Gove kills the mockingbird with ban on US classic novels ...what do you think?

[mrz]

www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/article1414764.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2014_05_24

er... right oh. And if you choose to pepper threads with oft-repeated anecdotes about the much much better-ness of France, be prepared for me to be reminded of amusing sketches in which similarly chauvinistic attitudes are gently mocked.

Chidings and remindings at dawn, gentlemen!

As for the different boards being harder or not, I think these things are often urban myths.

I've certainly never heard anyone say they rate x over y.

I have however heard it said that iGCSEs are rated over straight GCSEs, not because of the syllabus per se, but because they are linear/terminal and because the A* boundaries are so high.

I think this is one of the reasons why those schools that stuck with linear/terminal when they had the option of modular have a high reputation.

Fortunately, as GCSEs all return to linear/terminal, there will be no difference I think. Though I predict a bit of a fall out for the 2015 GCSE results!

You mean 2014, thewordfactory. DS is in the middle of doing linear exams (in a state comprehensive), which means, for example, nine modules of triple science exams spread over two weeks, rather than a year as previously. Whether this produces a truer picture of an individual student's understanding of the subject isn't possible to prove, though it would certainly be an advantage for any student with a good memory.

I'm never seen any evidence that iGCSEs are any "harder" than GCSEs, though I can imagine it would be in the interest of high-achieving schools to claim that they are, as this helps to promote their image of exclusivity.

www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10255180/Schools-moving-to-easy-IGCSE-exams-to-boost-grades.html

news.tes.co.uk/b/news/2013/08/20/schools-think-igcses-are-quot-way-easier-quot.aspx

Some of the kids at my school have done iGCSE this year - not top set though. They were the middle band. Which suggests it's not harder.

DCs school use IGCSE in English, maths and Science to bump middling kids over the D/C boundary

IGCSE is linear
that makes it harder for some kids but not harder per se

and once kids enter the world of work, memorising loads of stuff is less valuable as a skill that being able to look it up and analyse it.

My Accountancy finals tax exam was the last time I did a tax return without an iterative spreadsheet after all .....

suburban I think that the 2014 cohort are in the midst of a horrible hybrid, no?

A sort of half way house between modular and linear?

The 2015 cohort will fully transfer over, before the O levels are reintroduced (if that actually happens).

As for iGCSE I didn't say they are harder. I said that at a time when most schools adopted modular GCSEs, iGCSEs were seen as a more robust reflection of ability, as there is no possibility of small tranches to be learned and then re-sat as necessary, also no coursework of controlled assessments (which, having seen my DD do them, are utterly absurd, and easy to do well in with the right support).

The grades in iGCSEs are a funny old thing. IMVHO in some subjects it's easier to get a C, yet harder to get an A* due to the way the boundaries are set.

This is one reason why some state schools adopted them for their low ability pupils (who were never in danger of an A*) and why some of the most selective schools adopt them (their pupils can cope with the high boundary).

It's not some conspiracy .

And of course both state schools and independents have been perfectly able to adopt the linear/terminal GCSEs for a long time. No one had to choose linear. And some selective state schools di take this route!

Crossed with a few of you...and can see that yes, schools have adopetd it for the lower ability ranges...which makes sense.

talkin I agree that terminal exams are not necessarily a good reflection of ability.

However, re-sitting modules, controlled assessments, coursework, cheating in orals etc are absolutley no reflection of ability.

And like it or lump it, the most selective universities prefer linear exams that have been taken in one sitting.

Sorry, you're right, thewordfactory, you didn't say they were harder.

I agree that the 2014 cohort is in a messy transition period. How employers will be able to make sense of grades when it comes to assessing someone's CV is anyone's guess.

Interesting what you and others say about how iGCSEs are used in some school for lower ability students. I hadn't heard of that.

talkinpeace, I agree that memorising shed loads of information is a meaningless skill in the world of work these days. Consulting with other people is something I do quite a bit in my job - can't see Gove encouraging that skill to be taught by schools

suburban

the syllabus for iGCSE and GCSE are similar. In science there is a bit more gorund in iGCSE and a bit more grammar in MFL.

