Diversity in Independent Schools, SE London

[SlimSchadey]

Hello,

I have been going to open days at some SE London private primary schools that are meant to be very good. What I have noticed, above all, is that there seems to be no racial diversity at all -- all the students, teachers, administrators are white with a light smattering of SE Asians, perhaps. Do schools make an effort to enrol a diverse group of students and families? Is anyone else bothered by the idea of a school where essentially all the children are from the same type of background?

You have clearly explained what you want and imply my choice is selfish. But surely by inflicting your choice on me you too are only thinking about what you want. The choice to send your child to boarding school is a personal one plenty od f people who send their childrn to independent day schools wouldn't do it and I really do struggle to see what that has got to do with you.
You may be interestd to know that unlike most highly selective independent schools St Paul's has no Pre test at Yr 6 only an interview following that it you are offered a place two years later you either sit CE or an exam aimed at those who have not been prepared for CE by their schools. I understand that this consists of maths English science and maybe French and reflects what would have been taught in a state school. Ok it's not a perfect system but the school is trying to open its self up to all there are many indpendent schools not doing any where as near as much as they are so I feel it is a little unfair to criticise them.

The proportion in private education is about 7% so that's quite a lot of an increase to accommodate and afford. I never did find the stats on how many at each stage, nor do I know how many overseas students might simply vanish.

But it's enough to wreck the education budget probably for several years.

You don't need to make it about boarding again, you know . I was talking about exclusive communities of the very wealthy, not about sending children to board, which I know you are a bit sensitive about having done.

I judge anyone much, much more harshly for using the independent system than I do for sending their child to live elsewhere, truly.

Ok apologies I am sensitive about boarding. I have been accused on MM of being a heartless monster with dysfunctional children. I am happy to be accused of many things but I don't think anyone who knows me would describe me as a heartless cow or my children as dysfunctional.

Getting back to the OP, I think you answered your own post when you said you don't want your ds to grow up like your nephews. So don't send your ds to the same sort of school they went to then.

Have you actually visited your local state schools? Visit them and talk to parents who use them, rather than ones who don't and will criticise them based on third hand evidence. If you have enough money to send your ds to a private school then you probably have enough money to move elsewhere if you really don't like your local state schools. Good luck!

elaine, I also think the world would be a better place without private schools BUT I am more concerned about state schools that are funded by taxpayers but exclude children on the grounds of their faith or ability (and both have a correlation to social class). I chose a private school because it was the only way to get my children into a school with an ethnic mix. I didn't want them to be in an entirely white or an entirely non-white school, I didn't want to pretend to have a faith or for them to be educated in a way biased towards a particular faith. Neither did I want to move house or have them be tutored to within an inch of their lives in order to get into the grammar school miles away. The education system is riddled with inequalities and in my area, my kids would have ended up in a school with huge inequalities WHICHEVER one we chose. I don't think individuals can be blamed for their choices (although I also think the I'm alright Jack attitude stinks) as long as such choices are allowable and encouraged by the state.

'Which always makes me laugh because the last thing you're paying for if you go private is to be mixing with all sorts, is it not?'

I think you've got to be really careful about assumptions like this. Up to 30% of children at private school are on some sort of bursary. To be entitled to a busary at my dcs' school you have to be on a combined income of less than £15,000 a year. My dcs do mix with all sorts. It's the only school in the area with an ethnic mix at all. They have friends who are the children of lawyers and doctors but they also have friends who are the children of parents who are hairdressers and who own a chippy or who work 3 jobs in order to pay the bills. As I've said there are different CULTURAL attitudes to education such that you may well be more likely to get a Chinese child whose parents have a low income in a private school than a white child.

Namechanging regular here

My sons do go to a diverse prep in West London which does reflect the diverse make up of the area - Ealing.

People are entitled to their views on private education and we will agree to differ.

