teen eating issues support thread

[myrtleWilson]

Hello,
would anyone be interested in joining a thread to support each other as we support teens with eating disorders @MNHQ - I'm tagging you in as am conscious of triggering issues and wanted your ok/ground rules to such a thread..

Happy to share our story with DD if others would feel it is helpful...

@Havehope21 thank you so much for writing this, it must be difficult to do and it is very much appreciated. I'm tearing up reading about your wonderful mother who is an example to us all. I've already been googling fluffy socks, which funnily enough my daughter had been talking about already. She also loves jigsaw puzzles and the dogs, and on your advice I'm going to find her some absorbing books - she doesn't gravitate naturally to reading but likes it when she gets there.

I'm so glad your using your experience to study for a masters. I'm sure you will go on to help many people.

[quote Thankgoditsover]@Havehope21 thank you so much for writing this, it must be difficult to do and it is very much appreciated. I'm tearing up reading about your wonderful mother who is an example to us all. I've already been googling fluffy socks, which funnily enough my daughter had been talking about already. She also loves jigsaw puzzles and the dogs, and on your advice I'm going to find her some absorbing books - she doesn't gravitate naturally to reading but likes it when she gets there.

I'm so glad your using your experience to study for a masters. I'm sure you will go on to help many people.[/quote]
@Thankgoditsover I am so pleased that it helped you... the joules socks are very cosy. Nice smells / just making everything very calm really helped. Regarding books - I like Santa Montefiore but that is a personal preference. I just think anything to be completed absorbed in works very well.

This website (School of Life) has some interesting philosophical articles. This might help you all too (not sure how to properly add links so hope copying and pasting is okay) www.theschooloflife.com/thebookoflife/the-role-of-love-in-mental-health/

My mother was (and is) incredible - it was a hard time (financially too), but we have the most amazing relationship now. I can honestly say that the illness made us stronger - please do hold onto that. She was very patient and very clear that she wanted and needed me to live. It took a very long time to build trust and recover - but constant repetition and dedication will get there in the end. At the beginning, even allowing myself to be cosy, warm, relax etc was difficult. I found it helpful if we did these things together - I love my mum dearly, so it helped ease the guilt of being 'selfish' if she was with me. As I said in my post, we very much 'hunkered down' (this is before COVID!) and created our own little bubble. When I was rude or horrid, she would calmly take it (much to my shame). When I calmed down, I felt an overwhelming guilt at how awful I had been (which would fuel the anorexia because I was rude and horrid to someone I loved - see how it is cycle). It helped that she made it clear that she believed that I was a kind, generous and funny person and knew that it was the bullying ED that made me react like that. She would say things like 'yes, that did really hurt me what you said but I know that you are trying to overcome an internal bully so sometimes you lash out like that. Today is a new day so let's have a cuddle and try again.' Lots of 'you are my daughter and I wouldn't swap your for the world' really helps. It sounds very small but I cannot stress enough how much these small phrases interrupt the anorexic voice which convinces you otherwise. Even if you feel like you are getting nowhere, try to say them often as they will chip away at the ED's control.

Sending you all lots of love and hope. You will get through this.

Your mother sounds amazing. How did she learn how to be such an effective support? Was it instinctive or did she do lots of reading or have some sort of professional background?

Coincidentally I was just saying to a friend that oddly the ED is bringing DD and I closer. She's open to hugs in a way she wasn't before and we're having to spend a lot of time together without her siblings or me working/being on my phone. I hope in a weird way I'll be able to appreciate this in the future.

So the mask has slipped. Only managed ½ fish finger, a couple of bits of carrot, a jelly and ice-cream pot for lunch. So she was told she had to have 60ml Fortisip. Refused to choose a flavour then has refused to drink it, saying her 'gag reflexes are going crazy over it' and she'd rather have a tube up her nose.

@Havehope21 thank you so much for taking the time to tell your story. In the turmoil of dealing with this illness it is sometimes hard to find the inner strength to be patient and as caring as your mum was but I am trying to tell my DD that she is loved and that I know how hard this is for her. I have also said that I have her back against the bully and will help her stand up to it until she is strong enough to do it herself and that seems to help. I said today that I needed her with me. We snuggle on the sofa a lot and I will try the hand cream trick as she has terribly dry and chapped hands. Thanks again it is so helpful to have hope.
@lougle sorry to hear things are not as good today. 😢

@Thankgoditsover

Your mother sounds amazing. How did she learn how to be such an effective support? Was it instinctive or did she do lots of reading or have some sort of professional background?

