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Original poster

Are the majority of classes in state schools as disruptive as the class on Jamie Oliver's Dream School?

408 replies

mummynoo · 04/03/2011 09:37

After watching Jamie Oliver's dream school, I am wondering if all state school classes are as rude and disruptive as the class featured in this programme. Since my daughter is due to start infants school this September?

Can any teachers who might be reading this give me their opinion. Is it impossible to teach because the pupils are constantly talking over you?

OP posts:
wordfactory · 07/03/2011 17:16

QLB I can accept that all sorts of scenarios work for all sorts of families.

And those of us who are happy should be very grateful - many have almost no choices.

However, I still say, that women should support the idea of women finding their way into postions of power and influence, whatever we ourselves want to do or be...

It is in all our interests to have women in politics, business, finance, business, law...

So we muct guard against those women who try to denegrate that choice and either say women are too high minded for those worlds, or women want to be at home, or worse should want to be at home.

Whatever your own choices, every time you say women in high positions are unmotherly or acting like 'men' or some other disparaging remark, you are nailing a coffin in the lives of all women.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:17

'FC, maybe, just maybe, some men LIKE the responsibility?'

Maybe. And maybe women do too!

But why does it have to be one or the other for either partner? Why, why, why does everything have to be split along gendered lines?

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:18

I have sacrificed my career, but it isn't really a sacrifice as I have never been very ambitious in that direction. I am lucky that I have skills to earn money-I dare say I could have got quite high up if it has been of great importance to me.

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:20

I can't see anything wrong if it is split on gender lines if that is what you want.(it is only a problem if you don't want it)

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:21

'Why do people assume that if one ( man) is working and the other at home they worker never sees their kids?'

If you have to support an entire family on one salary then there's quite a lot of pressure to earn enough. If you work days a week 9-5 plus commuting (and how many jobs only need this??) then that doesn't leave much time over for seeing kids does it?

In the real world there really aren't many jobs that earn you enough to support an entire family but also leave you loads of time to enjoy with that family.

'I don't see that assumption/comment made about working mothers.'

I wouldn't think it see it any differently.

But where both partners work there's the preesure and responsibility is shared isn't it?

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:22

' can't see anything wrong if it is split on gender lines if that is what you want.(it is only a problem if you don't want it)'

Well, it's not 'wrong' no. But there may well be problems with it. See my list above.

Shirleywhirly · 07/03/2011 17:24

FC - why does it bother you so much that other families make other choices?

i couldn't give a fig what you or your DH do or if you work or don't work. I make choices that suit me and my family and assume others do too.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:25

Well I'm glad it works for you exotic. But there are lots of mainly women in your posisiotn who are really vulnerable. If for example their husband leaves them or gets made redundant or dies. If they don't have a pension. If they choose to go back into the workplace after not being in it for years in this climate where they're competing against people with more up to date skills and experience.

As I say, it's not just about personal choice in the here and now.

I'm sure most of us have days where we'd rather not go out to work...

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:27

'FC - why does it bother you so much that other families make other choices?'

You seem to be implying I'm angry about it? The thing is we're not just talking about the individual choices of a few couples are we? we're talking about huge gender inequalities in our society. And many, many very vulnerable women and families. I don't make any apology for finding this 'bothering' in the 21st century.

Shirleywhirly · 07/03/2011 17:27

Why do you assume those of us who don't work are weak, pathetic creatures with no means of self support and out of date skills?

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:27

I think that you have to do what suits you and your family and you can't make rules for others.
DH is ambitious, thrives on a stressful job and child care would drive him up the wall. I am not ambitious, want time to 'stand and stare' and find childcare rewarding and exciting-so it is a 'no brainer' in our house. I am not saying it is right and it certainly wouldn't suit everyone!

Shirleywhirly · 07/03/2011 17:28

I'd be far more " vulnerable" working in a low paid job married to a low paid husband than I am not working married to a highly paid one.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:29

Nobody's talking about 'makign rules'. But sometimes I think it's useful to realise that our personal decisions are part of a bigger picture. It works both ways.

Shirleywhirly · 07/03/2011 17:30

Exoticfruits - ditto.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:30

Maybe shirley but there are lots of women with no job, no pension, no life assurance who are incredibly vulneralbe if their partner decides to leave them or gets made redundant or dies. This may not be your circumstances but it's important to recognise that it is the case for many. What seems hunky dory in the here and now may have devastating consequences in the future.

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:31

I think that what is important in 21st century is having the choice and not having people tell you that it is unequal gender and women are 'kept', if they are not in paid employment. Rather than feel vulnerable, I feel empowered that I don't have to throw my all into a high powered career-I can tootle around earning 'enough'.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:32

And I would say you're fairly exceptional if your partners can support you and pay for your pensions and they have job security right now!

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:33

If you are sensible, fivecandles, you will get things sorted so you are not in that mess.

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:33

And if you feel confident that you can step back into the workplace if you ever want or need to or that you'll be continue to be happy not working when you're kids have left home then you are very, very lucky!

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:33

I am working fivecandles!

fivecandles · 07/03/2011 17:34

Sensible, absolutley, but you do need a load of money and job security to be able to support a family into their pensionalbe years on one salary.

bitsyandbetty · 07/03/2011 17:35

I share fivecandles view on this. I would never degrade any woman who chooses to SAH but at the same time I do not see this is a purely female role, it should be open to men as well. Both DH and I work flexible me early mornings, him late mornings to balance childcare. It saves relying on relations and inadequare school care that my DCs have not always liked. However, both of us have sacrificed the chance of rising higher up the career path and this suits us both. My parents also had the same set up so it is a role model that I grew up with and seems perfectly normal for me. DH grew up with a SAHM but prefers the joint working/childcare. I have a DS and DD and believe they both should have the same education and the same chances to do what is right for them. I believe that they should choose. My sister is gay and had she been raised to be a mother only whe would have been up XXXX creek. She is now a Director at the BBC and has achieved equal rights because our parents raised us to believe in this. Each to their own but when raising children it is important to give them the belief they can do either IMO. You can not make rules for others. My other sister is a SAHM and that suits her.

Shirleywhirly · 07/03/2011 17:35

FC, I do hear what you are saying but I refuse to sacrifice my happiness, my husbands and childrens on the altar of your perceptions of gender equality.

EF - choice is exactly what we all fought for. not being told we should work at the expense of our own happiness and that of our families.

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:36

I also have the sort of job that I can have breaks from and then get back into-so yes I am 'lucky', but I prefer to think of it as well planned and organised rather than luck.

exoticfruits · 07/03/2011 17:38

'I have a DS and DD and believe they both should have the same education and the same chances to do what is right for them. '

It would never cross my mind that there would be differences! I was brought up with brothers-there was no difference-my education was just as important and they certainly shared household tasks equally.