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Omicron New Variant Thread 2 *title edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

782 replies

Thewiseoneincognito · 01/12/2021 21:42

Continuation of the last thread

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19
RedToothBrush · 10/12/2021 19:39

@peridito

Isn't Gove known to be more in favour of stricter measure? More prone to highlight severity of Covid ?

So presenting things through a different lens ..?

Correct.

He is going to present a much bleaker picture because of what he thinks we should be doing

(Tbh, he has a better grasp of detail on things generally than the majority of his colleagues so although I dislike him, you'd also be unwise to dismiss where he stands on this).

containsnuts · 10/12/2021 19:45

@SleevedOff

The third does doesn't stop you from getting it either it seems.

I've also realised that it's not the main headline that's misleading but if you share the article and see it on WhatsApp, the first thing my eye was drawn to was is the initial line under the photo.

How can they possibly know that at this stage? There's only been a few hundred Omicron cases in the UK, most of them caught less than 2 weeks ago. So it's great that a few dozen people who had 3 vaccines didn't get symptoms with Omicron but you can't just assume it's going to be the same for the other 60 million.
containsnuts · 10/12/2021 19:46

When I say 'you', I mean the BBC.

SleevedOff · 10/12/2021 19:51

@containsnuts

When I say 'you', I mean the BBC.
I am commenting on what they've reported.

It says "But a third booster prevents around 75% of people getting any Covid symptom"

Therefore suggesting that the third vaccination doesn't stop you from getting Omicron?

SleevedOff · 10/12/2021 19:51

And therefore

"Two doses of a Covid vaccine are not enough to stop you catching the Omicron variant, UK scientists have warned."

Should read 3?

bluetongue · 10/12/2021 19:55

Do you think it’s going to be hard to get compliance with stricter measures p for a variant that poses less risk to the individual but still a big risk to the health system?

I’m not in the UK but I know where I am fatigue is high and most people are pretty immune to the fear factor now.

Besides, if Omicron really is as infectious as they are saying nothing short of a wholesale lockdown is going to have any impact on case numbers.

SleevedOff · 10/12/2021 19:56

I also suspect it's a lot more than 30% of cases in London as some suspected omicron cases have not yet been confirmed as such.

You get a message that tells you "this person may have the omicron variant of the virus" and they send you a special PCR kit to detect the new variant.

manolantern · 10/12/2021 19:58

"Either it'll all be fine regardless or we're stuffed whatever we do. I don't see a lot in between at present."

twitter.com/andrew_lilico/status/1469380425474875398

SleevedOff · 10/12/2021 19:58

But we are still waiting to find out if the person actually has the variant so I'm sure there have been many missed cases.

MarshaBradyo · 10/12/2021 19:59

@bluetongue

Do you think it’s going to be hard to get compliance with stricter measures p for a variant that poses less risk to the individual but still a big risk to the health system?

I’m not in the UK but I know where I am fatigue is high and most people are pretty immune to the fear factor now.

Besides, if Omicron really is as infectious as they are saying nothing short of a wholesale lockdown is going to have any impact on case numbers.

It’s hard to second guess - compliance is generally pretty good but messaging has always been used to effect. Eg they could play up high numbers for restrictions / compliance or dial up mild if they don’t want people to get spooked by numbers (if it is mild)

Btw I think you are in Aus iirc, do you have Omicron community cases there?

bluetongue · 10/12/2021 20:08

We’re just starting to get Omicron community cases here in Australia. It’s nearly impossible to stop unless you go full on North Korea or China. If you listen to Scott Morrison Omicron is just fine but state premiers area bit spooked

VikingOnTheFridge · 10/12/2021 20:22

@bluetongue

Do you think it’s going to be hard to get compliance with stricter measures p for a variant that poses less risk to the individual but still a big risk to the health system?

I’m not in the UK but I know where I am fatigue is high and most people are pretty immune to the fear factor now.

Besides, if Omicron really is as infectious as they are saying nothing short of a wholesale lockdown is going to have any impact on case numbers.

Compliance over Christmas is a lost cause.
the80sweregreat · 10/12/2021 20:38

If the daily Mail comments are anything to go by, nobody would obey anything especially over Christmas! Not since ' party gate' too
Most people don't believe anyone or believe it's all hype over a ' cold'
They will up against it.

