Son punished for being bullied - again!!!

[Solo2]

I've posted before about DS1's (aged 9) struggles at school this year - loss of self-confidence, various medical/ health issues being investigated and being a the victim of bullying. Last term, DS1 was put in detention - the worst punishment given by the school - because he'd done what a bully had told him to do - out of fear.

Long story and various discussions with the school....but he's still being bullied and yesterday got a 'minus point' for something the bully had done and he hadn't even done! In fact, he'd begged the bully NOT to do it but DS1 AND the bully got minus points!

Under ordinary circumstances, as a parent, you'd contact the school and discuss the situation and expect some advice and support.

However, I daren't contact the school myself anymore. This is because of a side issue. In summary, I was worried about DS1's loss of confidence academically, especially in Maths. I'd heard that the children would be re-mixed into diffreent maths sets, following recent exam results.

I specifically asked if I could be contacted FIRST before these new sets were decided and if DS1 were to be put down a set - as expected - that I could be the one to explain this to him kindly and sensitively. He's had the first half of the yr being publicly humilated for 'failing' in tests in maths and being 'threatened' with being put down a set.

I was told (even got it in writing!) that yes, I would be the first to know and that I could come in and discuss the whole thing....But the night before the new sets were announced to the children, DS2 (DS1's twin) told me that this was to happen.

I was shocked as the school had confirmed that I could have some say in the setting and come in and chat and that I could tell my son. So I emailed the correct teacher and reminded them of that promise and asked for further reassurance that the school had NOT yet set the children.

I got an email back suggesting that I wasn't supporting the school if I didn't trust them to make these kinds of decisions themselves and that the children were going to be told tomorrow about their new sets. I was then told what sets mine would be in.

I had/ have no issue at all about the fact that both my sons have been demoted - as the group size will be smaller and a change of teacher will likely benefit them. I feel shocked though that the school went back on their agreement with me about discussing things with me first...

It gets worse....I got a phone call from the head to say he'd seen the exchange of emails and wasn't happy. We only had 2 mins to talk but the implication was that I should stay well out of all school decisions and not expect any involvement. He also was v v concerned that I'd been given info in advance of the children and teachers involved about the new sets and made me promise not to tell anyone at all....Yet hrs later, I learned that all the children now knew their new sets and teachers....

My sense is that the school feel I'm too often communicating with them and asking for some discussion about how to help DS1 instead of letting the school get on with things alone. So I feel powerless to raise the bullying issue again. It would mean inadvertently also letting them know that the school renegd on another agreement - that of promising not to sit DS1 next to the bully.

It will also look like I'm always complaining - but if i do nothing and this carries on, DS1 will end up yet again in detention for being the victim of bullying.

Last night, DS1 siad he knew the only solution was to kill himself. As you can imagine, I'm extremely worried even allowing for the fact that 9 yr olds can get melodramatic at times. I'm afraid to be labelled as an interfering parent and that this might have a subsequent effect on my children's progression through the school. I'm also afraid that by doing nothing, I'm letting my son down and he's becoming increasingly stressed.

How can I skillfully manage this situation to achieve the best end result??

I wouldn't worry that the school think you're communicating with them too often.

In fact, make the point perhaps that you feel you are having to communicate one or two messages repeatedly.

Bullying should be taken a lot more seriously. I'm sure people here will be able to give you really good advice, but I've heard that asking to see a copy of the schools policy on bullying usually makes them sit up and take notice.

ps, i think maybe it might be important to send message to your son that you're going to stand up on a chair and tackle this awkward situation for him, even though it might make you look bad (which it shouldn't, and doesn't imo)

Reading your post, it sounds like they've intimidated you into thinking that you're in the wrong for challenging them actually do their jobs.

They have failed to investigate serious allegations of bullying.

They have punished your son for another child's actions to the point of him threatening suicide.

They have failed to support him with his SEN (medical issues).

A teacher has threatened and humiliated your child.