In English Lit, the main difference is that at iGCSE there are no controlled assessments (though there can be a public speaking element if the school adopts it, for 6% I believe).

And I must say, that whilst I can see how CAa ought to work in Eng Lit, the reality is that it is far too easy for well supported students to outsrip their unsupported peers, whoich can't be right.

True about coursework, though my DS's History controlled assessments were tough, and there was no way I could have helped him to cheat even if I'd wanted to.

I disagree about resitting modules, though. As was pointed out by many when Gove first changed the rules, if we took everyone off the road who didn't pass their driving test first time (due to illness, family circumstances, etc.), we would rightly consider that unfair. There should be a limit of maybe two extra chances to resit a GCSE module, but even that is not on a par with the driving test, which has no limit.

It's not necessarily memorising lots of information though. One of the problems with modularisation is that students don't have to learn all the material in the course. They can get away with simply memorising the bits required to pass each module and then completely forgetting about it because they've moved on to superficially memorising something else. It prevents them from seeing the bigger picture and, in some cases, from really learning anything.

Suburban / Wordfactory
Utterly agree about getting rid of the retakes : it was a sham situation
but I genuinely think that losing the modules is a loss to the potential of education.
Some kids do not have good 'long recall' memories.
They think slowly and gradually,
but
if asked by an employer to produce a strategy report will probably do an excellent job - but their work pattern will be different
sadly
they will now get a C or a D and not be allowed to progress onto the sort of jobs where their skills could be best utilised for the good of the economy

(FWIW both DH, myself and our kids are the type who find revising for exams easy so will benefit from others being excluded from the pool)

wordfactory the difference between various exam boards is not an urban myth. I remember both being told as a pupil myself in the late 60s that the JMB board which was a collaboration of the northern universities including Manchester was thought of as a harder board for O -level than some of the other boards. When I started my teaching career, my HOD told me the school chose the Oxford and Cambridge board because the syllabus they offered favoured pupils in some way ( which I can't recall precisely.)

I think the jury is still out on the iGCSE. It does still involve coursework and therefore may be easier for some pupils than others. The weighting of the marks is different and remember it was set initially for pupils whose first language was not English. This is why so many independent schools used it because of their influx of Chinese and Far East students. It also dovetailed to an extent with the IBac.

My DS would have given his right arm for no CAs in English Lit. The school changed the exam board at the end of Year 10, so all the CAs he had done in Year 10 had to be redone in Year 11

talkin I agree in theory about modules, but the reality was pupils learning a bit, doing an exam, re-sitting the exam, learning another bit...

It must have been a nightmare for teacher which never allowed them to cover anything other than what was going to be in the next module.

And no real chance to have an overview and see how all those modules fitted together.

I've seen a complete difference in year 10 for my twins in English.

The one taking GCSEs has had three controlled assessments, which have dominated the year really.
The one taking iGCSE has been free to study a play which isn't on the syllabus, but which the teacher thought would be worth a look at as a comparison to the one which is, attend lots of theatre and poetry workshops etc.

calamitously, IME students instantly forget information they've just been examined on anyway, unless they're carrying on studying it to the next level.

lazy iGCSEs don't have to have a coursework element.

My DS has done none at all. And no CAs.

wordfactory did your son's school explain then why they were not choosing the coursework option? Because it's certainly in the board's syllabus as shown here.
Bottom righthand box.

www.cie.org.uk/images/89792-2014-syllabus.pdf

And in addition to this, I also tutored a boy being entered for both the IGCSE at a local school and the GCSE - he had some marks in the bag already with is IGCSE coursework.

WF You need to scroll down to page 5 and on the following page there is also the speaking & listening option, which has been removed now from the new GCSE English.

Hi lazy my understanding for English, is that there is the option of coursework if the teacher chooses.

But it is that, an option.

SuburbanRhonda - I think it is wrong to draw a comparison between a driving test (which gives you a licence to drive) and public examinations at specific points in school, which, for purposes of comparison, ought to be taken by all pupils at the same point in time.

But they aren't taken by all pupils at the same point in time some people won't take them at all, others will take them early others will take them at various stages in their life.