Why on earth would you go state if you could afford private?

[Schmedz]

This thread is for Maisie and happygardening . I like dares!

lemon - seeker was 'forced' into it. Those damned LA bastards made her DD sit the 11+ and then rubbed salt into the wound by forcing her to accept the offer.

However, when it came to her DS she fought the system and got the LA to allocate them the local sec mod. She is now plotting to get her DD transferred to the SM. Finally she will be away from all those snobby parents who look down on those who go to the SM.

socareless

I do think that previous governments in this country simply tended to tell people what they wanted to hear just to remain in power. If a government really wants to make a change, they have to (at times) make very unpopular choices that may not seem good in the near-term but is definitely the better option in the long-term. It is very well-known that when a developing country's government wants to change the country for the better, they may have to introduce very unpopular policies. The voting public often goes mad because the effects of those policies may not be immediate, and may only be seen 20 years down the line.

So many politicians in the UK bend over backwards for the voters, which makes it odd because they are meant to be LEADERS. New Labour was a good example of that. To be honest, that's why I actually like Nick Clegg for sort of saying that where he will send his kids is his family's business and nobody else's. He sort of told the public that they DON'T own him... which is very commendable and different.

The fees I quoted includes extras. Actual fees is £6,060 for pre prep and £6,390 for prep. it is a good school and leavers destinantion at prep 6 shows that they mostly go to the grammer school in the county and a few go on to other private schools, some with scholarships.

socareless

Hmmm... that wouldn't work where I live. Rent for a 2-bed alone would be double that. Utilities would be the same. Council Tax a little more.

But your calculation makes me believe we definitely need to rethink our finances... because we earn a lot more than that, and I can't actually say where the money goes!!!

Much as I hate to side with seeker and co, it is kind of silly for happy to say that she couldn't live on £40k with one DC at prep. Even after deducting £13k gross for fees that leaves an income of £27k pa. gross.

In a recent thread about income a significant number said that theirs was significantly below the national average of £26k/£27k? To spend a day telling me that I was talking rubbish to suggest that £27k income, after fees, is not do-able just goes to proves seekers point that some people are just plain out of touch with 'ordinary' folk.

Seeker invited me to provide proof that she said what I said she did. So I did. Why is that 'stalking'?

Actually Lemon, thats exactly what I am struggling with re Seeker's choices. Totally against selection yets allows her child to sit the 11+ (only 58% even take the 11+) passes and then allows her DD to go to a school that she claims to hate.

And worse IMHO, she then tries to do the same thing with her DS who sadly doesnt pass and goes to the local sec modern.

BTW - I hate private education, particularly hate senior boarding schoools with great results and lots of activiities and opportunities. Really really hate them for all of you.

For myself - well, its completely different. Top boarding school all the way for my DS's and stuff the rest of you!!

BTW - Of my own free will I have chosen a boarding school and am very happy with my choices.

Tbs.

Like those poor old left wing celebs who preach and lecture the rest of us on diversity and the evils of wealth, but somehow find themselves living in a detached cottage in the Cotswolds!

How does it happen eh?

I think why Seeker leaves me confused is the fact that not only did she allow her DS sit for the exam because she had no choice, she also appealed when he did not make it.

I met a lot of those people who don't practice what they preach...

Whereas I am fairly open with what I want. And if that makes me sound elitist, so be it. While I completely agree that life is often not fair, I do think that sometimes, you have to stop complaining and blaming everyone around you, and just make your life work out for you.

Really, unless you descended from royalty from both sides of the family, if you look back into your family history, you may find that some of your ancestors led REALLY difficult lives with no safety net, etc. But they made it work, and that is the sole reason you exist.

Would you be able to go back in time and complain to your ancestor about your current life - all without feeling a tiny bit ashamed about yourself?

Rent for £450 for a 3 bed semi
Council Tax £120

You are joking. Five years ago I was renting a studio flat in Exeter for £400 a month and £110 council tax. Exeter is by no means the most expensive part of the country, and yes, local salaries reflect that too.

Fees for Exeter school: £3,140 junior/£3,480 senior per term (OK very reasonable compared to schools in the South East, where you can add another £800).

I know lemon I have encountered people like that. They claim money is not important but yet want to go on holidays, have nice cars, buy the latest iphone going but yet when you say why not go for this job its pays well the response is 'it shouldn't be about the money!!!'.

Gets me really confused!!

www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-25963872.html

That is for you LaVolcan. I may have been too optimistic with the council tax bill but I was also quite generous with the food and travel.

And an even better one

www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-25943298.html

FWIW, I looked at what would be needed for private schooling where I live. I realized socareless forgot to add in things like clothes - which can add a bit to your costs.

Expenses per month
Rent for £1,200 for a 3 bed semi
Utilities £250
Council Tax £160
Food £500
Travel £500
Contingency/savings £300
School Fees for Prep £1,100 (for one child)
Clothes £130 (quite modest for a family of three!!!)