I don't think I'd bother complaining to the school, I'd be straight onto the governors, LEA and OfSted.

Good luck

When I first started to read your post I thought your DS was going to be in senior school and I get to the last bit and find he is in primary school. I would not worry about what the school think and would get back in there.
The other thought was about talking to your GP about your DS's feelings, my GP was extremely helpful when my DD was suffering severe anxiety and she got to talk to the health visitor alone which really appeared to help. Just thinking that maybe having an adult who has not previously been involved to talk to may help your DS and add some weight to your arguement with the school.
I have to say that I am a bit at an exam being used to determine sets at this age. My DD is at a very academic school, but even here set detemination is done by in class assessment and any movement is by individual and handled very compassionatly to help the child gain the best benefit.

Solo, I've read your other threads and all I can really say is that this school sounds the pits and is failing your child in many ways.

Have you thought any more about moving him?

I think the reply to that implication should be that the OP will be happy to stay well out of all school decisions and will not expect any involvement - when the school is actually doing IT'S job properly and is protecting this vulnerable, bullied, unhappy child!!

OP - please don't be put off from communicating with the school - your ds needs you to advocate for him, and he will remember your support and what you do to help him.

My heart goes out to you and to your ds. If he is talking about suicide, can I suggest that you get Child and Adolescent Mental Health Services involved - he needs help and needs it soon. I would also agree with IngridBergmann that you may have to consider moving him to another school.

OMG - sorry about rogue apostrophe in ITS - I should know better.

I remember your last thread op and I'm sorry I don't have time now to read what's been said but you've just confirmed what I said before, only more politely then: that school is shite and you're paying for the privilege!
Their behaviour and lack of care and basic cobcern for your DS is outrageous and what they think of you should be the last of your worries. That's how they get away with it, stigmatising families to hide their own failure.
The only option is to take your family away from there. You'll never look back.

You need to move DS2 as soon as you can, probably to the "less prestigious" school you have mentioned on your previous threads.

Is there a good reason for keeping your boys there?

If your son is talking about suicide (melodramatic cry for help or not) you need to act fast on a change of school, not a change of maths set.

Move him now for his sake, i have heard so many stories of young kids being restored to their former happy selves by moving schools, its harder for older kids, don't leave it too long.

If you were in my area (which you could be) I would guess your sons are at C. I would move them immediately and explain why, this is exactly the reason that several sons of friends have been moved from C. Other sons of friends talked about when they "escaped" C. Sending you son/s to L or even HT or anywhere will not be something you regret.

Now you maybe in a different area, but I suggest you start to think clearly. Talk to people honestly,talk to heads of seniors schools you are interested in; I really doubt that you will be the first parent to have problems with this school. In fact if it were C, it used to have a rather bad reputation of churning out boys who did well at the entrance exam but then went on to perform disappointingly.

My son disappointingly wasn't suitable for the local fee paying grammar (and it wasn't right for him), but he now has just as much chance of Oxbridge as if he had got in. You need the right school for your sons, one that will enable them to fulfill their potential.

I think you said in a previous post that you thought the school was good for your dss because it suited them academically. It may be that the reason the school has strengths academically is that it doesn't like much interference from parents, and is "one size fits all" and children are moulded into shape, in what is expected of them, in their schoolwork and behaviour. Sometimes this gives schools a certain "rigour" which suits some families, but can seem harsh when you are at the recieving end of discipline.

But it seems that it does not suit you. Or your ds. I think you EITHER have to put up with the current situation and hope your ds sorts himself out under their supervision (you aren't a teacher in this school, and you have, after all, entrusted him to their superior methods on the basis that this is a good school that WORKS)
OR, TAKE HIM AWAY and not do their job for them if you think they are doing it wrongly.

If this is making you so unhappy, you must rethink the arrangements. Either stop interfering, overthinking the situation, get him to respect the school's decisions, OR get him out of there.
You are working very hard to pay the fees, it is giving you even more stress that you don't need when you have two children to look after. You could make your life much easier.

