Gifted and talented.

[jabed]

Its three O clock in the morning. I have a stinking headache which is why I am up and I would like to get contentious. Do you mind?

With no holds barred, my DS is by any definition gifted and talented. I am a fairly able kind of guy myself and DW is extremely gifted, so no prizes for guessing where he gets it.

The thing is, I have been pondering what I am going to do with him. We currently HE. This is because he is young- He is a late August born and would, were he at school he going into year 2 now. Many a couple of weeks younger would just be going into year 1.
He is gifted as I said, which is another reason for not putting him in school. he has a generally high IQ and academic giftedness and if SW is right he has musical talent.

I don?t want him accelerated. I don?t want him messed with. I want him to be what neither DW nor I were - a child with a childhood. My experience of the local school, which would have been our first choice (and was in fact where we sent him) for his primary years do not deserve him. The teachers cannot deal with gifted children. He does not deserve his peers in that school - disruptive and largely ill socialised with a large percentage at the other end of the spectrum to DS. But there is no other local school.

There is my own school which has a prep but they want to put him a year up.

So, what do you do in that situation? I am at a loss. I have looked at options and got bogged down. We have to make a decision before year 3 as I seriously believe he needs to be in formal education at some point there.

Just a general throw out to see what others would do with such a DS. I reserve the right to get toss potty if people get rude about my DS or my feelings about being middle class etc.
This is my DS not an abstract. Thanks

I think not in the UK: the OP is seven hours ahead of the time it says, too. Not savvy enough to guess where that might be, but it does make sense I think!

I think he is 7 hours behind. 3 am there when it is 10 am here. That fits with his DW being Canadian.

The levels of SEN at the school were very high, which could have been offputting, but actually meant that they had a very individual approach to each childs education

^ This. Often very true.

jabed he's so young. I'm sure you'd be the first to concede that his home life is not the norm (by which I'm simply referring to your own age and the fact he's an only child). If you want him to enjoy his childhood as you insist that you do, then surely it must be better to put him back into mainstream school and stop keeping him in a sheltered cocoon. No amount of academic achievement or musical excellence will make up for having been somehow sidelined from life.

I thought it was kno
wn I am not in the UK at the moment. We are on vacation. I am aware of GMT+ 1 time set.

Now to see what I can answer. Much of what I say I have said previously when I first arrived over a year ago. MN were helpful then with HE suggestions. We have been happy with HE but there are matters we cannot get round.

Our first choice of school was the local village school (we live in a village). It was a short walk down the road, looked good from the outside. We had no idea about the problems and didn?t think to find out. Mistake on my part more than DW. I accept that.

DS is young - in fact he isn?t yet 6 (that?s next Monday). We were misinformed by the school and LEA that we should place DS in school the September after he became 4. We were not advised this was unnecessary.
it proved a mistake anyway.

Having discovered after a term and a half that there were problems, we looked for an alternative.

The alternative schools were all full. The only LEA provision was the school we were in.

I for other alternatives. My own school has a good prep. However it was also full in my DS's year group. They said advance him a year because
a) he was high ability and this would work
b) it was the only class where there was room.

As some have pointed out, placing him a year up has problems of its own further down the line. At some point, be it senior school, GCSE or A level he will have to back class on grounds of age, so its not a good move.

The prep is a long drive away. The hours of the school give me some concern anyway. Whilst it?s my own school and I will not disrespect it, it isn?t to our liking really. I think it?s too busy busy pushy in short. A place for tiger mums.
The long hours mean tired children frankly and I don?t want that for DS. The state school hours are far more reasonable.

That said, the prep holidays are better for us as we move off every holiday as soon as I am out of school. With independent schools having much longer holidays that would be a problem.

HE has opened up a bigger gap between DS and the school system as DW has educated at DS's pace and this has probably placed him in yr 4 or 5 in terms of attainment now.

There would be nothing wrong with continuing to HE in many ways. It suits us and it seems to suit DS. However, as someone said, our DS is an only child. We live in a relatively isolated place and there are few children his own age around. We have noticed this holiday that he has been happy having found others of a similar age to play with.

So he needs some social life. Ideally a school one as I am not altogether one for the busy extracurricular. Children need play time not busy extension time really. I know some MNers won?t agree but that is my philosophy

So everything has to be a compromise. I don?t know where it?s best to compromise.

