. She is just genuinely lost in whatever fantasy world she's in at the time.... Anyway, watch this space... I'm going SEAL-hunting!

Bother, I can't find anything that explains it simply. This is the SEAL website, and there's probably something in the guidance booklet that's downloadable there. I'll try to look tomorrow at work, but my ancient computer here is struggling with the PDF file... and I need to go to bed.

Hi Ellebell and thanks for bumping

I was on this tread many moons ago when I had some worries with ds. That seems mostly resolved now. I will have a read of this mammoth tread now - will grab a coffee and settle down