Don't get obsessed by difficulties, seize happiness and move forward.

I have had various run-ins over my children being bullied in minor ways at school, all resolved satisfactorily. The key was understanding my own child's role, and not just blindly assuming everything was someone else's fault. My child learnt how to deal with the situation, and grew in confidence when I didn't go in with guns blazing but listened to the teacher's point of view, as well as TOTALLY SUPPORTING MY CHILDREN AND SEEING IT FROM THEIR POINT OF VIEW.

Solo2 - so sorry this has flared up again. Has the school been performing the weekly chats they promised?

Also - will your DSs have a new maths teacher next year or the same one? It seems that teacher is a real problem so if they were going to be stuck with the same teachers it might be best to move IMHO.

It does not matter a jot that you are a single parent and what the staff at the school think about how often you are in contact with them. They are a business as well as an educational establishment and you pay them - just the same as all other other families at the school. You deserve the same amount of respect as anyone else - and in fact more so because you ARE doing it by yourself!
{{hugs}}

Thanks for the feedback. Having looked into alternative schools further, for a variety of reasons, there really isn't an instantaneous better option I can see at present but still considering this.

Yes, weekly chats are happening with the deputy head (who scares DS1) and his form teacher who doesn't teach him for anything and who is more like a child himself. DS1 has tended to say a monosyllabic response of "Fine" when asked how he is/ everything is. He was able to say more, one week, after telling me about yet another incident of bullying and after I'd primed the class teacher to support him to say more too. But neither of the men have the social skills to draw info. from a shy 9 yr old lacking in confidence. However, I am v pleased that at least this is in place.

What I've done is told DS1 to tell the teachers at his meeting tomorrow exactly what has happened now - but he's afraid to do so. I also suggested that he tell the music teacher in retrospect what had really happened but he cried at this suggestion and said the teacher definitely wouldn't believe him and would be angry. In any case she won't on principle withdraw the minus point just as the head wouldn't withdraw the detention the other week, despite me explaining v clearly to him that DS1 was being punished for being a victim of bullying.

Ideally, DS1 needs to acquire the skills to stand up to bullies, to tell adults when he's being bullied and to stand up for his innocence even if not believed. But that's a tall order for a little boy who's lacking in confidence.

Nest week is the Parent's Evening but as I get 5 mins per teacher and some teachers are in different buildings and all my appointments follw each other consecutively, I'm going to be pushed to say anything at all. Also, I won't be seeing any teacher who might deal with the pastoral issues - only those doing academic subjects.

The new maths set teacher - who's actually on long term sick - has a reputation for being gruff and v v scary but I actually trust him more - I think although i barely know him - as other parents have spoken well of him and he's had yrs of experience. He's one of the few remaining teachers who've been there for yrs rather than a recently qualified new one. The substitute teacher they'll have before he returns is also brilliant - a man who is experienced and calm and kind and who helpd DS2 enormously with Maths last year. So I'm v pleased about this.

Mummytime, the school isn't school C and I won't mention which it is online as it's all about my own subjective experience with this school and others might have a v different experience and v diffreent children.

DS1 recently saw a psychologist about his academic struggles that indicated he had more potential than he could show. She has personal experience of the school and 'wanred' me that this is a school wgere either you accept their decisions and enable your children to work with those decisions - or you leave. I think that sums it up v clearly.

So now....I'll see if DS1 has the wherewithall to flag up the bullying on Friday....I'll see where I get on Parents Evening...I'm waiting to hear back from the school about a meeting with the head - where I think I'll be berated for interfering too much and I shall have to decide how to tread the middle ground between asserting DS1s needs and placating the head IF I want DCs to continue at the school.

No, you need to stop putting all of it onto ds to have the wherewithal etc.

It's not his job to stand up to bullying, it's the school's job, and your job, to protect him from it.