However, I was really fed up to see yet again on this thread people mentioning mixing with children of asylum seekers as some sort of benchmark for diversity (Posh Forrin v Asylum Seeker Forrin). What is it about asylum seekers that some people seem to hold them up as a special indicator of how integrated a place is. How do you think asylum seekers feel about this magical status that some people accord them. My DH came to this country as an asylum seeker and was granted full Refugee status under the 1951 UN Convention he subsequently gained British Citizenship but was stateless for a decade. He is not proud of the fact that his homeland became lethally dangerous for him, or of the fact that he couldn't see his family for over 10 years because the military in his country didn't trust teachers! Please stop using asylum seekers as some sort of touchstone they are often ordinary people who have been forced to make some very hard choices because of circumstances beyond their control.

So when do my sons and their privately educated friends meet a (former) Refugee; every school pick up - its just that they don't realise it because DH doesn't want people to know (hence my name change)

I am not offended or upset but I do wish people would stop stereotyping asylum seekers.

Err...it is precisely that ordinariness that I was highlighting, though. I am however sorry if it inadvertantly caused offence.

And actually my children are the grandchildren of someone who, I think, must have had refugee status - he was certainly a political prisoner in his own country - and fwiw I am enormously proud of that.

My point was also that while you are seeking asylum in the UK, you are not usually going to have very much money at all. Certainly not enough to pay for private education. After you have indefinite leave to remain, it's obviously different.

motherinferior I understand what you are saying and to some extent my post is a release of frustration which has built up over many threads where the phrase asylum seeker has been used as a touchstone of diversity.

Your post was not offensive in the slightest and I appreciate my POV is very subjective.

Yes, you are poor when you are an asylum seeker but so are other immigrants /economic migrants /native brits. I think having had to seek asylum can have quite a profound effect on someone even after they have ILR or even citizenship. As you may have seen within your own family, its hard when your homeland is taken away from you. Having seen the effects it has on the person who had to claim asylum I'd personally rather it wasn't used as a shorthand for "deprived people" or more specifically "deprived ethnic minorities".

fivecandles, I specifically said 'paying for if you go private'.

I didn't mention bursaries.

Watching The X Factor is not an exclusive club that only 7% of the population can join, and which pre selects, regardless of ability, for the vast majority of top jobs in the country........

ElaineReese point was that she didn't like independent schools at he time she did not give a reason. So I made the pint I dont like the X factor.

I didn't give a reason in that post because
a) I've done so many, many times before
b) I was half listening out for the proceedings at my daughter's hallowe'en party below and not in proper argument mode
c) I couldn't see the point, because when people just say 'but I like private schools, why should you have a problem?' they're not usually very susceptible of persuasion.

Would you care to address my X Factor point?

ElaineReese I wasn't criticising you just explaining why I used the X factor as an example. Seeker I'm genuinely interested can you back up those comments with actual hard statistics?

Which comments, sorry?

Do a quick search, HG: it'll show up the stat that seven per cent of the UK's children are educated privately.

"an exclusive club that only 7% of the population can join, and which pre selects, regardless of ability, for the vast majority of top jobs in the country" I'm not disputing the numbers at independent school I'm interested to know if there is statistical proof that all the top jobs go to those from the independent sector.

Yes, but x factor is questionable as an example, because anyone is allowed to watch it. You may not like it, but you can at least watch it if you want to. Unlike private schools (even though some of them give some help to some children who are very very clever but not very very VERY rich, I know......)

Happygardening - say her name three times and Xenia will turn up to tell you it's so.....

Haven't googled but I think, for example that over 60% of the Cabinet are private school educated.

Well, do a search to see the proportion of kids at 'top' universities from private schools. Then go on and look at the educational backgrounds of those in highly-paid boardroom jobs. I'm not doing your work for you - I've got a feature to write!

Not everyone, obviously, will come from private schools. As far as 'top' universities are concerned, plenty of us go to Oxford from comprehensive schools. But there is a disproportionate slant.

I went to both Oxford and Cambridge, I think you really have to go there to understand. I know a lot of people have not been, but if you look around there are some good deals on day trips by bus, I actually drove to both, but on seperate days. I must say the high streets are pretty much the same as any other town, so I wouldn't get too excited about it if you are just going shopping. If you are into chavvy clothes then Bicester outlet centre may suit, hope this helps!