That's £4,140 net per month that is needed. Plus, I do think parents should pay to a pension pot, and there are things to be paid like uniforms, car tax, insurance, etc. so we will roughly put this up to £4,500 per month.

So if both parents work, and get equal wages, they EACH need to earn about £36,000, giving a total household income of £72,000.

If you want to have a more comfortable life with one child only who goes to private school PLUS holidays, extra cash, kids having toys, etc. I think you need a household income of at least £80,000.

And the biggest socialist of all comes to mind - John Prescott, didnt he say he would refuse a place in the House of Lords. Of course when he was offered it he grabbed it with both hands. Funny that - I wonder how he justifies it.

It would be fine if you didnt come out and say you dont agree with something up front. That's great. Good principles. And then when the thing you claim to disagree with/hate comes into view you accept it!

What is all of that about.....

I try not to talk about this in detail on here because it is very identifying but we felt we had no real choice but to send my son to a grammar. We tried to keep him at the comprehensive / secondary modern but he was bullied mercilessly for his special needs. Not low level bullying, this was every day to the point that my son became suicidial. f it was just a few other boys it would have been manageable but it got to the point that everyone picked on him because it was what you did. It also spread to outside of school, he became a prisoner in his own home. He flipped one day and took a knife in, he was excluded - something I agreed with, and it was made clear that he faced a permanent exclusion from school. We were terrified and just wanted a fresh start in a new area. He did not go the grammar because it was a grammar but because it was a different school in a different area.

I suspect that we made a mistake, he was bullied there as well and the pastoral support offered to him was abysmal. The teaching is beyond dull, he seems to go from lesson to lesson working in silence from a text book. Ironically this suits him because he hates having to interact with the other students. I would like to bring him back into the comprehensive system for his A Levels, but I doubt our local school would take him back and the change would unsettle him again.

My other children are at, or will go to the comprehensive/ secondary modern.

My husband and I are both socialists but we have a high household income , for me being a socialist is not about being poor but about working for a society that gives everyone the opportunities that we had.

My husband happily pays a lot of tax which goes towards state schools, hospitals etc. That seems to be socialism to me.

I chose to give up a high paid job to go into teaching because I wanted to be part of making a fairer society, again that seems to be quite socialist to me.

Yes I live in quite a big house, but that is because there are seven of us and we hope to get bigger.

Arisbottle, how awful. Your poor son.

Arisbottle If you found a school where your child would be accepted and not bullied, but it happened to be private... would you send him there if you could afford it? Or are you one of those who has principles that are put above the needs of their children? There are quite a few private schools that specialize on children with special needs - and get fantastic results.

If I had more than one child, and one was "mercilessly bullied" at one school, I would be very, very reluctant to send another child there...

My daughter is at the same school and very happy , my third child is about to move up to the same school and is very excited. Yes there is bullying at the school but as far as I am aware there is nothing else like this. My son has very specific special needs that make him something of a walking target. It was also not limited to the school, in fact it started out of school and then trickled into school. When children were caught they were dealt with and this included exclusion but there became a whispering campaign against him and when it gets to that point it is very difficult to do anything about it. My son was also very very unpleasant to other children.

It was also mainly girls who were bullying him, the grammar is single sex which was something else that appealed.

We did not even consider private and we approached other state schools as well as the grammar.

Tasmania as I said he was not accepted at the grammar either, he was bullied there, in part because of they way he reacts to situations, The bullying eventually stopped just because all the children grew up.

That is for you LaVolcan Why are houses in Stoke on Trent relevant to Exeter? As it happens, I have lived in that area too, (although not recently), and it's an area of high unemployment, and not surprisingly, not an area flush with independent schools.

However, for Newcastle under Lyme School the fees are: £8154 per year prep dept + lunches £178 per term, Senior School £9984 per year

The only data for wages I could find quickly dated from 2008
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/staffordshire/7225167.stm showing the average weekly wage of £360.

Taking your cheaper property into account, I work out that after the senior school fees, someone on the average salary for the area would have £70 a week left to live on. This is before you consider council tax, utility bills, transport, food. So it's not surprising that the area can't support many independent schools.

"I think why Seeker leaves me confused is the fact that not only did she allow her DS sit for the exam because she had no choice, she also appealed when he did not make it."

I am opposed to selective education. I am very much in favour of setting. The set which would best suit my ds is in the grammar school. As his current form tutor said to me unprompted tast week.

Arisbottle
I see your situation as different to those who say they had no choice but to accept the grammar because they didn't fancy the SM. You felt you had to move your son to protect his MH and your only viable option was to move him to the GS. That was a welfare decision not an educational one.

I'm glad to hear things are getting a bit better now, it must have been a very worrying time for you.