Saturday Detentions . Cant work out if its a good or bad thing .

[wakeupandsmellthecoffee]

This is at a normal state comp .
At Xxxxxx, we are constantly aiming to develop and improve. It is clear that the more time students
are in lessons, the better they achieve.In the past , if a student has repeatedly failed to attend
detentions set for incomplete coursework or homework, they have been sanctioned with a day in the
Inclusion Room. Although this solution has enabled them to catch up on work they should have done
already, it has meant that they have fallen behind in work from other lessons during that day
To prevent this happening, while also ensuring students complete all work expected of them, we have
decided to trial two new sanctions. Students who have not completed coursework or homework for the
required deadline and who have not attended detentions set by their teacher,and then by the Head of
Faculty, will:
· Be put into a two hour detention on a Saturday morning when they will be required to complete
the missing work. One week?s notice will be given of a Saturday morning detention; or
· Where it is deemed appropriate, parents/carers will be asked to attend an after school session with the student in the Learning Resource Centre to supervise their son / daughter completing the missing work .
We will monitor the success of these measures in ensuring students meet coursework and homework
deadlines.
This new system will be implemented from Monday 21November 2011, with Saturday detentions
beginning on Saturday 26 November.
Yours faithfully

Mrs B OSS LADY

To be fair this is a final result . And many things seem to be put in place befor this happens ,ie warnings , checking that nothing is going on elsewhere that would prevent them from completing their work .
Also what about the poor teacher having to supervise it .

yes, discipline in many schools is failing. From my experience it is down to just a couple of factors - families and a sense of 'their rights'/think that the world owes them a living brigade.

As I have previously said, the excuses that student's parents use to keep their little angels from serving any punishment for any crime is unbelievable.

There is also a "I know my rights" or I can do what I want want and you can't do anything (not helped by the "lets not exclude brigade, and if a school does dare to exclude then the appeal will just let them back in")

I often think back to when I was at school - I was not an angel by any means and I went to a rough school in a very deprived area. However, there would have never been a point when anyone thought it was ok to swear at a member of staff for example. I nor none of my fellow classmates would even think that our parents would argue with the school over any punishment that was handed out to us. Unfortunately, it is a far too familiar scene in many schools that some students think that they can do what they want

That said, it is still the minority, but it is a worrying trend...

"the excuses that student's parents use to keep their little angels from serving any punishment for any crime is unbelievable"

I'm sure you've come across some corkers! But I think Saturday detentions are wrong, and not every school uses them. And I really wouldn't want to get into the referreeing of how people spend their weekends and what is or is not worthy, and I should imagine most staff don't either.

If parental choice were real, not illusory, then families could vote with their feet on this, or any other part of disciplinary or other policy. I don't think that any LA is currently offering an entrance criteria for Jewish families based on Saturdays and discipline policy!

I can also see how it would be counterproductive to have out of two miscreants, one teen with detention and another teen exempted for whatever reason.

It is worrying though that these kids are choosing to go down the wrong path but also while they are doing this and messing about in class other kids are missing out because they disrupt the lesson . . (I am 47 and a childrens nanny , my poor Ds dosnt stand a chance )

My son's scholl operated Saturday detention.I had no problem with it and neitehr did my son. It works!

SnapesMistress - are you sure you have made the right career choice. I would have thought it best to at least wait until youare a teacher to be able to describe the children you are paid for educating as bratty teens.

By the way, scholl should be school ! Typing not my strong point :) Equally neitehr should be neither. Look upon reading my messages as a challenge akin to a word puzzle.

DSS had a Saturday detention a few years ago for a ''serious breach of school rules'' (he was caught smoking at school). Both DH and DSS's mum supported the school in this even though we had to change plans as it was our weekend for contact and DH had to drive to collect him afterwards. No punishments were given before this but due to the seriousness of the incident it went straight to a Saturday detention. We were however given a couple of weeks notice of the date he would be expected to serve the detention.

DS1 is in his first year at a different secondary which does not have Saturday detentions but I would support it if they did even though he would have to miss his activity that morning.

Both DSS and DS1 can walk home from their respective schools but I know that at DS1's school they run an after school bus at 3:15 and also a sweeper bus at 4:30 for those pupils who have attended detentions, after school activities or clubs or who have been in the library studying.