Coincidentally I was just saying to a friend that oddly the ED is bringing DD and I closer. She's open to hugs in a way she wasn't before and we're having to spend a lot of time together without her siblings or me working/being on my phone. I hope in a weird way I'll be able to appreciate this in the future.

@Thankgoditsover

My mother has no professional background with EDs at all. I will forever be grateful to her for all that she did... She read some books but found that some were more helpful than others. She is naturally an incredibly kind and caring person. When we have spoken about it she says how she could see that I was slipping away from her and just felt instinctively that I needed love and patience if I was going to be able to fight it. I had various 'treatments' - one said it was 'bad behaviour' (yes anorexia can be seen as bad behaviour but I wasn't being 'badly behaved' in the typical sense) and she found that very difficult (and didn't belief it). She also said that she learnt very quickly to compartmentalise 'me' and 'the voice of AN' which helped a lot. She held onto the moments when my humour came out or we shared a joke etc. If possible, try to encourage these moments - perhaps things that you used to share together that might bring out a little sparkle in your DD's eyes. Creative things are very good at that - I remember when we did some crafting and my mum's attempt looked like something very rude... we ended up it fits of giggles.

What you said to your friend is true - in the future, you two will have the most amazing bond because you have helped her fight this. I found having cuddles really helped as well. Your presence will really help your DD not feel so overwhelmed by anorexia. It is awful and incredibly isolating - the anorexic voice will want her to be alone, but if she allows herself to spend time with you, feeling safe and warm, she will enjoy it (but probably feel guilty for feeling a little happy). Be prepared for snappy remarks if that happens - she won't mean it at all.

We have quite a cold weekend coming up - it could be the perfect time to focus on being cosy... I would stress that it is important to be busy as a distraction. Whether that is reading, crafting, jigsaws etc. If she finds it difficult to relax, remember to reinforce the 'I love you and want you to feel safe/loved' (safe and loved really resonated with me). Or something like 'the best thing about this lockdown is that I have the opportunity to spend more time with you. I know that you are struggling with your ED, but I am so proud of the clever, funny, kind DD you are growing up to be.'

This is also very good to read - and perhaps share with your DD www.orri-uk.com/blog/

@Lottsbiffandsmudge
I know that it is easier for me to write all this advice in hindsight - in reality it is very difficult to find a calm moment to do this. Plus, in reality, mealtimes are so intense and distressing. You really are all doing such incredible jobs and everything you have written will really help your DD - even if doesn't feel like it. The constant repetition will continue to give her strength. I have just included this link in another post www.orri-uk.com/blog/ I would recommend reading through it and seeing if there is any more than can help you both.

One more thing I keep forgetting to add - if your DDs struggle with not doing ANY movement, gentle yoga stretches can really help. This might be of interest themindedinstitute.com/yoga-for-eating-disorders/

You can find free videos on YouTube (although make sure you watch them first to make sure that they are suitable).

Lovely posts havehope and agree with the others your mum sounds amazing! I'm trying really hard to stay calm and compassionate in the face of this awful illness but bloody hell it's hard sometimes. And I know I've probably been guilty of walking the path of least resistance recently as well 😕 which doesn't work in the long term.

I had my meeting with the dietician this morning, it was really good and she's come up with a meal plan I'm happy with. The plan is to present it to dd next week and back each other up when telling dd this is absolutely what she has to eat.

Last day at work today for a bit....

God awful day today ☹️ morning wasn't too bad but it all went to shit big time at lunch. Dd took one look at her tuna sandwich and declared it looked gross, there was way too much butter on it and she was not going to eat it.

I stood firm but she was having none of it, eventually I said I'd make her another sandwich which I did with slightly less butter on. She ate about half of it, then started kicking off about the rest of her lunch (small bag of crisps, small yogurt and small glass of orange juice.)

It escalated to her punching herself, chucking the crisps around the room and head banging.

Eventually I took the food away and said fine but you won't be going out on the dog walk as you've not eaten enough. I rang my mum to come over to walk the dog which she did. At this point dd went apocalyptic, screaming I will eat it and then took the yogurt out the fridge but squirted it everywhere rather than ate it.

I told my mum to go, dd was hysterical and unfortunately somehow managed to get passed me and out the front door. She had no shoes on and no coat ☹️

I ran round looking for her trying to decide whether to call the police, she had found a small woodland area behind our house and climbed a tree!! Ffs.

Spent another hour out there trying to convince her to come in whilst she shouted abuse at me.

