Partner has taken kids away and blocked contact

[JustDad46]

Hi,

Wife has been under a lot of outside strain for a few months and has been acting out of character - quite emotionally abusive and neglecting kids etc. Neither myself or the kids could talk to her without her blowing up. We actually lived avoiding her with the kids sharing their concerns with me constantly.

Eleven days ago she demanded a divorce, became surrounded by friends and family who never liked me and had blanked me for years, then phoned the police and concocted a story which, when a court looks at it will be so transparently untrue it will be crazy. She tried to take out Non-Mol and Residency Orders which the judge immediately set aside.

But it's still very hurtful to be accused groundlessly. And have friends all hypothesizing that she's cheating because she had everything in place so quickly.

But the ABSOLUTE WORST part is that I haven't seen my kids or spoken to them in ELEVEN days. It's tearing me up and she knows it will be. She took them away and I don't know where any of them are. My children's last texts show that they wanted to be with me, love me etc.

I'm not sure if this is in the right thread. i'm just very emotionally and physically exhausted and exasperated that despite everyone telling me how wrong it all is, how everyone looking at the evidence tells me I'm right, social workers are taking forever to assign a case worker, police are doing absolutely nothing an passing the buck to social workers and my solicitors DESPITE there being welfare risks to my two kids from a third party and neglect and emotional abuse history from my wife. My solicitors aren't finding HER solicitors very co-operative (my wife started the solicitor involvement).

Every crisis helpline and charity has supported me 100% but they are powerless. What shocks me is how common they say all this is.

Tonight, I'm grieving for my children. It's absolutely like a bereavement. I don't know where they are, if they are safe and no-one who could and should do something seems to give a damn :-(

NO orders against me nor grounds for any. I have parental responsibility and am actually the one who listened to and looked after the kids but i am the one being deprived of them.... At wit's end.

There are quite a number of these "the OP must be lying" type posts here.

Here is an example. There currently is "evidence" in the form of complaints to the police, now it will take time (this sounds like it is a couple of weeks in so lots of confusion). Even if police complaints are false and just wasting police time the report is all the court really will have time to look at for any temporary measure. In the long run presumably the police and courts are going to get annoyed with being lied too and communicate this to anyone involved but in teh early stages if one is claiming physical risk and one is not the court is going to act with caution.

Ultimately the correct process is that her solicitor should be warned about any false claims made in court (they are responsible for ensuring the court is not misled) but this doesn't really happen in practice.

Interesting to see so many people jumping on normal things that will exist early in a case as evidence of the OP being wrong in some way. I just hope none of these people have jobs where they are required to objectively judge situations...

I am so so sorry to hear about what's happened to you. It's despicable.

My ex moved my DD from Scotland to England and vanished in a puff of smoke, back in May 2016 when DD was 3. It was a reaction to my daughter meeting my new partner, as we'd discussed at length and agreed. I tried the police, social services, two custody lawyers, and unless I could find their address there was nothing in law to protect my relationship with DD.

It's now been 7.5 years and it's like grieving someone who's still alive and you never get closure from it. You just find a way to keep living.

My advice to you is:

• Look after your MH because it is a dark, awful thing to go through.

• Explore all options to trace them within 6 months. After then, wherever they are is their established residence and your legal options weaken dramatically (from a low base as is).

• In the unthinkable event this becomes a long-tsrm situation, write to your kids. I write to DD every week and scan the letter to an email address I set up so she will see the time stamps. The letters are in several boxes. Your kids will want to know you never stopped thinking about them or loving them.

• If you can, embrace CMS. My now-wife resents that my ex claims CMS while essentially kidnapping and hiding my DD but from my perspective it's my only opportunity to look after and support DD in the meantime. Pay extra, if you can.

• Put what you'd spend on birthday, Christmas, etc into a savings account for them.

• Don't give up.

I really feel for you. Stay strong.

@JustDad46 you said

That's a horrible proposition but obviously their wishes will have to be respected. Their last texts before their phone was blocked/taken from them show they were very much wanting to see me

Im confused how you could know that your children’s phones were blocked or taken from them . Do you have some sort of tracker on their phones so you can see where they are ? How do you know you are blocked and who put the block on ? Most kids of that age know how to work a mobile phone better than any adult.

How can you know if your children have just decided that they don’t want to hear from you right now ? If they are 15 and 11 they will have their own opinions about what they want to happen.

I do think it’s unlikely that children of 15 and 11 who wanted to contact their father would not just do so. I’m assuming that they are still in Ireland somewhere and not locked up so they can’t get out .

