Why have people forgotten February 2020 ?

[DottyHarmer]

When Northern Italy was in a terrible state - dreadful scenes of overrun hospitals and over 70s were told to stay at home if they were ill because they were being deprioritised for beds. In China the situation (that we could see) wasn’t thrilling either.

And now we have people - posters on here - saying that there’s no point in vaccines “because they don’t reduce transmission” and people don’t get that ill anyway.

I don’t think the world shut down in 2020 for a laugh, and certainly not for some nefarious purpose to which so many were privy but has never been revealed .

The majority of us have largely been completely shielded from the realities of what has been dealt with.

I think lots will have been touched by some degree though whether it's a death in the family, not seeing loved ones, losing their livelihood, long covid etc.

For me, those scenes are so far removed from my experience.. everyone I know who has had covid had a cold, isolated, then cracked on as normal. It's hard to live in fear and compliance, for years, of something that the media is telling me to be scared of, but my own experience is telling me otherwise. Other people have had a very different personal experience, and are understandably traumatised by it, but I can't make myself be terrified of it when I'm not.

I find it baffling that people still don’t get it. Jason Manford, who is generally a really reasonable person on Facebook posted yesterday about why would we need restrictions with the vaccine and isn’t omicron less severe.. comments in The Times after an article about possible restrictions are all, no we are sick of it now we won’t comply.

A tiny fraction of a very large number is still a big number. I think everyone needs to listen to someone who worked in Covid wards during the peaks recount their experience.

I’m also losing patience with unvaccinated people because ultimately they are the problem now.

I’m absolutely sick of the whole thing, I’ve hated every restriction and want to get on with my life, but I also want a functional health service and know that many HCP are on the edge of quitting because it’s been horrendous for them. Government are taking a huge risk at the moment, I really hope it pays off, but it’s reckless.

Someone with relatives in chile compared the appreciation of the vaccines there to here and considered a level of health privilege.

She said her relatives there were too well aware of the too recent impact of not having access vaccines and being conscious of good health care and hygiene.

I think they fact there was huge upsurge in the booster take up after the Omicron talk shows people are aware.

@LadyCampanulaTottington

Italians are still deeply traumatised by the experience. They are wholly compliant with mask wearing, hand sanitiser, vaccinations and social distancing. It’s been eye opening really considering the usual deep mistrust of government.

The UK should be grateful for not having the same experience and doing EVERYTHING possible to avoid it. It’s baffling really.

Agreed. I'm in the south of Italy and have seen a people who will not let that happen again no matter what it takes. I teach 300 teenagers a week. All vaccinated (and yes, we've seen their Vax records) all masked. And not one complaint. Not one. (And that doesn't make them "lockdown lovers" as we hear so often on here, it just IMO makes them mature, and aware that the price paid last March was too high) One positive test since September, three weeks ago. The whole class moved quietly online again, and we all went off to be tested. And not one complaint. Yes, there are anti-vax and anti-restriction and anti-pass protests. I don't think any country got it totally right, or totally wrong. It's not that black and white. But when we were locked down by Conte, the consensus certainly among people I know was ok, let's do this.

Posted too soon.

I don't know if that is a factor but i can see it being so.

@mclaw

I don't think it's normal for society to be altruistic, most people to things that protect themselves & their loved ones.

I agree that as individuals people are inherently selfish and will do what’s best for them it’s not automatically a negative to act selfishly. However, civilisation is built on looking past the individual to recognise the longer term benefits to an individual by acting collectively.

We’d still be roaming the savanna if early humans hadn’t recognised the strengths of acting collectively and following the advances discovered and shared by the few.

I’m also losing patience with unvaccinated people because ultimately they are the problem now.

I said this on another thread but apparently 200k nhs workers are unvaxxed.

@IcedAbstinente I'm so sorry. I hope they never have to face the fear you have. They should be ashamed of themselves

Years ago my DF used to say half the people in this country are normal and half are nutters. I don't think he was too far wrong.

There's also people in the country (I'm thinking of one specifically) who are sometimes confused by their own job but believe that covid passports are a fast track to a 'New World Order', who state things like it's hard being the unvaxxed and standing up to the govt and being left out of society, who state that the death toll is only 1% anyway, that masks cause illness and refuse to wear one, who state things like the vaccines aren't vaccines etc. It's so draining to work with them. I'm more sick of these people than I am of covid.

I’m not personally terrified of Covid, I’m frightened of a world where there aren’t any ambulances available or intensive care beds available. None of this is likely to affect me personally, but none of us know when we are going to need emergency care.

@Cornettoninja but the vast majority are acting collectively;

So far, more than 51 million people have had a first vaccine dose - some 89% of over-12s. Nearly 47 million - 81.5% of over-12s - have had both doses

100% is impossible

I do think why when people talk about a booster being something they find too onerous but then then the alternative is months of hardship in restrictions etc

Re complaints, I work across a number of educational and healthcare settings, my husband is a secondary school teacher, and there have been no complaints at all about any changes, restrictions, that have come through to us in real life. I do see the severe impact of lockdowns in my work, but not complaints about having to make changes as such to those of us in “authority”. Behind closed doors I don’t know. Reading the comments on here and extrapolating to an entire nation isn’t fair. There are people complaining in other countries just as much I am sure (I spent half my childhood in another European country and I am aware of it).

Thanks @Treaclepie19 .

[quote Cornettoninja]@LadyCampanulaTottington, I’m not sure the UK has avoided it tbh, I think we’ve stage managed it better.

I have quite a few HCP’s in my social circle, they’re pretty traumatised and of the few people I know admitted for covid their stays on covid wards were by far the most traumatic thing they’ve experienced and they’ve most certainly been traumatised by what they’ve witnessed far more than the actual illness they had.

The majority of us have largely been completely shielded from the realities of what has been dealt with.[/quote]
This - I know personally a couple of doctors who were on the Covid frontline who now have PTSD. I don’t think the vast majority of people have any idea of what it’s been like in health and social care during Covid - but what’s worse is that they refuse to put their brains and imagination to work in order to understand or find out.

@Duopuss81

I hate to say it, but I think loads and loads of people are just thick? And really selfish

I agree. A young woman on our local facebook page was spouting off yesterday saying it didn't exist and we were all sheeples for wearing masks and having vaccinations. She really isn't the most intelligent person. Always arguing on the page.

Reading the comments on here and extrapolating to an entire nation isn’t fair. There are people complaining in other countries just as much I am sure (I spent half my childhood in another European country and I am aware of it).

Exactly, The reality doesn't reflect what people are extrapolating to the UK. The majority are vaccinated & lockdown compliance was high.

“ However, civilisation is built on looking past the individual to recognise the longer term benefits to an individual by acting collectively. ”

Yes and no. If you allow people to reach desperate circumstances they will make desperate decisions. Which is why it is immoral to allow people to reach those circumstances IF you are asking them to do something for the “greater good”.

but I think loads and loads of people are just thick?

I agree with this, a huge lack of critical thinking & lack of nuance on so many aspects.

Because we need to learn to live with it - which roughly translated means people who are older or who have underlying health conditions have to die of something, the NHS is overwhelmed anyway at this time of year, my need to socialise is more important and my ability to comprehend how large swathes of the workforce being off is likely to impact on the economy or health services is limited.

Note - I don’t agree with any of that btw.

People have very short memories, especially for things that didn't directly impact them.