DCs went to a school that had Saturday detentions. They were more of a deterrent than weekday ones as they impinged more on their free time.

We had no problem in supporting the school wrt them

I'm surprised by how many people are surprised by the notion of Saturday detention. Round here (central London) loads of schools do it. At the schools that I know of the deal is that you turn up at 9am on Saturday in full school uniform, and do your 2 or 3 hours of whatever. It's considered a pretty serious punishment, but quite a bit short of suspension.

None of my dc has ever had a Sat detention as it happens, but I'd far rather they did that than were given a fixed-term exclusion which is basically just time off dossing around at home with the added disadvantage of them missing out on lessons. I really can't see a problem with (at least it in an urban area with good public transport links).

Appalling idea. Saturdays are not school days and therefore not days that schools should be giving out detentions. No good teacher, pupil or parent could think otherwise. Poor teachers, especially- surely they have enough of the little fuckers darlings Monday to Friday. And unless my child was well out of order (which they could well be) there is nfw I would be supervising my kid at a detention any day of the week, but especially not Saturday.

I would write back to boss lady and the governors and say I thought it was a load of bollocks not great idea, wakeup.

Would be very happy with my school if they did Sat detentions as its a great deterrent and as a teacher I'd be willing (but not exactly happy) to give up the odd Saturday to do them. Well worth it to improve discipline within the school. Much better than an exclusion when they get to sit at home watching TV.

For not completing course work, I think it's a great idea. I would happily haul DSs butt into school on a Saturday morning if it meant he achieved a higher grade in his GCSE's. - Although I think they should let them come in wearing non uniformbecause I couldn't be bothered to wash yet another shirt.

I don't think it's a good idea for general poor behavior in class.

I do wonder who would be covering the detentions, though?

Would teachers be expected to do it out of the goodness of their hearts? Or maybe Boss Lady will be supervising????

'...so you're in detention on Saturday'
'No'

'OK, the Head or his/her appointed representative will be at your house first thing to perform a citizen's arrest'.

It's just not going to happen, is it?

So then you end up back to Inclusion with all the attendant problems - I have a bright but arsey lad in year 11: he truants Monday, is in the Inc. on Tuesday (if he doesn't do a runner), & rocks up to my lesson Wednesday with no idea what's going on...so he truants Thursday to avoid me keeping him in to catch up missed work...

We have a successful 'Last Chance Saloon' until 5 on a Friday. Kids are collected from last lesson by SLG if they have missed dt earlier in the week. It sorts out 90% of missed dts without the need to miss lesson time. No fun for SLG, but hey, they're well paid to compensate for the pain.

Snapes

You are in for a shock - you will spend most Saturdays of your NQT year in school. Either that or you will not pass your NQT year.

Hi all - been directed here from a teaching forum - finding it interesting.

Saturday morning detentions are becoming more common, yes it inconvemiences parents - and the kids but not the teachers, there is always someone in a school on a Saturday morning.

I think a weeks notice is too short for this: even with the best will in the world it might be impossible for parents to arrange transport and re-arrange their Saturday commitments (e.g. visiting sick or elderly relatives/working/taking other more deserving siblings to activities that might be important to their future) at short notice.

I have a teen who is school refusing (health problems) and sometimes struggles to complete course work on time; fortunately, her current school is supportive, but her last school would definitely have regardeded it as a discipline problem, so in a different setting we could easily find ourselves in this situation. The person it would impact most on would be MIL who is also ill and lives in a nursing home several hours drive away. And in the second instance, her younger brother who has not displayed any of these tendencies. Needless to say, neither MIL nor little brother have any control over dd's attendance.

Not saying I am totally unupportive of the idea- I do appreciate that punishments should be inconvenient, but maybe longer notice would lessen the impact on innocent third parties (among which I do not count parents).

I said bratty teens because presumably the nice ones would not have got so far in the detention process.

I probably would not volunteer to do saturday clubs but would not be bothered about a trip as they would be rare and it would be something worthwhile.

I probably (definitely) will end up doing work on the weekends but it will be on my own terms. I can't imagine anything worse than having to get up early and supervise a detention.