They could just get on a bus to see you or walk into any police station and ask them to contact you. Especially as you are ex police and, as you have told us, have lots of contacts in high places.

I also don’t understand why you have told us that you got awards at work and pay the mortgage . Has your wife accused you of getting into debt or not doing well in your job ? Are these factors related to the breakdown of your marriage ?

Im trying to understand the situation you are describing .

MumsNet is not the forum to get a fair hearing! There's a lot of helpful people on here but there are also a lot of people with personal axes to grind posting detritus based on a lack of knowledge of the facts and their own personal grievances. The best thing to do is ignore them.

Feel for you. I really hope your daughter seeks to find you when she is old enough to vote with her feet.

Op - you do know you can physically go down to the court, pay the fee and request an emergency hearing? I've seen people do this when I have been at court.

What the judge has imposed on you sounds like a prohibited steps order preventing removal. I am just not sure why it's been imposed if there is little evidence to suggest you being a risk or threat to your children? I know you said there was some police involvement?

Also - you do know that now there is an order for contact if she doesn't make the children available then she will be in breach of the order.

I presume she wasn't at the hearing?

I think you may have to come to the conclusion that it's likely gone past the point of rectify this issue with your wife amicably. If that was possible it would have been on the table, yet she continues to march on and lay down more. I understand it's a sudden change, same with mine and I thought in similar ways but her actions are telling you. You need to be strong because if you don't you will get walked over.

As for those court orders I would guess that they are so you cannot remove them from their school, as in take them out completely. You may not do this and think it's bonkers but bear in mind you don't know what she is saying about you. She could be working the courts to discredit you, much in the way some use NMO or police so you look worse.

Those avenues are there for when it's warranted, NMO and PSO to keep abusers at bay and protect themselves and the children. However, it can if given the chance be used against innocent parties so the courts look at you worse. They would obviously need intent or evidence to achieve that so be careful of your actions.

Going for contact the only thing I can say from my painful journey at the moment is that I was advised not to do an emergency hearing. If you do an emergency hearing it's rushed and there is less weight or investigation for example, Cafcass. I'm not sure what it would be over there, if it's the same but Cafcass look into the welfare of the children, speak to you both, make a report and advise the courts and as far as I know hold more weight than social services, court wise.

Keep strong but also keep your head down and bide your time, everything so far for me has been smoke and mirrors, strategic plays by her and her solicitors who seem to be purposely frustrating and obstructing contact.

I would strongly advise @Catsafterme and @JustDad46 to insist for a factfinding hearing. The facts will then be established within your case. If there is zero risk or nothing to substantiate claims of abuse, it will be substantiated as fact.

@Whattodo112222 Thanks, Yes my case is commencing shortly. I am further down the line, it's been six months refused all contact but I went for CAO rather than emergency hearing.

I haven't done anything but been deemed as dangerous as a criminal who's been in prison and have been treated as such, all on her say. No police, no arrest, no record or court orders just legal threats keeping me away.

I am shocked to be honest - I really am.
My violent ex punched me in front of our daughter, strangled and spat on me, he abused our daughter (who was only a baby at the time) by choking and strangling her because he thought her refusing to be fed by him was an act of insolence. It was terrifying - ALL of these facts were established in court (as well as findings against me) - but yet still HE has maintained supervised contact the ENTIRE time we've had proceedings.
We're about to undergo a psychological evaluation and then the CAFCASS Guardian will make her recommendations based on that, however I am despondent because she absolutely has fallen for all of his tears and lies and talks to me with such contempt (despite the findings against him).
It fills me with terror to think he could have unsupervised access in the future - particularly as you and @JustDad46 have been refused ALL contact on the basis of lies and no risk at all.
I just don't get it AT ALL.

I do think it’s unlikely that children of 15 and 11 who wanted to contact their father would not just do so. I’m assuming that they are still in Ireland somewhere and not locked up so they can’t get out .

At least the 15 year old would be able to get in touch, surely?

@Whattodo112222 Mine was abusive and is doing everything and abuser would do, I'm in a role reversal situation, basically.

It's disgusting, I did everything a father should I was a SAHD and raised them from new borns, while being abused. Cut everyone off not just me, everyone. They are isolated and have been for six months, nobody knows how they are.

So women like you actually trying to escape abusive men are likely being hindered by women like mine who are compulsively lying and the end goal is to get the house and the children. Already taken everything we own right off the bat, money, house and then when I didn't walk away like I was expected, bang abuse and victim card.

