Does anyone else think their DC's private school is rubbish?

[Mynameismummy]

Ok...I'm asking for a pasting here, I know - but I'm desperate for some outside opinions. My DCs go to a private (primary) school which is full of the usual promises and blah blah blah. I'm cynical enough to accept that this is part of the territory....but they seem to fail on every score. It's academically so-so, the pastoral care is iffy and everything seems to be aimed at putting on a good show for the parents. Everyone else goes on about how marvellous it is (until you get them one to one when, funnily enough, they all seem to have a story of woe about how their child can't read/is being bullied etc). I wonder how much of it is the psychology of people liking to big themselves up and how much I'm the only one who sees how crap it is. Anyone else have a similar experience?

I'm sure you are right about that too, happygardening. I would not naturally be inclined to outsource my DCs' education as much as boarding requires but that is mere personal preference.

I have made an awful lot of very good friends through school! Wouldn't want to be without them

Common parental resources = time, energy, skills, cultural capital, money.

It was always very important to DH and I that our involvement was far more than paying the cheque. And, finding a community of (mostly) like minded parents was wonderful.

Those early years in school, where parents worked with the school to provide all our DC with so many lovely things were very rich. The children benefited, the parents benefited and so did the school going forward once we left.

Shesgot I'm curious do you go to work? If yes how do you find the time to be the first to "support school events and do your bit"? Do you enjoy supporting school events and doing your bit? What sort of school events do you support? Maning bear stalls, PTA committee member (my worst nightmare), school quiz nights,? Why do you do it?
I'm genuine intrigued and if you work full time I'm in awe of you as well.

"Those early years in school where parents worked with the school to provide all our DC's with many lovely things"
Do you not think your fees should ultimately be providing lovely things? Obviously I don't know what lovely things your talking about but I expect the school to provide everything my DS needs in terms of education.

happy yes I work.

I'm a writer and lecturer. However I was not doing the later during the prep years so my work was very flexible and from home (and prep school was around the corner).

TBH I did everything the school needed/wanted. I have helped on trips, I have helped on themed days (famously dressing as a jester for a Tudor day). I have blown up balloons for balloon releases. I helped on a stall at every xmas fayre and every summer fete. I've stood on every side line and cheered and attended every concert/show and clapped.

I've painted sets for the play and poured tea for visiting parents.

Some of it I loved, some I was ambivilent about.

By secondary school, there was far less needed/requested, but I still helped out whenever I could .

"Boho" I've made some friends over the years through school but I've also made friends in many other ways; walking the dog for example. I dont know what age your children are but certainly at senior school I've found you generally don't know the other parents very well I knew no parents from DS1's state comp unless I happened to meet them through walking the dog. At DS2's school I know a few and partly because the school has a welcome lunch for new boys with their parents and an annual social event thing and have had the odd coffee etc with a some but that's really where it begins and ends, mind you its not helped by the fact I've got an absolutely appalling memory for names and faces.

"famously dressed as a jester"
I take my hat off to you, you deserve a medal in fact a whole box of medals especially if you were ambivalent about doing it.

Oh I quite enjoyed that one.

But my thighs were not made for red tights!

A new way for MNetters to recognise each other?

I tend to think the worst about small private primaries/preps. Especially those where the HT also owns the school and his wife is the bursar/secretary/everything else admin. They are often on tiny sites with no outdoor space. They also, ime, go slightly overboard with the uniform. I visited a few when my eldest was 2/3yrs and was shocked at the internal shabbiness and lack of facilities and also there trying to impress me by saying how they kept class sizes down to 7 or 8. One had 12 and was almost apologetic. In the end we moved to Edinburgh and he started a an enormous 3-18 school with 20 in his class and a fairly ordinary uniform by private standards. We moved down to Surrey and really struggled to find somewhere with the same vibe. Ds1&2 went to a local prep with a good reputation and I hated it. It was horribly elitist and very snobby and seemed totally obsessed by how many children they could get into the senior school of their choice. They loved my very bright, very sporty DS2 but seemed only to tolerate 'just' bright, able, completely non sporty DS1. Then we moved up to Cheshire and they moved to a school similar to the one they had started at in Edinburgh and they're currently flourishing. It's fantastic for DS2 who is still in Y5 as he benefits from all the sports and science facilities that come from being part of a larger school. It's also been amazing for DS1 who is now in top set at senior school and benefits from an ethos that sport is just one element of a good education. He's academically flourishing because they also place huge emphasis on things like D&T and textiles (winning national awards at both). In my experience this is what makes a good school and small twee private primaries with ridiculous uniforms simply don't cut it.

sport is just one element of a good education a lot of prep schools will claim that but IMO the measure of a good school is when pupils feel that their talent for non sporty activities is as catered for and as valued as sporting success.

Our DSs private secondary school is OK. It does alright at GCSE level but fails miserably at A level. We are removing DS1 after GCSEs.

Its no great shakes. It is better than local state schools but not great.

Most private schools are just schools with somewhat better than average teachers, somewhat selective and somewhat better facilities.

Some are outstanding but some are dreadful.

sport is just one element of a good education a lot of prep schools will claim that but IMO the measure of a good school is when pupils feel that their talent for non sporty activities is as catered for and as valued as sporting success.

