Diversity in Independent Schools, SE London

[SlimSchadey]

Hello,

I have been going to open days at some SE London private primary schools that are meant to be very good. What I have noticed, above all, is that there seems to be no racial diversity at all -- all the students, teachers, administrators are white with a light smattering of SE Asians, perhaps. Do schools make an effort to enrol a diverse group of students and families? Is anyone else bothered by the idea of a school where essentially all the children are from the same type of background?

Ouch, feeling the biting satire!

Happygardening, were you privately educated?

What a bizarre response -it was you said about most people using private education not feeling any guilt!

And why do you assume that other people onthis thread know nothing about the independent sector?

Yes I'm taking the p**s! In reality that the majority of parents who educate their children privately are people who have been dealt by life a better hand and are financially in a position to afford all or some of the fees with help from a bursary. They are not the super rich smug in their 30 bedroomed piles but by receiving perhaps a better ed. either state or private, getting a better job (by this I mean financially better), inheriting money etc and most importantly luck when enough of these factors come together at the same time they find themselves in a position where they can consider school fees. Some like us do it despite having am excellent comp on their doorstep others because they're local schools are rubbish. I doubt few are smug most of us worry about how we're going to pay the next bill, will or are our children happy at our chosen school (you only have to look at other postings about MM to see that) and should we be channelling that money onto a house/pension etc instead. We are lucky that we are in this position; even if we sacrifice everything to do it we are lucky to be able to make those sacrifices and I am very aware that many are not as lucky but I suspect few conform to your biased stereotype.
I was state educated in the days when you just went to the nearest school; a mediocre exceedingly multicultural comp left with a handful of O levels DH was privately educated. I have two DS one in state ed and one in independent I don't condemn those who don't choose private ed. I can understand where they're coming from the only thing I believe and this is from personal experience (I'm lucky in that my DS's are both in excellent schools) is that when the independent sector does it well it will always be better than what the state can offer. I'm not saying this is right or ethical its just a fact I think people who don't experience top independent ed. have no idea what the difference is. I'm not trying to be smug about it in fact the difference is so vast that I believe people need to be aware of it so that when David Cameron talks about Eton style state ed. people need to understand how unlikely this is to happen in the state sector.

Hang non- I'm findingnit hard to separate piss take from reality.

The stuff about hunting and cutlery ( known as knives and forks in posh circles, btw) is pisstake presumably?

What about the smug little world with little or no guilt?

Phone for the fish knives, Seeker,
HG's a little unnerved.
Some state school kids have crumpled the serviettes
And she must have things daintily served...

The cutlery's laid on the table
The wine glasses set out all nice
We're serving ethnic food tonight
It'll be curry, with broccoli and rice.

That nice Mr Patel delivers
But I've boiled the greens myself
And made trifle with jelly for dessert
It's in the fridge, on the second shelf.

The Blue Nun is in the fridge chilling
And I think we are ready to go
Henry will play the pianoforte
It's the best thing he's learned at Stowe.

Sorry to disappoint but no smug world either or "cutlery" although we do use napkins and hunting would once have been true, as was sadly for me, the horses lameness.
Frankly and now I am being honest I'm not sure about the guilt an unhelpful emotion whatever drives it. What makes me cross is that in many cases state education is awful driven by low expectations political correctness and teachers who are too quick to shift the blame for our children's poor performances onto others factors. This also happens in the independent sector as well but parents who pay are generally more vocal and less tolerant of this kind of behaviour. In the ideal world all children should experience what my DS2 experiences but then in my ideal world lots of things would be different.

PS love the poem MrsSchadenfreude Betjamin would have been delighted I'm sure. What never ceases to amaze me and amuse me is that those people really do exist!

Why doesn't your DS1 experience it too, purely out of interest?

And what is "it"?

DS1 is in counties top performing state comp. good but DS2 independent highly selective boys boarding school is in a different world. It was not until he actually started there that I really grasped the difference ok before you go you've got an idea but when your actually there you realise the difference is unbelievable. Again no smugness here I'm only pointing out the difference from experience.

And the "it" is?

Its almost undefinable OK better academic standards, better facilities, more extra curricular activities smaller classes possibly better behaved pupils better results more into Oxbridge etc. But you all know that. Its something else for someone who likes to debate I'm unable to even describe it "it" cant be found on websites or seen at open days. Its not the over whelming smell of wealth/smugness either perhaps its a philosophy on life that pervades every corner; education is not about exam results, or learning for the sake of it but education should be life enhancing making you a more rounded and thoughtful individual I dont know what it is but its there at my DS2 school. Interestingly many who post on MM have said that if their DS wasn't at this school then they would use the state sector instead because we believe that the school is unique and that no other independent school has "it" so why would we bother to pay.

I think you would find most of that "it" at any "highly selective" school. Apart from possibly the facilities - that's because they have plenty of money.

Basically, if you have a school in any sector that can, for whatever reason, select out the disaffected, the troubled and the thick, you'll get "it".

You can get a very different "it" in schools that can't, but it means all the adults involved have to work much harder.

You're stereotyping again. We've friends who've got children in other highly selective schools and DS2's school they will tell you the "it"that we pay for is unique to this school.

If "it" was available in all selective schools I would have accepted the place DS2 was offered by the countries top performing grammar school and I would now have just returned from my third annual holiday perhaps the Seychelles or Indonesia or New England in the fall and would be looking forward to my skiing holiday or buying a house or sorting out a pension. But I don't believe education is that black and white despite all governments efforts to sanitise and regulate both sectors.
I've got to go now I'm afraid the lunch in Peter Jones was real I do hope you and your children have a good day the sun is shinning here hopefully it is for you too. I do so enjoy debating with you all.

"DS2's school will tell you that the "it" that we pay for is unique to this school."

Well, they would, wouldn't they?

And tough shit if you have girls, because they are never going to experience this "it" as it's a single sex school...

I think the 'it' is the private school veneer.

I only came across it when I started working with old Etonians and their ilk. Lovely, confident manners, firm handshake etc etc

I found the veneer difficult as coming from a fairly working class/ lower middle background, bog- standard comp, I was used to people saying what they thought. I felt gauche in comparison and uncomfortable - imposter syndrome.

I have many privately educated friends and most are pretty ambivalent about it and haven't chosen it for their children. As a state ed child I learned to be an independent thinker, I learned that if I wanted it I had to get it myself, I learned not to look at what others in the classroom were doing, but to concentrate on my work even when they were making the teacher cry or throwing things or refusing to sit down and be quiet. And I did well.

Although perhaps another way of describing 'it' is 'marketing'

i think you will find that alot of people who send their children to private school are fairly ordinary but make sacrifices in other areas and go without things that other people may not.

Such as an up to date car or foreign holiday.

also I think the school fees have gone up alot since my generation.

there is nothing wrong with private schools and I love working in one. As I said before there would be even more of a problem if they didn't exist as even more people would have to compete for comprehensive school places or grammar schools.