Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Covid

Mumsnet doesn't verify the qualifications of users. If you have medical concerns, please consult a healthcare professional.

Original poster

Welsh government overreaching now fines for working

138 replies

justasking111 · 21/12/2021 20:39

Well this has caused dismay you must try to work from home your employer must enable this from Monday, your vehicle stopped £60 fine, employer 1k fine.

You'll be fined if you live in Wales but work in England

Welsh government overreaching now fines for working
Welsh government overreaching now fines for working
OP posts:
TheRedTowel · 21/12/2021 20:41

I think not having a laptop to give you would be good enough reason surely.

Who is enforcing this BTW? The invisible, non-existent border patrols?

Katie517 · 21/12/2021 20:43

Wow, the welsh government are insane. Police should focus on real crime. Also the majority of these fines have never stood up in court.

Andacherryonthetop · 21/12/2021 20:46

This is mental. I live by the border and loads of people by me commute to Chester and Liverpool. Their employers could insist on them being in the office and they could still be fined! It’s absolutely ridiculous. Drakeford just loses the plot at times. It’s like when half the aisles of the shops were taped off because he decided you could go to the shop but only enter certain aisles.

NothingIsWrong · 21/12/2021 21:03

I only manage to keep my mental health under control by working from the office. My job is stressful and full on, having it in my house ALL THE TIME with no appropriate workspace was devastating. Would this count? Luckily I'm not in Wales, but there must be people like me who are.

Petshopboyes · 21/12/2021 21:11

I am in wales and we are expected in the office! We all have laptops and we all WFH for 14 months in the last lockdown but our top managers do not believe in WFH so we all have to be in. Our employers haven’t said a thing about this. What the hell? So I can be stopped going to work in the morning??

VikingVolva · 21/12/2021 21:53

If they're doing this now, then something has really rattled them

What have they seen that the public haven't?

Or is the Welsh government a bunch of totalitarian control freaks?

hamstersarse · 21/12/2021 21:54

Fining people who go out to make their living is a whole new level of batshitness. Totalitarian batshit.

JuergenSchwarzwald · 21/12/2021 21:57

How can you be fined for earning a living? I wouldn't worry if you work over the border, it's not remotely enforceable.

is the Welsh government a bunch of totalitarian control freaks yes

and if the employer says you have to be in the office why the hell should the individual be fined - by all means fine the micromanaging employer who refuses to let someone WFH when they can

BigHuff · 21/12/2021 22:11

Wow, intriguing.

Will they actually stop anyone? Can't everyone who's stopped just say they work with machinery/equipment which must remain on-site?

Will they demand proof of where you're going/what kind of job you do? How can people be expected to provide this?

So many questions!

Original poster
justasking111 · 21/12/2021 22:38

And yet if I get stopped and say I'm going to England for a shopping trip in Chester, Cheshire oaks that's absolutely fine. I can catch a train to London Omicron central and have a good time. But go to work oh no.

Drakeford famous for closing off aisles of children's clothing, books, magazines, etc.

He's power mad wants us all unemployed on benefits and grateful to him

OP posts:
Lupinhere37 · 21/12/2021 22:48

This is currently being mocked on BBC News 24 channel. He’s made himself a laughing stock. He’s an arse of a man; as ridiculous as Boris, in his own way.

Lupinhere37 · 21/12/2021 22:53

To add….how on earth are the Police expected to execute this? It’s absurd.

Original poster
justasking111 · 21/12/2021 22:56

@Lupinhere37

To add….how on earth are the Police expected to execute this? It’s absurd.
They said the other day many police were off isolating for ten days
OP posts:
Covidworries · 21/12/2021 22:58

Its from monday. So gives conoanies time to arrange. Its to ensure all those who can work from home do.
If you cant tou will be given a letter to show if stopped. Not disimular to the other lockdowns where key workers needed a letter.
I really doubt anyonenwill be able to go shopping at chester then either. Lots of places are going to be closed soon.
No one wants lockdown including the governments. But of they are locking down it is for a reason and needed

Campervan69 · 21/12/2021 22:58

This is ridiculous 😒 what an utter tit this man is.