Eventually she came back and refused to speak for another hour or so, then seemed to calm down and came downstairs to play a board game with us!!

This illness is so bloody nuts, my heart breaks for dd who must think she is going mad.

@Girliefriendlikespuppies so sorry to hear you have had an awful day... it is very weird to live with.
My morning was pretty crap but the day has got better. DD is doing litter picking for an hour a week for her DofE and I have been letting her go alone but in line with my no exercise alone tactic I went with her today. Which pissed her off no end. But as I thought it was not a litter pick really but a route march. I was knackered by the end.
She had a meltdown when we got home as she hadn’t ‘done enough’ as I had ‘slowed her down’ even though she was a good q0 meters ahead of me all the time.
She refused snack and in the end it was an hour late when she finally ate it after threatening to withdraw her football session in the afternoon.
I had a friend popping over for a walk and she was sat in her car outside the house waiting for me to calm her. Then DH decided to try to ‘help’ which set her off again.
Anyway she finally calmed down and stopped pacing the garden and then when she realised I was going out was again distraught. In the end I just had to leave.
I haven’t seen any one except my DH and kids and my mum since early Dec and I needed to see my mate!
The rest of the day has been absolutely fine and she has eaten and I even heard her singing earlier.
She can flip between the two states almost instantly. So I get what you mean!

That's two rubbish days!

DD1 was meant to go to stage 2 eating plan yesterday, but didn't do well with lunch, only eating a ¼ of it. They decided that she needed a Fortisip top up of 60 ml. DD1 said they're gross and far too sweet, so they agreed to water it down (but she still had to have 60ml Fortisip with the water). She kicked off, yelling and screaming. It took until 14:10 for her to drink it.

Today, we were meant to have a bit of time at home, but the doctor said that DD1 hadn't met the conditions (few days stable obs, bloods and intake) so couldn't go today, but might tomorrow. DD1 was shouting that she didn't care about their stupid eating plan, and if the doctor wasn't going to let her go home, she just wouldn't drink her stupid fluids.

Later she had a change of heart and decided that if eating gets her home she'd eat everything, so felt ill. Then the nurse said she really should be drinking lots, so DD1 has downed 2 x 750ml jugs of water/squash in about 3 hours. She's just so extreme with everything.

She's put on weight. 38.26kg today, up from 38.1kg yesterday and 37.3kg on Monday.

She's still on stage 1 (1000 Cal) but might move to stage 2 (1500 Cal) tomorrow. She has to be on stage 3 (2000 Cal) to get home.

@Lougle that also sounds v tough. Good news about the weight tho.
Putting DD to bed and she admits to doing core exercises whilst I was in the bath for 30 mins. DH was in charge and left her doing her ‘stretching’ to call his mum. I am so pissed off with him. He has to look after her for 30 mins and can’t stick to it. The only time I let her out of my sight on weekdays is when I have a shower or go to the loo. I thought on a Sat he could cope with her for half an hour.
I have gone to bed as I am so knackered from being route marched for an hour this morning, walking with my friend and cleaning all afternoon. Usually I can’t get her to sleep until about 10 so this is a good night!

That's great re the weight gain Lougle it does sound like anorexia now it's being threatened. I'm glad the Drs are being firm with her, how are you coping? Are you staying at the hospital with her?

Hope Scribbly is getting on okay as well?

Lots are you sure we haven't got the same dd?! 😉
I also had a bath last night, cried a lot and prayed even though I'm not particularly religious. Dd came upstairs afterwards and we watched some tiktok videos together, her therapist said to make tiktok something we do together so I can keep an eye on what videos come up...

At what point did everyone tell their dds they have anorexia? I've never actually called it that in front of dd, I'm not even sure she has that diagnosis tbh as Camhs have never said it either.

In my mind it is obviously anorexia with the acute fear of weight gain, irrational need to restrict food and over exercise plus intrusive thoughts and extreme behaviours.

I think I'm scared to call it that in front of dd incase she then reads up on it and decides she should be restricting more than she already is 😕

I'm not sure how things are going tbh. She's eating to plan. She's not having the typical Anorexia thoughts - she has no appreciation of calories, what they are or which foods have more or less. She has no concept of exercise as a burner. But she is having 'bad thoughts' and she is feeling angry. She is saying that she doesn't know why we care because she doesn't and she just wants to die. But then I don't know that she really understands the permanence of death.

To give an indication of her emotional maturity, she's been watching Justin's House and Go Jetters in hospital. So 4-6 years old age range.

