What is so bad about faith schools?

[Jalexandra]

After reading the 'anti sitting on a fence' thread, I was surprised by how many people had chosen faith schools as a subject they feel strongly about and was just wondering why.
I can't think of any good reason to be against them so maybe you can enlighten me.

Hmmmm perhaps you should read the thread on this in the archives!!

i think in the main it is the specific issue of funding that is objected to by many mners.

we all pay taxes. we are all ostensibly entitled to good free state education. but only those that show up in church are entitled to go to faith schools, whose middle class bias means that they are often the better schools in a given area.

worse, many parents object strongly to the fact that they are unable to send their children to the nearest state school because it is a faith school and they do not meet the criteria by virtue of the fact that they don't practise that faith (in the way prescribed by the admissions policy.

personally i'm incensed that if as a practising christian I do not wish to attend my local strongly evangelical church with a vicar who is openly disdainful of parents with under five year olds who are 'only there because of the school' ds does not get to go to a very good school that is two minutes walk from our house.

i'm incandescent about it actually.

i have had a look at the many previous threads. Interesting. I still don't get it though.

I can't send my dd to the school about 20 metres from my house because it is catholic and I am not prepared to be a hypocrite and go to church and get dd baptised a catholic.

Yet I have to pay for the school

Great

what don't you get?

The objections are spelled out very clearly on the threads

I think sophable is right - its about the restriction of entry to people not attached to a faith especially when its perhaps the only school availiable meaning you have to go out of the area. There are some faith schools which are self funded but this isn't the case in a large no of cases and its the fact that you're paying tax for something that is not necessarily availiable to your child.

ooh, this is interesting as all you 'dahn sahf' have a totally different take on this to up here.

Here we have Catholic schools and non-denominational schools. I loathe the idea of Catholic only schools as imo it enhances the Catholic vs Protestant theme which is so prevalent in eg, Glasgow and the West of Scotland.

Here, recently, to save money I presume, they merged two secondary schools which were close to each other, one Catholic and one nd. The Catholic church were insisting that the Catholics had their own entrance to the school which the other kids would not be allowed to use!!!! I nearly choked on my bran flakes. That makes me so mad!!!!!

So, quite different up here, really, but just as hot a potato.

There are lots of things that we all pay taxes for, which only a minority benefit from. If we want to live in a diverse society we should accommodate different ideas/religions/politics etc. What is the alternative? Every school being a state school teaching the same ideas which have been dictated by the government. Sounds a bit like Communism.

But what you're saying in that then is some people are more entitled to a good local education than others and as long as you are attached to a faith you will be better off than others (perhaps an over simplification!!). Thats not diverse that bias. Education should be availiable to all children regardless of their faith taught at the same high standard and within their local area. What I would also point out is that they syllabus taught in all these schools is exactly the same faith or not.

OK, the syllabus is the same but Catholic schools also play a major part in the developement of the faith. For example, children take their First Communion and get confirmed through the school. I realise that alot of Catholic schools are considered 'better' than the non-denomibational equivalent, but for Catholic parents, they just want to send their kids to Catholic schools. It is a big part of the religion. I can see why people think it is unfair, but it is not the answer to abolish faith schools.

non-denoMinational ... sorry

a massive jewish high school has just opened here, that should split our community nicely.

And I hear what you're saying on that but when you see what some people have to go through to get their kids into a decent school you have to feel for the frustration of the situation. Should children be segregated off at such an early age?

I think it is horrible that people have fight to get their kids into good schools. Not all Catholic or faith schools are good though. The answer is to get all schools up to scratch. I don't think that getting rid of faith schools would help the situation at all. You would just end up with a lot of people feeling that they couldn't practice their religion as they want.

I'd like to see if I'd get funding for opening a hardline marxist leninist school.

That's as reasonable as a tax-funded Jewish, Catholic or Muslim school imo.

Or a hardline atheist school.

Or a pagan school.

I'd like to see the money that faith organisations spend on education used exclusively in very tough areas and/or failing schools. And with no faith input to the education at all, except in answer to the question 'why are you funding/teaching/doing this'. That would be faith in action IMO.

I suppose it is segregation, but some people who have different or no faiths seem to have strong feelings about their children being exposed to certain or any religions. When I was looking at the archive threads, I saw a posting from a parent who was outraged that their child had been asked to sing a religious song. How can one type of school accommodate such different views?

FluffyCharlotteCorday, I don't think you would get a big uptake therefore no funding

See I have to say that I'm disappointed that the light religious teachings (if there is such a thing) i.e. singing specific childrens hymns etc is being taken out of schools as I loved that when I was little!!! Why can't there be a broad spectrum of teachings in all schools??

One type of school could easily accommodate everyone if religious people carried on with their religion at home and church and schools were non-religious - you know, like hospitals and GPs surgeries and Surestart and Health Visitors and all those other state funded things that don't seem to need to be divisive and favour the religious over the non-religious. Or do you think state funded religious hospitals are good idea too?
Am frankly amazed anyone can't understand why people would oppose them, particularly in a climate where dividing people by religion seems particularly self-defeating.

Nobody opposes their children learning ABOUT religion, it is being told that a particular creed is the truth that pees them off mightily.

I am a Catholic and a practising one at that. I feel strongly that my children should recieve an education with strong catholic emphasis. I can only talk from a Catholic point of view and not from any other faith.
I do think that some people on here are expressing their opinions a little too abruplty -What makes my belief any more right or wrong than yours? Nothing - it is what it is - my opinion and belief. I am not a freak for believing what I believe as is no other person on this earth.
I am a tax payer too and so the arguement made that in my eyes does not stand up as my tax is also used to fund the schools that my children will never frequent. State schools also have a restiction of entry too.

A child?s faith development doesn?t happen genetically like their teeth coming in or their bones growing. It has to be fostered and nurtured and, to begin with at least, the best place for that to happen is within the context of formal Catholic education reinforced by the experience of faith-in-practice at home. If parents opt to send their children to non-Catholic schools, are they able to make up the level of faith education that their children miss out on as a result? If not, then it would seem a very high price to pay for whatever benefits education at a state school is supposed to bring.

Learning within the context of a Catholic school has to do with a great deal more than simply acquiring Catholic knowledge. I believe Catholic schools seek to make faith values the basis of everything else that they do in developing and educating the individual. That?s what gives a Catholic school its particular character and nurtures the ethos that so many non-Catholic parents seek in sending their children to our schools, a fact that makes it all the more puzzling to me as to why Catholic parents would opt to send their children elsewhere. No matter how well they may subsequently do academically, there will inevitably be a void in their faith development. Where and how will that space be adequately filled?

Oh and by the way - Catholic schools do admit non-catholic children - they have to by law - but they have a percentage to admit - just as state schools cannot admit every child that applies due to their numbers also.

But Sorrell, for people who beleive in their religion, their creed IS the truth. Otherwise they would not be a part of that religion. That is the point of faith schools.... not trying to ram your religion down other peoples throat who don't agree. Instead of being annoyed at faith schools, surely efforts would be better spent trying to get all schools up to the same standard.

Your belief gets special funding though and discriminates against other children, that's what people feel strongly about. You may CHOOSE not to send your child to a local non-discriminatory school, but nobody is stopping you going. You cannot say the same about your child's school. You can be as Catholic as you like at home. Are you saying your faith is so weak that going to church and being taught at home and going to a secular school isn't enough?