We would have liked (in common with many HEers) to use flexi school but LEA schools have no facility for that. My prep is too far.
We have looked at one other local school. A small independent prep. However, its church run. It has its attractions though.
a) long holidays
b) no homeowrk policy
c) small and nice DC's

So there you have it in a nutshell.

i thought it was known I am not in the UK at the moment

How self important actually are you?

How self important actually are you?

Why dont you start your own school as the one you have in mind doesnt exist? People have done that before..

How self important actually are you?

I thought MNers hung on every word as many including you OSN have plenty to say about any comments I make and seem to know more about me than I do myself. How self important is that?

I did say several weeks ago we were for the off to Canada. We have a place here. I spend as many weeks in Canada as I legally can. It is good for DS and he loves it. The life is better.

But alas we have to live in good old UK for me at the moment.

your first error was to assume that people actually read everything you type .

Many people comment erroneously and with great conviction on MN

Yellowtip - bottom line and forgive my frankness - I do not want my DS lumped into a mainstream school where the majority of pupils are under socialised, out of control, kick and spit and swear like troopers and who would be more at home in a garbage bin than in school.

As you said, our lifestyle is different. I would like first and foremost for my DS to meet with DC's who are like us. The lifestyle isn?t that unusual really. It just isn?t chav town central. You can call me a snob but one thing I found as a lad was I could not fit in with my peers who did not share my background and I suffered badly for that.

DS is probably better at home than in that.

Many people comment erroneously and with great conviction on MN

Thats a good observation :)

The levels of SEN at the school were very high, which could have been offputting, but actually meant that they had a very individual approach to each childs education

^ This. Often very true

The school had its chance. It proved not to be up to the task.

I could move and I have explored that but it would seem many schools within my travel to work area are either full or suffer from the village school problem.

Someone asked wht my DS thought. Well he doesnt seem too worried really. he isnt into sports and things. He likes playing in the garden on his swing when not doing school work and playing music. However, I am sure he must miss having DC's as company.

The only real option we may be left with is the small Christian School a village or so away. Can we live with Genesis being taught instead of Darwin (or as well I think)? At least the children there know how to sit at a table and dont throw their lunch at each other.

DW is in favour of this school! Its my reservations

I am utterly stunned at how you are describing the majority of children at the local school when the reality will be that there is a tiny minority behaving in this way. I have gifted children - musically and academically, one used to be ten years ahead before deciding the PC was more stimulating. They go or have been in the most elite schools in the country and I would never describe others in the way you have. "they don't deserve your son"? You do your son a great disservice keeping him from the real world. He will never grow up rounded, developed or normal.

Fwiw, I know quite a few highly gifted musicians and academically able only children who are home educated and the "world" views them as weirdos - or at least very, very odd. Very little empathy, not good at sharing, used to having undivided attention and act like mini adults apart from they never develop empathy,patience or the ability to listen to others as they are used to biased parents cooing as they pontificate! They remain odd into adulthood - selfish, blinkered and clueless. I also know grounded parents who HE only children and they are a gift to society.

What did the old school do wrong? Was it the other children or other problems?

What you can find with schools that do well in the league tables (which are usually middle class schools with low numbers of children with SEN) is that there can be a lot of preparation for SATS. You may or may not see that as a good thing, depending on your viewpoint.

I think you need to decide what is most important for you. How will you judge whether your child is being academically stretched in a way valued by you?

For example we (and dh and I am presumably what you would call academically able given that we both have Oxbridge degrees) chose ds2 and ds3's school based on the curriculum. So we liked forest school, the drama activities, the schools clubs, the workshops they run etc etc. We were not as interested in their academic results - and as it's a mixed ability school they're not going to be as high as a selective school. We're very happy with the school - if we were focussed entirely on academic achievement in terms of marks and scores we might not be.

You need to know what you want from a school - then choose. It's not actually clear to me from your posts whether you want a school with a very academic focus where your son's academic achievements are monitored closely, or one with a more laid back approach. For example I have no idea what the IQ of either ds2 or ds3 is. I know academic work isn't a struggle for them, and I know they're happy. The school tell us at the end of the year which level they are on but there's no close monitoring of scores. I would imagine that it's the sort of place that might not suit you at all - although we chose the school because it provides something you mention that you want - allows children to be children and gives them a childhood (grubby outside doing forest school regularly).