NothingIsWrong · 21/12/2021 23:04

@Covidworries

Its from monday. So gives conoanies time to arrange. Its to ensure all those who can work from home do. If you cant tou will be given a letter to show if stopped. Not disimular to the other lockdowns where key workers needed a letter. I really doubt anyonenwill be able to go shopping at chester then either. Lots of places are going to be closed soon. No one wants lockdown including the governments. But of they are locking down it is for a reason and needed
The definition of "can" work from home is laid out somewhere then I assume? With clear well laid out rules for people to follow? A tight well drafted legally checked definition of what consitues being able to work from home? Legal requirements for desks, chairs, appropriate workspaces, insurance, display equipment, mental health support etc? All laid out so it's easy for companies to follow?
Original poster
justasking111 · 21/12/2021 23:04

Interesting that both sturgeon and drakeford are being advised by Gordon Brown.

OP posts:
madisonbridges · 21/12/2021 23:06

How will they define whether an employer can manage with their staff working from home or not? It might logisticslly feasible but financially crippling. Would he push a business to the wall to enforce it? Or maybe he thinks the threat alone will be enough to make employers rethink their work strategies.

IcedPurple · 21/12/2021 23:08

This is nuts.

Can't believe that some here are trying to defend this, but I guess I shouldn't really be surprised at this point. I could maybe just about have understood this in March last year, but it's utterly ridiculous and intrusive at this stage.

MousesBack · 21/12/2021 23:10

I assume he's trying to protect workers whose employers insist that they go in when when there is no need to physically be there. I have read plenty of Mumsnetters moaning about that kind of thing over the last 18 months. But surely fine the employers and not the employee?
I would have thought that inadequate broadband (common in rural Wales) or poor mental health or lack of workspace would be good enough reasons to go in, if you really want to.

NothingIsWrong · 21/12/2021 23:11

You can't enforce what isn't defined. This has been so rushed through I can't imagine they have come up with a watertight definition of "can work from home"

SickAndTiredAgain · 21/12/2021 23:12

@Covidworries

Its from monday. So gives conoanies time to arrange. Its to ensure all those who can work from home do. If you cant tou will be given a letter to show if stopped. Not disimular to the other lockdowns where key workers needed a letter. I really doubt anyonenwill be able to go shopping at chester then either. Lots of places are going to be closed soon. No one wants lockdown including the governments. But of they are locking down it is for a reason and needed
Why fine the employee though.

I think this is extreme anyway, but fining the employee is absurd. Your company says you have to come in, so you either go and risk the fine, or don’t and risk your job.

Is the definition of who can work from home clearly defined? Can any company just print off a letter saying their staff need to be in? Or is it checked in some way?

madisonbridges · 21/12/2021 23:12

@NothingIsWrong

I only manage to keep my mental health under control by working from the office. My job is stressful and full on, having it in my house ALL THE TIME with no appropriate workspace was devastating. Would this count? Luckily I'm not in Wales, but there must be people like me who are.
A previous job of mine dictated I had to do admin from home. I had an allowance for it so bought a house with office space. But the job was pressured and the boundary between working and homelike became blurred so eventually I felt I was never off duty. It resulted in me having a breakdown and eventually being pensioned off. That was about 25 years ago and I still live with mental health ramifications. I don't think the mental health of staff is given anywhere enough consideration when working environments are considered. The move to more WFH is storing up lots of mental health problems in the future in my opinion.
IcedPurple · 21/12/2021 23:12

\I assume he's trying to protect workers whose employers insist that they go in when when there is no need to physically be there.

How do you legally define 'no need to physically be there'?

Because if you are going to fine people, then there has to be a very clear legal definition.

Covidworries · 21/12/2021 23:26

Its a pandemic, the virus spreads through close contact. People going to a workplace when the role can be done from home. Means close cpntact with colleagues, possible public transport contacts too.

Working from home during other restrictions will reduce spread.
If your role can not be done from.home then the employer will need to justify why. Checkout worker, very clear cant be done at home. Employer gives employee letter to show. Distribution lorry driver cant be done from home employer gives employee letter.
Admin role which previously was done via work from home can likely be done from home again so employee should facilitate this. Or be able to explain why this isnt feasible.
Employee unable to work from home due to health, or resource issue should discuss with employer so this can be evidenced in HR and then they also will have a letter to carry.

Or we can carry on with no mitigations and cross out fingers that the essential services we all need dont go to shit