We have had similar...ds is too nice, needs to be stronger, etc etc

it's a pile of crap. If the psychologist has warned you about the school, what are you waiting for...somewhere else has to be better than this place

The psychologist's warning has put the writing very clearly on the wall. Don't ignore it.

It doesn't matter where you move him to with regard to league tables and academic reputation, if he is happy he will thrive and achieve - he has a right to be happy at school.

www.micheleborba.com/blog/2011/01/23/how-to-bully-proof-kids/

Bullying is a social issue so I would have the bully over for a playdate to socialize,in fact, I have had the bully over for a play date to socialize. And I would socially connect with the bully's parents as well.

Your son seems to have a lot of teachers for a primary school. There is no continuity and very little communication between them by the sound of it. Are you paying for this education? If so, you are getting a raw deal. And if you are getting no answers then you DO need to keep complaining. Maybe take someone with you if you feel intimidated. Definitely look at other options though. Good luck.

"I'm afraid to be labelled as an interfering parent"
Sorry, Solo, but that's sometimes a parent's duty.
Yes I know it feels wrong and you become hesitant and paranoid but that's just the way it is. TBH children NEED a parent who will "interfere" when it's necessary. It's the children with parents who don't bother who end up on the scrapheap at 16 IMO. You are doing your best and my heart goes out to you, particularly when your son is so depressed by it all. Don't let the school sense your fear/anxiety. Go in there confidently and firmly and give them a hard time if they are not showing due concern for your son's welfare and metal stability. He's worth it!

MENTAL not metal

I am SO proud of DS1!!! He's been able to go and talk to his form master today about the bullying incident and the teacher responded well and kindly! Regardless of how he responded, I am just incredibly proud of DS1's bravery today. This is really helpful because it's a sign of DS1 learning to stand up for himself.

As far as the school goes, even the psychologist said that there wasn't a viable alternative and that her son - who as a teenager had been humilated by teachers - learned the life skill of coping with this kind of thing and not letting it get to him. So her take on it was very much - "I'm sure you woulnd't want to leave the school, now your DCs have got in - so use it as an opportunity to help them to manage difficult people" etc etc.

To recap - this is a highly academic school weher parents and children are made to feel huge pride and prestige if you manage to get in at all and most children don't leave unless asked to go. So this is the 'culture' within which we're 'living' as a family.

Hocuspontas, my sons are in Yr 5 and have diffreent teachers for every single subject including Geog, History, Phys Sci, Natural Sci, ICT, Maths, Eng, Games, PE, Music, Drama, PHSE, RE, Art and Design, DT. The teacher I'd emailed is the Director of Studies. The form teacher doesn't take my son for any subjecta nd rarely sees him. Communication between parents and teachers is mostly done by email and many parents woulnd't even recognise most of their childrens teachers at all. I make a point of leanring all I can about staff and certainly know them by sight and their names but some I've never even spoken to at all.

I think the school models it's prep on what to expect at the seniors so that it's not a great step up at all.

DS1 will have his weekly meeting with the two teachers tomorrow and hopefully can talk some more about the bullying. At least he knows I'm incredibly proud of him right now!

I find I'm actually v anxious about my as yet unarranged meeting with the head, despite knowing I've done nothing wrong. My own experience of school - a tiny, tiny all girls school where I was much loved by all staff and knew them all v well and all about their families - is hugely different from the one my sons are at.

Other good news today is that the children have started today in the new maths sets and the sub teacher who'll do their set until the other man returns, seems to have gone down well with both my sons - which is good.

Solo2 that's brilliant!
Well done him!

Your son has done brilliantly - but I agree with Ingrid, he shouldn't have to.
I can't see how staying in an environment where he doesn't feel safe and is wilfully ignored or misunderstood can be good for any child.
I know I for one am happy to wait until mine are big enough and ugly enough to 'manage difficult people' (ffs).
That's the kind of attitude that perpetuates a bullying culture, and puts me in mind of Tom Brown's Schooldays.

Sorry meant to say 'manage difficult people' by themselves.