She's so tricky because she takes everything literally and will do anything to get what she wants, so is being a dream patient, except when they gave breakfast late then still wanted her to eat her snack on time (I don't care about your fing plan, I'm stuffed).

Lougle, it must be so hard because I suspect there are very medical professionals who are expert in both LDs and EDs. They'll used to mostly teenagers and the way that they, typically, think.

Girlie the therapist we saw last week spoke to me alone to say that they were giving her diagnosis of anorexia, then got DD back in and told her the same. DD was really shocked, I was a bit, well what did you think got you here to the eating disorders clinic? She insists she had 'issues around eating' rather than anorexia. I think because she never stopped eating entirely, always I think had probably 1500 calories though who knows, she thinks that means she can't be anorexic.

I don't know if knowing her diagnosis helped or not.

Hello everyone,

Lougle - sorry that after a good start things have gone a bit pear shaped in hospital for you. Hope tomorrow sees you back on track. 500calorie increases per day seems tough to me - for our re-feeding programme experience it has been 300 per day and that was tough..

Lots - am feeling for you and the core exercising. Again, great that your DD told you but your DH needs to step up - is he in denial or not wanting to be 'the bad guy' or not as alert to potential sneakiness of the illness?

girlie - OMG running away would have floored me or I'd be on the gin immediately Re your question about telling DD her diagnosis - we did this quite early on in the process. But DD won't say the words out loud. Anorexia is shortened to "the a" and eating disorder was shortened to "the eating" but has now become "the eating dis" and as from tomorrow she is committed to saying it fully (it is part of our family therapy homework).

We've had a tough few days - real increase in self harming - in addition to the head banging, the scratching, she's taken to punching herself in the face. She's now got a stock line that she needs to bleed before she can eat. Her poor body image has really ratcheted up - she's doing a lot of body checking and is in tears because she can "feel her fat folding over".

We had IHT today and basically said we're at our wits end. What DD needs is an intensive intervention but thats not possible. Whilst we're managing to stick to 1800 per day it is at huge cost to DD (and us). Plus meal times have lengthened so we're back to the whole day being about eating.

We've had some other homework to do - 3 x per day we have to do a chat about positive food memories and independence (doesn't have to be food related) - the idea is obviously to try to remind DD that she can go back to a different relationship with food. The problem is that we're making up our own exercises so I worry we could be doing more harm.

Our first food exercise was writing down 10 types of food (pasta, Chinese, chicken etc) and we each had to write 3 words next to it and then a place/time we associate with the food. DD's words were as expected more negative than ours (although she did have positive words too).

To counter that, the next exercise was to think about a happy food experience and write about it, reflect on what it felt like etc - that was interesting as a theme that came out was us being spontaneous as a family, sharing food, trying something new.

The most recent one was about independence -we each had to talk about a moment when DD exerted independence - how we felt about it, what was achieved etc

The trick I think is how we link into where we are now - so for spontaneity we compared to the lack of spontaneity we currently have and discussed the future possibility of DD asking for something off plan or outside of meal times, the independence was really interesting because DD identified walking alone as being something she enjoyed doing - but is not able to do now. We talked about how we could build that into a motivation and stressed that the energy (literal in calorie sense but also emotional) that would need to go in to achieving this would be massively outweighed by the joy she'd feel when she got to go on her solo walk.

I've googled but not found worksheets on food memories/independence for anorexics so wise thread friends if you have an idea please do share!!

Finally (apologies for post length) DD is really keen to get a dog. We have two cats (were three but one died in the summer - was a partial trigger for this episode). From her point of view I do think it would be helpful - a therapy dog, some motivation etc. However, to do that we'd need to be assured she could regulate emotions and cut out the rage as it wouldn't be fair to bring a dog into that situation (the cats seem used to it and just run away when it kicks off). But we're asking her to prove a hypothetical which she can't do. For those of you with dogs - do you think on balance it helps your DC at all? am also aware that DD will be off to Uni in two years after retaking all of sixth form so the bulk of dog-care will be on DH and I, and I'm a bit scared of dogs

@Valleyofthedollymix my DD never stopped eating and was restricting to 1500 cals a day and we have had a anorexia with compulsive exercise diagnosis. She was resistant to it to start with but has come round to it. Interestingly @myrtleWilson my DD doesn’t say it out loud either. I am not sure she is yet admitting it to herself either. I call it anorexia or the imposter. She gets quite annoyed sometimes if I try to externalise it from her as she says it is ‘her brain’ but she is accepting her kidnapping/ terrorist/ imposter message more and more.
And yes I think my DH would rather avoid conflict. And he has not fully understood the sneakiness of the illness. So it’s really down to me....
Sorry to hear about.the increase in self harming. Could you use a dog as an incentive for eating etc. Our dietician suggested a grown up reward chart split into half hour slots so DD could earn ticks to save up for a reward. Once DD heard that the reward could not be exercise based she want bothered about the idea tho....
We don’t have a dog and my DS2 is desperate for one and it has crossed my mind that it might help,DD. I am not a dog person though... he should have taken his GCSEs this summer and so will have a long break and could possibly manage a puppy this summer. I think I will see how DD goes though as I cannot imagine dealing with another commitment right now....