Surely the point of a detention is that it's inconvenient. And surely one of the points about being in a family is that sometimes, stuff one person is doing creates inconvenience for the other family members, which they work around because in the longer term the rewards are greater. Both these things would apply with a Saturday detention - so yes, it will be annoying to have it impact on family time, teenager's job etc, but surely the idea is that longer-term they learn a lesson about having to face consequences of their behaviour, and to see that those consequences also impact on other people. To expect them to be excused because they/the family have 'other commitments' does seem a bit like teaching them that an 'excuse note' culture is right and desirable.

Having said all that, I do have grave doubts that the kids who would get these detentions (if they are used as last resort, which I think is right) would actually go to them. So it may well be that it just sets up another pointless hurdle that the kids refuse to jump and then it has to go to suspension or whatever. Can anyone at a school where this system is already in use comment on the rate of no-shows?

Cricketballs-you would make a good politician, you have skirted around my question!
How would children get themselves to and from a saturday detention?I am guessing you live in a town and have no experience of rural transport or lack thereof!

I think it's partly a game they play with admissions. Some schools put this sort of detention policy very much front-centre (Evelyn Grace Academy leaps to mind).

Parents like me look at it and think "Blimey, that's quite strong, maybe it will discourage the disruptive element from disturbing my child's education".

Other parents look at the policy and see the extent of parental involvement involved and think "sod that, that's their problem" or know from primary school that all teachers are always "unfair" to little Johnny and always punish him "for no reason at all", or are sadly aware that little Johnny really is a problem and will probably continue to be a magnet for detentions. They will be deterred from applying to that school, which is probably the intention.

Of course families who would find this policy unworkable for logistical reasons will also be dissuaded, (if they think it likely that their child willbe on the recieving end) which is presumably not what is intended.

And some parents who are worried about little Johnny's behaviour and constantly complaining about the absence of discipline in English schools (and the absence of the birch) will presumably lap this stuff up, but at least they'll support it (as far as they can).

I know this sounds smug, and I am only too aware that children can go wildly off the rails between 10 and 15, but realistically, on average, I think a school which targets its message at parents who think that discipline is something that a school does to other people's children, to help their own DC get some peace and quiet, will get an easier intake. And by making the parents sign a detailed learning contract of this type, spelling out the ways in which their child's misbehaviour will inconvenience them, they hope to concentrate the minds of the deluded ones. If nothing else it puts them on a firmer footing with regards to exclusions.

Or am I being too cynical here?

'by making the parents sign a detailed learning contract of this type,'

How do you 'make them sign' .I never sign those patronising home-school agreement things

I think they are a good idea as a last resort.

Strandedbear, you say "If it has gotten that far then I shal deal with her". Personally I think if it has got that far you have failed to deal with her already.

The contract is presented for signature at admissions time. I don't know whether it's legal to say that admission is conditional on signature, but that's certainly the implication.

The way the OP was stated, this sanction could be handed out not just for brattiness, but for failure to complete coursework or homework. In other words, the kind of failure that is associated with school refusing.

You can be totally unbratty and still not manage that, or manage to attend detentions, if you are in a bad way.

It is all very well saying parents should manage the situation but exactly how do you manage a school refusing, potentially suicidal teen? I am fortunate in that dd is very conscientious about catching up (and also very capable), but there have been instances where I have had to rely on the goodwill on the school. And she is probably as unbratty as they come. There is no way I could physically manhandle her to school and tbh the risks of forcing her are just too great in terms of what she might do to herself under pressure. CAHMS treatment not only has a long waiting list (=months before you can prove to school that there even is a MH problem), but takes years to work- if it is ever going to work which, frankly, we haven't seen yet.

Whether the nice ones go as far as this in the detention process will ime depend on the attitude of the school as much as anything else.

My DS [15] has had one.

It was given for failing to turn up to a weekday after school detention, that seems to be the main reason for the sat detentions [at his school anyway]

Of course I made sure he attended, what I couldnt do was make sure he turned up for the original weekday detention!

The Head teacher ran the sat detentions.

They are told to bring coursework/homework, my son however ended uop doing some cleaning/tidying jobs

My DD's have left high school now, I wouldn't have allowed them to go to a Saturday detention. It would have impacted to much on family life and what if a DC had a Saturday job like DD1 did. Also as it has already been said it's not fair on the teacher having to supervise it. DD1 is a teacher and she already has to do a lot of marking and preparing lessons in the evenings and at weekends.

O