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17,731 total deaths from Covid in the UK with no other underlying health issues

135 replies

CUniverse · 15/01/2022 10:57

ONS released this data mid December.

Does it make any difference to how you feel about the way the pandemic was handled? Does it detract from the fears you have about Covid yourself?

Is it even worth knowing these figures?

www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathsfromcovid19withnootherunderlyingcauses?s=08

OP posts:
Aconight · 15/01/2022 15:42

Agree with you lljkk. And with the median age of death from Covid 19 being 83, older than average life expectancy, it is hardly surprising to see a large number of deaths from a respiratory illness, just as we have done forever.

I'll go one step further and say that every death of someone that is beyond average life expectancy is not tragic. What is tragic is all the factors you listed in your second paragraph along with every single person that dies alone simply because of barbaric rules that our leaders imposed on us but didn't follow themselves.

Aconight · 15/01/2022 15:43

Not a running total @kittensinthekitchen only annual figures.

PartyOnKale · 15/01/2022 15:43

@Quartz2208

What stood out for me in these

2020: 9400 (0-64: 1549 / 65 and over: 7851)

2021 Q1: 6483 (0-64: 1560/ 65 and over: 4923)

2021 Q2: 346 (0-64: 153/ 65 and over: 193)

2021 Q3: 1142 (0-64: 512/ 65 and over: 630)

Is the stark difference between prevaccines (which is 2020 and 2021 Q1) and post. Vaccination clearly works at preventing serious illness and death.

Then the difference between Q2 (low numbers) and Q3 rise of Delta - but still how much less that is than at the Q1 peak of Alpha. And the ratio between the 0-64 is actually the same as 65+ since vaccinations occured.

So vaccines work and continue to work.

That the higher prevalence of COVID in society the higher these numbers will be.

We dont however know the impact of boosters or Omicron

Now those numbers do tell a story: pre and post vaccine.
Aconight · 15/01/2022 15:43

You missed my point entirely,

Likkleredridinghood · 15/01/2022 16:16

@Aconight Did you experience the pandemic at its worst on an ICU ? I think your views are influenced by experiencing it at a distance. That's why you can spout so blithely about it.

Blubells · 15/01/2022 16:52

There are a lot of people out there who would be considered ‘unhealthy’, often for no fault of their own. Autoimmune conditions such as type 1 diabetes cannot be prevented. There are a lot of people out there with type 1 who can expect to live a long and productive life. The majority of people who are classed as obese will also love long and productive lives. If we start to say that it’s OK for these people to die, to somehow make ourselves feel better about covid deaths, to make it something that happens to others, where does it stop?

I think the question has to be 1) what are the costs (from restrictions/enforced isolation) to society compared to 2) the benefits (how many lives are saved by the measures)?

alreadytaken · 15/01/2022 17:32

No, doesnt make any difference to how I feel about it. Still pissed off at the idea that the deaths of those with diabetes, or asthma, or high blood pressure of any other condition they would have lived with for years is somehow different.

cptartapp · 15/01/2022 17:42

I'm very dubious about the 'no underlying conditions' business. As a nurse that does random health checks it is amazing how many many people have high BP, cholesterol or are diabetic/pre diabetic etc without knowing. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands. Even gum disease is a chronic inflammatory condition and linked with heart disease.

Summerofcontent · 15/01/2022 17:46

The issue with 'underlying health conditions' is that it doesn't account for life expectancy had that person not contracted covid. Is a 35 year old with diabetes an acceptable death because they had an underlying health condition? A 45 year old with asthma? A 70 year old with stable angina who was otherwise fit and active? Underlying health conditions doesn't mean that death was imminent. People aren't expendable because they aren't in perfect health.

AlexaShutUp · 15/01/2022 17:48

It makes no difference to me. The lives of people with underlying health conditions are no less valuable.

mrsanflowerpot · 15/01/2022 17:53

My DS(8) has underlying health conditions, he's actually CEV. He's also in Y3, plays football three times a week, goes to sports hall athletics weekly, is bright, fun, naughty (!), loved. He lives an absolutely full and active life. He has been shielded since March 2020 (including from my DH for months on end who is frontline NHS). He got a positive COVID test result on 02/01, we have been in hospital for a week now including resus and HDU. I think (hope!) we are coming through on the other side, possibly due to daily PCR testing, antivirals and absolutely his amazing NHS team. He scored the winning goal for his team at a match on 29 December. I don't think his life is worth less than anyone else's, nor do I think anyone's life is. I feel no differently.

kittensinthekitchen · 15/01/2022 17:59

@mrsanflowerpot

I'm so sorry your son has been so ill, and really hope he is back to himself very soon, with no lasting effects.
His life is worth something to those of us with compassion and sympathy for others, and for those who love him.

My children have underlying conditions, which allowed them to have second doses sooner than the majority of their peers. There's no reason why their condition should reduce their life expectancy, and certainly not their value as humans.

Some people are delusional for thinking those who die were at death's door anyway, despite having this demonstrated to them time and time again.
If they still believe that, they are either very unintelligent, or just nasty people.

PastMyBestBeforeDate · 15/01/2022 18:33

@mrsanflowerpot Flowers for your family. I hope your ds is indeed coming out the other side.
I hate these threads.