Wasting everyone's time, abuse support lines, solicitors on legal aid, draining me financially by dangling the children on a stick. I'm so dangerous I was eventually offered contact centre like a criminal, before court (?!) But that's since been rescinded because it was never on the table.

Smoke and mirrors, delaying tactics. It's abhorrent.

@Catsafterme can I ask, what did your CAFCASS safeguarding letter say about you? was there any basis within that letter that substantiated no interim contact?
Why was no interim contact ordered? what was the basis of that?

@Whattodo112222 I'm not there yet not had Cafcass call or first hearing but it's coming up. Basically this no contact has been set by my wife, nobody else.

Thanks for your kind words. When I read your story I actually cried for you (and for me too). It's absolutely horrible. And so sudden and out of the blue. I can't even imagine what my kids are going through mentally right now. To even try would completely break me.

Sending you lots of love and compassion...

I'm putting that in the pre-judged category. i don't have the energy for any more negativity right now. i have enough grief from missing my kids.

I don't believe my kids are free or would actually think to go to a police station as you suggest. It's quite unkind of you to suggest they don't want to know me when you don't know them, me or our relationship or the potential control being exerted by their mum.

CAFCASS will change that if there is no reason for her to be withholding contact. It is usual interim contact is granted in these cases.
Will she turn up to court do you think?

Hopefully, I mean she has lied a fair amount already and as far as I can work out intending on speaking to Cafcass so will lie more no doubt. Have no idea whether that is the case or just solicitors talking nonsense, we're not sure if has full legal aid at this point.

Everything else has been ignored, all communication even though requested through solicitors has been months apart and just diversion tactics if we do get a reply.

I went from SAHD to being controlled and not allowed to see them, to seeing them a few times and then on my own. In space of ten days I became dangerous and not seen them since. Won't let me talk to them, nothing. Ignored all attempts at re-establishing contact, then offered supervised through solicitors as I'm too dangerous and then ignored our acceptance for four months and then rescinded.

Seems to be lying to own solicitors, they are treating it as if I have been charged and been in prison. As to whether she will turn up, not sure...

My solicitor is flabbergasted and also disgusted by her and solicitors, apparently this is not the way things are done.

Thank you.

By not answering any of my polite, factual questions about your children you have inadvertently given me more insight into your situation.

I see you are only happy to engage with posters who agree that you are the victim here , despite lots of clues to the contrary.

I didn’t say your children “ didn’t want to know you “ , I asked how you knew that the decision to not contact you right now was not their own.

And you don’t seem able to answer the questions about your work awards and the mortgage, which are points that you raised yourself.

If you think that asking for clarification of facts that you have raised is “negative “, you are going to struggle with the legal process.

“ My kids haven’t texted me therefore my wife must have removed their phones and they must be locked up “ is pure conjecture, as far as I can see.

You don’t seem able to even consider things from your children’s point of view and that they might feel differently from you.

And surely any 15 year old whose parent is a police officer would know that they could go to the police for help ? Unless they were in fact scared of that parent and scared that the police would not protect them.

You're almost completely wrong on every point there. I can understand the negativity in the court room but what's the point in going through it with you?

Of course I can answer the questions you raise, but why would I when you seem to have already jumped to conclusions anyhow?

You don't know me, my kids or their mum. You make assertions about trackers without considering the other possibilities such as being told by social workers that numbers have been changed by mum etc.

How awful. Keep doing a Google Image search of your ex's photograph. Also use TinEye and other Reverse Image Search pages. She'll pop up on some website eventually. Pm me if you like

Thank you for being so kind.

@D0RA You're not being polite. You've made up your mind despite having no grasp of the facts and based on prejudices that through a process of elimination seem to solely be due to the OP's gender. Then you have gotten angry when he had the audacity to disagree with you.

Your arrogance is breathtaking.

Interesting that you can pick up ideas on Mumsnet how to track women who have left their husbands.

It might surprise you to know that if you wish to take another person to court and you don't know where they live, you first have to show that you have made reasonable endeavours to find them before the court will let you proceed with their whereabouts unknown. This suggestion is actually quite legitimate and the only thing that would change that is what the tracker intends to do with the information.

I'm not sure it's a very useful suggestion though. People who abduct children and abscond are unlikely to put photos of themselves online. It's better to hire a professional for this kind of work, one who knows what is legal and what is not.

Besides which, this site is full of advice about how to track people, normally for maintenance claims. You just have to change the gender.