Do agree with Collager though re ways of talking about other children.

Why were the children so badly behaved? I'm not really quite understanding that.

DS2 and DS3 have learned to sit at the table and eat properly despite having a brother who can't.

Colleger, before we removed him my DS came home from the school having been bitten on the cheek by another child. I drew the line there.

When I say they do not deserve my DS I mean that. They could not keep him safe. They (the teachers) were clueless about him, who he was his abilities and had no idea how to try and teach him. This was understandable in a class where a third of more of the pupils were EBD statement and the other two thirds were just feral.

I sent them an articulate, pleasant , well behaved young boy and he came home with words I had not heard except in the docks.

OK, so it?s not nice to say. Sometimes though it has to be said.

Jabed.

We are EHE our dd from September, but she went to a small town central faith school. It was really nice, the children are lovely, and I promise you they did not bible bash.
However, we have left because of the lack of opportunity of music within the school and because she missed so much last year due to musical activities outside school.
If your ds is talented I would suggest that most schools would not be able to meet his needs, I know some are extremely good at this but feel they are in a minority. Our dd is 8 would be y4 this year, she is keeping in touch with some friends from school and has many friends of all ages she can play with.
Personally, I don't think peer groups should all be the same age and often in schools this is the only thing they have in common, being the same age.
We are lucky as dds talent is only in music not academic, however if it was I still thing EHE would be the favourite, perhaps with tutors rather than me and dh.
You say you have problems and issues with continuing with H.E, What apart from socialisation are your issues. There are many good H.ed local groups out there who are very supportive and your ds would make friends there I'm sure.

I think you need to decide what is most important for you. How will you judge whether your child is being academically stretched in a way valued by you?

I am not that concerned about academic stretching or similar. DW and self can easily see to that. What we do want is somewhere he can meet other DC's and have learn to socialise with children his own age. Being with adults all the time does tend to make him more adult and more mature ( and I do not mean he is selfish and attention seeking!). However, I want him to be with DC's who come from homes like ours. They do not have to be clever, just ...... ye Gods - Middle Class? Received English, clean, tidy and well mannered would do it.

" - bottom line and forgive my frankness - I do not want my DS lumped into a mainstream school where the majority of pupils are under socialised, out of control, kick and spit and swear like troopers and who would be more at home in a garbage bin than in school. "

You're lovely aren't you.

Why not also have a think about how you are preparing your son for life in the world. I hope you have the foresight tk allow him to be a child and to mix with all sorts of other children otherwise he is going to find the grown up world very tough indeed, 'gifted' or not.

I don't think you can ensure he only mixes with children who are clean, tidy, well mannered etc. Life isn't really like that. One of the worst cases of bullying I have come across was at a very expensive socially exclusive school for example. Children everywhere swear. DS2 attended a holiday sports camp and came out each day cheerfully reporting the words one particular boy had been using (it sounded fairly constant). He didn't suddenly start using them himself though.

What apart from socialisation are your issues

Well, none really. Its the fact we do not have access to a pool of DC's who he can play with and we think school would make things more normal in this.

My poor little DS came home with a nasty bite mark at similar age from a "lovely" private school set in in the beautiful country estate, hugely overpriced uniform etc etc.Whe I pointed that out to the teacher next day they didnt seem to be that worried. It happens - little kids bite.
I took him out later but not for that reason.

Why not also have a think about how you are preparing your son for life in the world. I hope you have the foresight tk allow him to be a child and to mix with all sorts of other children otherwise he is going to find the grown up world very tough indeed, 'gifted' or not

This is a common argument but it is not correct. In the whole of my life the only times I have had to "mix" with " all sorts" was at SM school. I can genuinely say I have not done it since. If my mother had been less principled I would have avoided the worst of the mixing with "all sorts" at school too.

It is not necessary to be able to do this. It is though I have found in my fifty years or more, very necessary to be able to mix with those who form your working peer group and social class group. It is also very useful, no matter what your origins to be well mannered, clean, tidy and well spoken I have found.