InCahootswithOrwell · 15/01/2022 19:57

Are we really setting the bar for healthy vs unhealthy on the difference between those with an underlying condition and those without on this thread?

These numbers are meaningless. As they are they don’t really tell us much at all about the risk of Covid to the general population other than getting vaccinated is probably a good idea. As data goes it’s basically garbage in, garbage out.

BogRollBOGOF · 15/01/2022 20:36

It's a fact that underlying conditions have the potential to aggravate/ complicate illnesses and possibly contribute to premature deaths.

I don't know why this gets twisted into the "value" of life.

I've lost close relatives in their 40s & 50s. Both had "underlying conditions" One had severe learning difficulties. He died younger than many of his peers, but few of them live long lives. They mentally and physically age rapidly when they get to what we normally consider "middle age". They are not "worth less" at all, but it's a mistake to pretend that they share average life expectancy.

My other relative had "lifestyle" diseases. People can live to an old age with them, but if they've manifested at a younger age, it becomes less likely that they'll live many decades with them.

"Underlying health conditions" is a vast grey area, but the reality is a huge proportion of the population is in poor health to some degree.

The government has presented much of its propaganda as a blanket risk. Healthy, young people should never have been terrified when the risks are very much in their favour and clearly so from very early on. Restrictions have often been an impediment to healthier living, forcing people into being sedentary, restricting exercise to a "daily", local walk and eliminating incidental activity from school runs/ work/ shopping etc. Stressed or stuck at home, alcohol consumption increased. Take-aways were one of the few treats avaliable throughout. The shielding advice should have been updated and eased months before August 2020. There was a window in 2020 when pressure on healthcare eased significantly, but access to it did not with thousands being far more vulnerable now than they ever needed to be.

It's not that people with "underlying health conditions" are less valuable as people, it's disingenuous messaging about the risks to different demographics and access to healthy lifestyles and health care that's been a major problem.

MargaretThursday · 15/01/2022 20:39

With the things they put on the list of "underlying health issues" which was released, then I am amazed there are so many people who died without any health issues. I suspect many here would be surprised to find that they too would have been classified as having underlying health issues.

According to the BMJ: 24.4% of the UK population were at risk due to a record of at least one underlying health condition, including 8.3% of school-aged children, 19.6% of working-aged adults, and 66.2% of individuals aged 70 years or more. 7.1% of the population had multimorbidity.
So it's roughly 1/4 the population had at least one underlying health condition. On the basis we were told they were far more at risk than people without health conditions.

End of December about 150k deaths, so around 12% were without any health condition. That seems a lot to me considering how much less at risk we were told we were.

Of the 6 people I've known who died in 2020. Only one would not have expected to see 2030 at least, but only one would have been put down as no underlying causes.

Iggly · 15/01/2022 20:58

[quote CUniverse]ONS released this data mid December.

Does it make any difference to how you feel about the way the pandemic was handled? Does it detract from the fears you have about Covid yourself?

Is it even worth knowing these figures?

www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathsfromcovid19withnootherunderlyingcauses?s=08[/quote]
These figures are after the restrictions/public health measures we had.

So it shows that they did some good but not enough.

Barbie222 · 15/01/2022 20:59

I am amazed there are so many people who died without any health issues.

Yes, I feel that too, it's disconcerting

Libraryghost · 15/01/2022 21:20

Nope no difference at all. I adopt sensible precautions (where necessary) and get on with living,

JuergenSchwarzwald · 15/01/2022 21:22

Even if someone had an underlying condition it doesn't mean that that underlying condition was the reason that covid hit them harder than others of a similar age, it could be some other reason nobody knew about.

And I suspect that those who seemingly died without having underlying issues did have underlying issues, just not one anyone had diagnosed yet. Could be a genetic weakness. There has to be some reason why a seemingly healthy person dies of covid and another seemingly healthy person tests postive and has no symptoms at all and the inbetween of having long covid.

RedHot22 · 15/01/2022 21:30

I have no underlying health conditions
I’m have a BMI of 22
I exercise regularly and eat a healthy diet.

I’m one of the healthiest people I know.
I’ve been ill with Covid for months and have no idea why it’s hit me so hard and wonder if I will ever feel well again.

hamstersarse · 15/01/2022 21:36

I agree with @BogRollBOGOF

It is estimated that 80% of chronic disease is lifestyle related. I don’t understand why people haven’t changed what they can in their lifestyle starting in March 2020, this data has been here all along. If they had, all the stats would look very different. You can improve your metabolic health significantly in 21 days.

The data also makes me wonder why the Great Barrington declaration was so vehemently ridiculed. It’s been obvious from the start that targeted protection would be optimal. Instead we’ve trashed the economy, got inflation on the rise and totally unnecessarily ruined millions of children’s education.

ouch1000 · 15/01/2022 21:56

I cannot believe the GBD is still being lauded - even if it's instigators have admitted it would not have been viable knowing we what do now about herd immunity & reinfection.

hamstersarse · 15/01/2022 21:58

They haven’t @ouch1000

Targeted protection is what we’ve always done for every disease, this blanket approach imported from China is very new.

ouch1000 · 15/01/2022 22:00

@hamstersarse

They haven’t *@ouch1000*

Targeted protection is what we’ve always done for every disease, this blanket approach imported from China is very new.

Yes they have - literally noone with any shred of credibility is still pushing the GBD as viable.
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