Changes to 11-plus to stop middle-class parents 'buying' access to grammars by hiring tutors

[breadandbutterfly]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2241411/Changes-11-plus-stop-parents-buying-access-selective-schools-hiring-tutors-children.html

Similar article in the Times apparently but paywall.

Thanks bread

I would have to dispute that any parent can do it. I have no patience. At all. We shout at each other and at least one of us ends up in tears. DD will trot off quite happily if we "outsource" to a tutor, who is calm and knows "how we do it at school". Also other little siblings around is a major distraction.

Yes I agree with that. The obvious answer to state school primary pupils not performing as well at 11 is to improve the education of state school primary school pupils, not lower the the education of others.

Ooh,my first ever MN flowers.

Thank you, what a lovely start to my day. I am in bed with flu, hence my close monitoring of the internet to liven up feeling lousy, so I shall put the flowers in a virtual vase by my bed. :)

Gha. Spockster not you I agree with the other thing. But Spockster I think it's highly likely that you'd be better at it than you think.

Just on the off chance that Ronaldo and his DS are real, may I give you some heartfelt advice?

You are not creating anything but a child who will be viewed by all other children at private school as odd and a wierdo. He won't mix effortlessly and influence others and become a well respected leader; he will be an oddity and an outcast and probably very unhappy.

Why do I say this? I have three DCs who have attended/are attending several of the top private schools in the country (ones which would certainly meet your standards) and I have seen children like your son. The ones who arrive at secondary school with GCSE Mandarin, but never make any friends. The ones who do nothing at home but work or play music and don't know how to interact.

There is a modicum of modern culture which provides a shared, binding experience and is partly how people connect. Etonians play football and support football teams just as much as they do rugby. My DC3 at his very traditional prep school, where two thirds of the children learn two classical instruments, was the star of the school the day after he bumped into an X factor contestant and had his photo taken with them.

Interestingly, I do think sport also plays a vital role in helping children connect so I would heartily recommend you remedy this ASAP. I am thinking of another child I know, with older, very traditional and academically aspirational parents, who studies hard, plays numerous instruments etc. He is a bit culturally different from the other children, but his parents were smart enough to make sure he played football. He's an excellent striker, and it's transformed how his school life has turned out.

Many people can achieve all you hope for without being as limited as you are being, and your DS would be happier and arguably more successful if he could connect better. And frankly, the people you aspire for him to mix with manage to excel at academia, sport, music, being clubbable, current and cultured all at the same time. Your DS is missing many vital attributes he will need.

Sorry OP, I know I was off topic.

"You are not creating anything but a child who will be viewed by all other children at private school as odd and a wierdo."

This is just weird in itself, unpleasant, ignorant of another person's child, out of place, insulting, and probably just downright jealous of a parent who's doing things differently to you and has higher expectations.

Spockster - no , my dd and me shout lots, we had 2 younger and normally disruptive siblings (4 year old boys not renowned for being quiet and sensitive), but we did manage it. It can be done, honestly. And 'how we do it at school' is exactly what your dcs don't need to learn from you - it's the stuff that they don't ever learn at school, or through tutors, that you need to teach. Tutors can't do it half so well - becaue tey don't know your dc. They don't know when they are trying their hardest but failing because they can't do it intellectually, or whether they are being a lazy little shit who can't be bothered to try. They daren't suggest the latter because they'd get the sack.

But you do know the difference. So you can make a difference.

It's OK Bry, no-one ever agrees with me
But really, I am crap

X post with Brycie. :)

11+ coaching at home would have been a bloody nightmare with dd2, who does not always respond well to that kind of thing from her parents - though is very amenable at school, and not daft either.

I think the temperaments of the children and parents involved must play a huge part here regardless of the skills and education of either side - I imagine a lot of parent-child relationships must take a bit of a battering in year 6, in grammar areas.

Yes, I think the best thing is to make it like a school environment - so the same hour every week or twice a week, a good routine, and when you aren't doing it - don't do it. Just make it the set times, plan your lesson, make sure you understnd the stuff thoroughly yourself before sitting down iwth the child.

Those are all aspects you cannot tutor with a crammer session or two but are essential to success in life and a good atmosphere for learning in a classroom.

Noooo, you're not crap, Spockster!!!

Oooh, was that Ronaldo agreeing with me? I think I have come over all faint...

Spockster you you ain't. I just had my daughter in tears trying to help her prepare for an assessment. I wasn't mean, I just had the wrong approach as I was tired, hadn't prepared. Yet I tutored her in science through 13+ exams very successfully. I've spoken to a number of parents (sadly I am on) who've said their CHILDREN told them - "mum I've learned more this month than I have have at school". It's a shocker. It's so unfair that primary schools are so inconsistent and the national curriculum so rubbish.

Gawd it's an outbreak of peace. Hold the front page.

I don't know of a parent/DC tutoring effort that didn't have shouting and crying. It's 'normal'.

Plus don't forget that blank moment when you've explained everything beautifully, it's all so simple, it's all so obvious, you've got nothing more and the child says - I still don't get it. And you just think - fuuuuck what now.

breadandbutterfly

Totally echo what you've said.
We started in earnest with the exam technique, in May of Yr5 too, although DD been dipping in and out of Bond books since she was 6 - her choice, not mine. I totally agree about feeling sympathy for children forced to do the work. We see parents living vicariously through their children in our hobby, too and it saddens me. I was lucky that I had a DD who is incredibly self-motivated as far as school work is concerned and it was entirely her choice to do the work - always! She is a very compliant child but does know her own mind - no tantrums or pre-teen tantrums...ever...a very willing pupil and she told me how much she loved the experience of working with me. DD1, on the other hand...the 11+ was her dream too but boy, was it ever a trial and it came too soon for her stage of development...but it changed her in so many positive ways that have enhanced her life and study skills ever since. So you see, not getting that GS place doesn't necessarily have to have a negative effect on a child

Brycie
"Plus don't forget that blank moment when you've explained everything beautifully, it's all so simple, it's all so obvious, you've got nothing more and the child says - I still don't get it. And you just think - fuuuuck what now. "

I hear ya loud and clear lol! I hardly ever got that situation with DD2 but I did with DD1. In cases such as those, I used the internet for all it was worth cos there's always more than one way to skin a maths cat, especially these days, with all the new-fangled, wheel re-inventin' techniques
What did we do before the internet?

I mean look at this, it's dreadful

It's not fair on children who have their chances damaged by this dumbing down - but it's crazy to stop other children from learning more because of it.

About politeia

I don't live in a grammar school area.

I would like to think that on a level playing field ds would pass the test easily. He is good at that sort of thing, and (ahem) I was told by his headteacher that he had scored the highest SATS marks in the county.

HOWEVER, reading all this stuff about tutoring and mass hysteria, I would no doubt feel compelled to jump on the bandwagon and tutor him to death simply to keep in the game. So I don't think middle classes are necessarily buying places, but fear being left behind because "everyone else" knows the rules.

I have never been to CenterParcs, but apparently you have to book the activities there months in advance, you can't just toddle up on the day and do, say, archery. Or, you can't walk onto a train on 19th December and expect to sit in a prime seat. Etc etc. As others have said, the internet offers information, but it conversely makes life a bit of an arms race.