Are there any talks of a post Christmas lockdown at all now?

[OrangeCrunch]

Just that really.

We were incredibly relieved and surprised to actually make it to this point, but assumed if we did, we'd almost definitely be cancelling our NYE plans, but that all seems to have gone quiet now.

Or have I missed something?

Merry Christmas btw!

@Userrr

Most if not all EU countries let you mix with people in your own house, however hard the lockdown is

Netherlands is described as the strictest omicron lockdown so far and it is allowing 2 visitors over 13, 4 for the holidays. I think a lot of the people who are stressed about the prospect of a lockdown because of the isolation would be a lot better able to cope if 2 visitors were allowed.

Yeah, I don't think many people will be having parties just the general popping in and out and visiting that people do. DS will be coming down sometime and staying overnight once he is clear of Covid

@User762980

Yeah, I don't think many people will be having parties just the general popping in and out and visiting that people do. DS will be coming down sometime and staying overnight once he is clear of Covid

My DC went to a couple of kids birthday parties last time but that was about it. Wasn't exactly bacchanalian non-compliance! Most of my lockdown breaches have been childcare related. Very mundane really.

I think that's because Labour are more centred on people, Tories on the economy

The economy IS people I’m afraid.

I’ll be opting out of this one too.

There won't be parties at NY because it's rocketing round teens, and also hitting their parents a few days later. So that puts the households out of circulation.

The teens (anecdote warning, seem to be mainly no or cold like symptoms, and just a few proper poorly), parents seems to be mainly cold or proper poorly (even those who have had it before). Not sure how far it's reached granny yet - perhaps that'll show up in about a week from now?

So long as its after 28th Dec so I can actually enjoy my birthday this year!

Hope not as DS has mocks when they get back

If it's a lockdown I'm not telling him because he won't revise next week otherwise...!

@RoseAndRose

There won't be parties at NY because it's rocketing round teens, and also hitting their parents a few days later. So that puts the households out of circulation.

The teens (anecdote warning, seem to be mainly no or cold like symptoms, and just a few proper poorly), parents seems to be mainly cold or proper poorly (even those who have had it before). Not sure how far it's reached granny yet - perhaps that'll show up in about a week from now?

That's assuming people test regularly and isolate when positive...

The economy IS people I’m afraid.

Yes, I don't know why some people get the idea that the "economy" is just rich bankers and fat cats.

@Cheetosyummy

I can’t see anything in the media today. No even how many Covid cases it’s in today… it’s like Covid doesn’t exist. Is it a special measures on Xmas day or to post anything? Looks like.

Covid still exists of course, but only people are only working in essential roles... Those compiling Covid stats will be having Christmas off like everyone else!

@BoredZelda

No one I know is getting worked up about it, just a calm 'No thanks'.

Which is equally insane. It won’t be a choice.

Well it will in terms of household mixing.

I don't know a single person now who would stop seeing family and friends if there were to be another lockdown. Not one. Every person I know has had enough and will carry on doing what they are doing other than things that are actually closed.

We've already planned a NYE out if there's no lockdown and a NYE at home with the same friends if there is and I know plenty who've done the same 🤷‍♀️

There is of course a choice. A choice to continue to see friends and family in your house. Most are double or triple vaccinated. Plus lots have just had Covid.

The government are unable to stop household mixing and most won’t comply.

They can shut the pubs and restaurants. Most people don’t go out much in January anyway so you’d hammer the sector even more for no gain.

@Incognito22333

I don’t think it is just about the NHS being overwhelmed anymore- we need concrete figures as to how many lives are actually saved by a lockdown and the economic cost of each of those lives. If every Covid live saved costs eg 15 million then it can’t be justified because the NHS won’t spend that kind of money on eg a cancer patient either. So I reckon Parliament would want hard figures and costs at this point when we have ample vaccine availability.

I agree. And it's not just the economic cost in GBP, it's the human harm caused by lockdowns. Economic deprivation reduces life expectancy. Then there is increased abuse and violence, the impact on mental health. Therefore a full cost/ benefit analysis of the long-term effects in terms of healthy life years impact should be done, and published publicly, if any further restrictions are justified. This should have been done at every stage but now I don't think the lack of publicly available data on the full impacts - not just the Covid impacts on one side of the equation - will be tolerated.

On the subject of the human cost, it wasn't remotely surprising that the ICO had to make the government publish the recent assessments of lockdown's impact on various groups.

I don't think one single poster has said that. Source if you disagree?

It’s a common response to the question of where people think they will go when they whinge about not complying with lockdown.

People will have normal human interaction with their friends and family in their own homes.

So, maybe once a week they’ll pop round to see their mum. That’s hardly ignoring a lockdown.

And it's not just the economic cost in GBP, it's the human harm caused by lockdowns. Economic deprivation reduces life expectancy. Then there is increased abuse and violence, the impact on mental health. Therefore a full cost/ benefit analysis of the long-term effects in terms of healthy life years impact should be done, and published publicly, if any further restrictions are justified. This should have been done at every stage but now I don't think the lack of publicly available data on the full impacts - not just the Covid impacts on one side of the equation - will be tolerated.

Again, what are the “lockdown” harms that wouldn’t have also happened in lockdown didn’t happen?

I read this evening of an A&E with only 2 qualified nurses on staff tonight because everyone else available has tested positive for covid.

Our local co-op is closed this week because half the staff have covid.

The restaurant at the resort we are staying at closed early all week because 4 of their 6 staff have covid.

We can’t choose between covid and the economy.

There must be something in the info from the CMOs that Wales/Scotland/NI have all listened to, as they ahve all taken similar steps.

So, maybe once a week they’ll pop round to see their mum. That’s hardly ignoring a lockdown

I actually think people will see more of their friends and families at home if that's all they can do.

@AnyFucker

That is fucking insane. Get Xmas Day over and the media will start with their doomsday headlines. So sick of this shit.

DH and I are on our own this Xmas Day, both adult dc’s have covid currently. All a lockdown will do is prolong the agony

Totally agree kicking can down toad when does it stop !

@BoredZelda

I don't think one single poster has said that. Source if you disagree?

It’s a common response to the question of where people think they will go when they whinge about not complying with lockdown.

People will have normal human interaction with their friends and family in their own homes.

So, maybe once a week they’ll pop round to see their mum. That’s hardly ignoring a lockdown.

If it's that common a response, you'll have no trouble furnishing us with some examples. Obviously you wouldn't want people to think you were coming up with ever more strangulated definitions of non-compliance because you really don't like being told that people aren't going to be bound by restrictions on social contact.

@BoredZelda

I don’t think it is just about the NHS being overwhelmed anymore- we need concrete figures as to how many lives are actually saved by a lockdown and the economic cost of each of those lives.

Once again, stop pretending you can choose between covid and the economy.

What she has said is perfectly standard when the health system decides how to treat patients. People don't like to think about it, and it's more complex that "this costs too much" but cost is part of the calculation in deciding how to treat various types of illnesses.

In order to be able to look at that there has to be some way to actually approximate the costs involved. Not just to individuals to be sure, but you can't get out of that part either.

Staffing problems now mostly aren't people who are too ill, though. They are people required to isolate.

Not the same thing.

@SantaClawsServiette

Staffing problems now mostly aren't people who are too ill, though. They are people required to isolate.

Not the same thing.

The impact on services is still problematic.

Isolation policy is a political reaction and can be and has been changed. 14/ 10/ 7 days. It could easily be changed to something like symptoms with LFT positive rather than a set block of time.