Trans, did you read what I wrote next?
He's academically flourishing because they also place huge emphasis on things like D&T and textiles (winning national awards at both). In my experience this is what makes a good school

He's at senior school. My boys are very different. Our school is a good school IMO because it manages to cater to both my very all round academic, very sporty child whilst at the same time catering to my more narrowly academic child (maths geek) who has discovered a previously hidden passion and talent for both D&T and using fabric and textiles.
I sincerely believe that whilst super all rounder DS2 would have flourished in most environments, DS1, if elsewhere, would certainly not have had either the opportunity or the encouragement he has benefitted from. Not many state schools would be telling him that his D&T work was of equal importance to his maths. Yet, by doing so, he is encouraged to enjoy his maths even more.

happygardening - I think it's just as much about school culture as age of DC. DP made lots of parent friends at the DSSs' secondary school - firstly, it was a Catholic school with a strong family ethos (sibling policy is super important), secondly he was always at or around school, having lunch with the DSSs at the local restaurant where loads of parents took their DC. DP's father had a permanent reservation/table on Wednesday at that restaurant and lots of families did similar. DP was parent rep for years, knew parents and teachers really well etc.

"having lunch with the DSSs at the local restaurant where loads of parents took their DC"
Did the school not provide lunch?

1. I'm wouldn't be allowed to take my DS out for lunch except Sunday's and 2. even if we were the boys are community they eat all meals in house together I wouldn't dream of interfering, maybe not the right word but the only one I can think of.

French school children don't eat lunch at school as a matter of course - canteen is an opt in and DC can choose which days of the week they eat at the canteen and which they don't. By lycee (years 11/12/13) the DSSs never had lunch at school.

At DD's school there is no canteen option at all for years 11/12/13 - you would hardly be interfering by offering lunch ;)

So what will you do OP?

I don't know if it still the case, but quite smart Kensington restaurants used to offer much cheaper "school lunches" designed for Lycee parents and children. You needed to know to ask for it.

Not for me. I would prefer that DD was active enjoying lunch with her peers, gaining leadership skills by having to manage the lunch queue once a week, pulling younger ones up for uniform deviations, attending lunchtime talks, by peers or outsiders, on subjects unrelated to her A level subjects and so on.

To be honest Bobo's description of the French system make it sound grim. he would probably say the same of the British system. As a parent I would feel I had lost a huge amount if my daughter did not come home each evening or at least every weekend and tell me about her week. I really don't mind half an hour on the cake stall once a year, as a way of showing to DC I support their community. Horses for courses. There may be some genuinely rubbish schools, but I think it is mainly a case of the wrong school for the wrong child.

Lunch is a fabulous time to catch up with your own DC and the wider school community. The school day is often very long in France (DD is 10 and her mornings last from 8am to 1pm) and lunch is a relaxing break. It's different - certainly not grimmer than a canteen - but actually one of my favourite bits of French organisation.

I am not in general in favour of a huge separation between school and home life.

Bobo, but then when do French schools fit in the extra curricular stuff, including helping develop a wider emotional intelligence? So much happens over lunch time. Or are French schools strictly academic and the rest has to be organised by parents. Is that why French students in the UK have a bit of a reputation for sticking together and not engaging beyond academics. A continuation of the way things happen in France?

I would run a mile from a school where children of any age need to be brought home/brought somewhere for lunch - not because I don't think it's a great idea, but because my DH and I have busy professional careers. Even though we can flex sometimes to accommodate the odd school play/day off/coming into school for stuff, having to take lunch off every day would just about kill us off professionally. In addition to this, we have children of different ages, who no doubt would be at different schools at various stages, so then you would need two non working parents to accommodate lunches every day (as couldn't be in two places at the same time).

Also is very different in France, where it is more common for schools to be in large city centres alongside offices/workplaces, and it is common practice for office people to have extended lunches - so in theory children and parents could have lunch together. In the UK schools tend to be outside and far away from working places (I know there are exceptions in London, but I mean generally in the UK as a whole), and working professionals tend to have very sporadic lunches, often at their desks (unhealthy but true!).

EC don't usually take place at school. That's a huge generalisation but French schools aren't conceived of as one stop shops for children in the English way. Which doesn't mean French DC don't have EC activities - they do! Just (less conveniently) not at school.

Boho your postings are a perfect example of school ethos fitting your ethos. As Sovery has already said I too couldn't take my DC's out for lunch during a school day even if I was allowed to and wanted to because I dont have that kind of job. I don't live in an area where my EC's take place on my door step or are even accessible by public transport they require at least an hour and a quarters driving (one way). So the French way would not suit me.
If I felt under some sort of obligation to take my DC to a restaurant for lunch I'd think the school was "rubbish" ditto if I had to drive DS to his EC three times a week.

How is it possible to have lunch with your children every day? Do parents just leave work to do that in France? Both parents? Do they take turns? Are French workplaces accommodating of this? What about parents with 3 or 4 children in 3 different schools?

As for EC stuff; it's one of the main reasons we decided to pay for school. Keeping their brains and bodies occupied for a large portion of the day is fantastic both for us and them.