My DD would earn ticks for not exercising....but I guess it could be sued for eating? It somehow seems a bit ‘babyish’ but I’d try anything right now!

DD1 went for a home visit today, and the dog rushing up to her was a huge boost to her self-esteem, but I'm not sure that's a convincing reason to get one.

Rabbits really motivate one of my DDs. They need a fair bit of space, but we have them in a fairly small (7'×5') shed and have a run attached with tunnels, so they can go in and out as they please. Then we've set up some cheap weather proof cameras that we can view from our phones.

Personally I wouldn't get a dog unless your dd is fully recovered myrtle but I would use it as an incentive to recover. A problem we have now with the dog is exercising him, I think without him it might be easier to restrict how much exercise dd does...

That said I have no regrets getting the dog he's a lovely boy and as much a therapy dog for me as for dd!!

Another tricky day, dd has eaten slightly better but her mood is low 😕 talked about wanting to die, doesn't want to get older, there's no point to anything...

I've also bought the wrong sodding porridge oats which is making the fact I top up her sachet of oats problematic 😫

A pic of our boy for you to enjoy!!

Morning all,

We have had a better week this week. DD seems a little calmer when eating and I am trying to ‘grey rock’ when she is eating and struggling to get something down. She has also commented a few times about foods she ‘wished she could eat‘ and I have just been quite non-commital rather than engaging. It has meant fewer rows and less snark. I’m wound like a bobbin, but I’ve realised she wants me to react so she can then make it my fault she’s not eating.

The Psych told DD her diagnosis, and I have spoken about it. It was a shock at first but I haven’t stopped. I also told the school and let DD know I had. That upset her the most, but as I work in safeguarding it needed to be an ‘open secret’ as such so as not be compromise me. DD understood that and accepted it as much as she hated it.

I’m not sure where I stand on the dog thing. We have one and DD adores her, but the dog is def suffering with how volatile the house is, the dogs anxiety is through the roof (she has always been anxious) but it does temper DD a bit when she is in meltdown because she can see how the dog reacts.

DD still doesn’t get that she is ill. She’s making going back to school all about me and if I let her rather than the Anorexia. I think I was quite cruel yesterday when she was talking about her body looking normal/fatter and how peers wouldn’t notice when she went back... she’s nowhere near normal and they really would notice, so I told her. She was very quiet for a couple of hours. I felt horrible but she’ll feel worse if they take the piss.

I absolutely wouldn't get a dog while you're having to manage an eating disorder. Dogs are massive time saps and need lots of attention in a not dissimilar way to children with eating disorders. Plus not all of them are therapeutic. We had one that was so challenging that the stress levels in the house were stratospheric.

We now have the most gorgeous fluffy rescue who is very chilled and doesn't mind being constantly petted and cuddled. However, I recently consulted a behaviourist to get him to sleep somewhere other than our bed and to be less clingy. I've not managed to put in place any of the training she suggested because I'm so taken up with the whole feeding and managing of DD.

However dog of @Girliefriendlikespuppies is particularly lovely...

Really sorry about the self harm @myrtleWilson, I can't imagine how distressing that must be.

DD seems to have lost 500g (having put 800g on the previous week). I don't know why. I suppose progress is jagged. Good zoom with the therapist and nurse this morning, where they told her that in normal non-pandemic circumstances her low body weight would put her in hospital.

Yes agreed re dogs being time zappers, they need tons of attention. My lovely dog still wakes me up at 4am most nights as he needs a wee/poo despite having long walks etc.

We're just back from the dentist, still no extraction (dd needs two teeth out as part of her orthodontic work but has a massive needle phobia) but dd did let him put the needle in her gum for about 10secs this time!!

Dds 15th bday tomorrow 😕

thanks all - DH and I know that a dog won't work for us but it is so hard when DD thinks it will. I think I'm just so desperate for a sign that there is a way out of this hellscape that I'm grasping at straws..