Referendum!

[springbrigid]

Anyone inclined to give an opinion? I am leaning towards a yes/no vote, the yes to remove what I see as sexist language in the constitution, the no because the government are so appalling in terms of providing services and rights to disabled citizens and I feel the clause is paternalistic and pushes care on families yet again

I have to jump off, I have work screaming at me before I head into a meeting.

Younger politicians and commentators who underestimate the importance of property rights and settlements forget how very poor Ireland was and how close those memories are. Both my parents experienced extreme poverty in their early childhood, and there's a memory of that experience in older people and in people in long-established communities, whether rural or urban. Proposed legislation that doesn't show respect for the hard questions around that is always going to be red-flagged.

@Abhannmor Roderic O Gorman wasn't even to answer the very simple question of What is a Woman? when asked!
What a waste of money for his parents sending him to private school when he can't answer a simple question!

Who the hell do you think you are telling me when I can comment on a thread I started?!

has done wonders for the No campaign 😂😂😂Gript have never done wonders for any campaign, they’ve been on the losing side of everything they’ve ever backed!!!

And it’s ‘imbecile’, not ‘imbicile’. Maybe you need to research how to spell and count before launching such unhinged tirades

This is the last time I'm engaging with you @springbrigid .

I politely asked you to refrain from mentioning me or referring to me in this thread NOT that you could not post in said thread.

Again this proves you have very poor comprehension skills, try reading a wider & broader range of materials, it develops comprehension & broadens the mind .

Read my post & refrain from mentioning me or trying to engage with me again.

https://gript.ie/suddenly-a-brutal-poll-for-team-yes/?fbclid=IwAR0FcLwR-lIxEtiODD1T4JGetJ45mP9dSnCXXNjoJrm4nKEmAeIEuizfssI

Looking good for Friday!

NO NO for the win!

Politely?
Go work on your critical thinking skills, broaden your horizons & expand your reading material before you attempt to mention me or reply to me on here again.

https://gript.ie/the-electoral-commissions-disgraceful-research-advisory-board/?fbclid=IwAR0Y5XEnbFMdDH_9mkWxvfi4uCh_US_skIU5y-nwGt0Q-0OXz-7jH0yEr5M

Another very interesting article here regarding Electoral Commission bias.

Voting NO NO.

Well that escalated quickly....

Anyway - quite a few people I know will be voting on Friday who previously said they weren't bothered. I'm happy people are making an effort, no matter what the outcome I think it's important for people to have their say.

@MagnificentHats yes same in my circles, the majority are voting. Exactly it's important to get out & let every vote count.

It’s unusual that this weekend the polls were showing so many undecideds, usually people become more decisive the closer the vote is. I think a lot of #YesNo disability activists and carers - despite not having anything like the platforms of the yes-yes and no-no voters - are making a difference and they’re starting to get at least a little airtime, as with this debate on RTÉ yesterday https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22363399/

So 'polite' that mumsnet had to delete it due to you engaging in personal abuse and trying to silence me.

This is one of the main concerns I have and I feel it is a valid reason to vote no.
Why no transparency or very little debate with this?
Why is this referendum being pushed through when we don't know the implications?
Why vote yes if there are possible legal repercussions down the line?

@jonnytightlips yes it's a major red flag. It has seemed to turn many undecided to a No vote as O Gorman has & is still refusing to release the minutes.
Michael McDowell has been very vocal about the significance of O Gorman's failure to disclose the minutes. There is obviously plenty in there that they do not wish the public to know.

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/social-affairs/2024/02/29/lawyers-group-urge-no-vote-in-family-and-care-referendums/

This Lawyers group voting No says it all.
I would trust Michael McDowell & this group of lawyers anyday over our courrupt government who are refusing to share the minutes of the referendum meeting with the Irish electorate. Why the secrecy about the repercussions of a yes vote? What are they hiding?

VOTE NO NO.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/lawyers-for-no-group-label-referendum-proposal-as-unclear-and-toothless-1595306.html

International Women's Day on Friday, Mothers day on Sunday.. 🎉
Hope all us women & mothers can celebrate our survival in the constitution on Sunday & make it an extra significant mothers day 🍾🥂 #VOTE NO NO

IMO the information has been really poor. Really really poor. Leafleting very late, not a huge amount of discussion considering it relates to constitutional changes. It's no wonder people are unsure.

Yes, I agree, I think this is the reason for the many undecideds. They aren't sure what this referendum will actually do.

I won't be voting as I'm housebound but I'm unsure as to how I'd be voting if I was able tbh. My daughter is having to do a school project on it and I honestly feel like I won't be able to speak to her about it with any 'authority', it'm not clear on my own feelings at all.

There seems to have been very selective messaging about it, and a lot of woolly language. The RTE debates have tended to present the vote as a binary No v Yes, conservative v progressive whereas there’s been a big upsurge in the past few days of people saying they’ll Yes-No who were previously Yes-Yes. There’s been a huge number of personal stories on twitter about the lack of state provision for carers and people with disabilities and I think that may have made a significant difference.

Someone shared some resources on twitter that might be helpful for you and your daughter - they're mainly links to twitter threads
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wfMoYYs8rNFkNGI_33oDe2u_YPuYBtoO2BPyTZzK2ME/edit?pli=1
A lot of people found this analysis by the free legal aid centres helpful
https://www.flac.ie/news/2024/02/19/flac-legal-and-human-rights-analysis-of-the-propos/

@springbrigid thanks!

No problem - one of my children are voting for the first time ever on Friday and we’ve been trying to direct him to useful sources. I wish that the substance of the second vote was a bit clearer, and the confusion doesn’t put him off exercising his democratic right in future!