MarshaBradyo · 10/12/2021 20:41

True I think Christmas would go ahead regardless of any restrictions on that for many

It comes down to what they choose to use to control - some things mean we don’t have a choice eg closing sectors (I really don’t want that) or restricting sectors

the80sweregreat · 10/12/2021 20:47

A lockdown for a cold?
I very much doubt anyone will listen to Boris Johnson . They really will need someone else to get any messages across if it turns out to be really bad..
It's a dilemma for sure

MarshaBradyo · 10/12/2021 20:50

Hopefully not anything too much but some depressing links being posted tonight

peridito · 10/12/2021 21:00

@Beachcomber The Moderna booster is half a dose. Pfizer is the same

What is Pfizer the same as ? The same as Moderna and a half dose ?.

Perihelion · 10/12/2021 21:05

I wonder if the majority of Scottish tests going to the Glasgow lighthouse lab, which clearly can test for s gene drop out, has given a more accurate doubling rate, compared to other parts of the UK.
Or it all kicked off earlier with COP26.

Montecristocount · 10/12/2021 21:06

The pfizer booster is exactly the same as a normal dose. I know this because the doctor who did mine said it could be registered as a third dose or a booster as I was technically entitled to the third dose. He said it’s exactly the same thing going in, just if it gets recorded as a third then I get the option for a booster in 6 months so we went for that option.

peridito · 10/12/2021 21:09

Besides, if Omicron really is as infectious as they are saying nothing short of a wholesale lockdown is going to have any impact on case numbers

I can't help thinking this ,but I suppose any restriction might prevent/postpone some infections and that this will help the NHS.Which in my view is the important thing .Though there are people's livlihoods to consider as well...

peridito · 10/12/2021 21:11

Thanks Montecristocount that explains it!

RedToothBrush · 10/12/2021 21:12

@TokyoSushi

This also looking bleak... www.theguardian.com/world/2021/dec/10/stringent-uk-covid-measures-needed-within-a-week-leak-reveals?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

I wonder if we're going to make it to Christmas without more restrictions at this rate? Hideous.

Things are moving fast. And they are going to move faster last week. We are into political psycho drama land where people are doing all sorts and pretending different even when they are fully in the knowledge of what they will eventually do.

I'm still not inclined to think we will be into formal social distancing rule of 6 type restrictions or more pre-christmas as things stand (I am starting to waiver on that thought though. Ask me again in a few days!)

Something I note is how far has Scotland gone. Sturgeon is further along than Westminister. But not significantly so. Keep your eyes on that. Sturgeon is limited in terms of financial support, but if she starts begging London pay attention...

I don't believe either government can move before the public penny drops otherwise there will be massive dissent (both with the public and politics). The public definitely isn't ready for it just yet and I think its pointless trying to do too much formally because of the backlash that would create. Its counter productive in terms of behaviour. You'll get people doing things 'just to spite' the government. And can you be reelected PM if you cancel two christmas in a row? Especially with the Christmas Party row still fresh in minds.

However I note that whilst there is a vocally anti-restriction mood, a lot of people and businesses are doing doing different and voting with feet at the same time too. Behavioural change is happening. So a softer push might be as effective anyway at this point.

Instead I think we are currently most likely to get a fudge of strong advisories this week that leave businesses up shit creek with no support and no customers. There isn't a majority appetite in the Cabinet nor parliament to do much more even now. Even Labour isn't calling for much more yet... And Johnson has form for being indecisive...

Timing becomes significant here now I think.

Schools largely only have a week to go. Working from home starts Monday. And hospitalisations have a lag. It takes a day or two for numbers to come through. So some gambling on not 'cancelling' christmas might come in here. Things might just be ok to hang on if you were desparate not to cancel Christmas... (Or they might not...)

I note that parliamentary recess starts on the 16th. And the 3 week review is after that... If parliament is in recess it can't vote. The PM can potentially do emergency things under other laws if needed without parliament in that situation. (Won't be liked but still doable). But I think it'll be timed to start after New Year even if that happens.

Jan is going to be a mess even if omicron is mild. Schools reopening will be interesting... Will they have the staff? Its already looking baked in, even with those stringent restrictions. Even if we have lots of restrictions.

I think its on a knife edge, but why be seen to fuck Christmas too?

VikingOnTheFridge · 10/12/2021 21:21

I get the impression a lot of people are tailoring their behaviour now specifically to try and protect Christmas too. Voluntarily not going out with a view to being uninfected.

RedToothBrush · 10/12/2021 21:22

@peridito

Besides, if Omicron really is as infectious as they are saying nothing short of a wholesale lockdown is going to have any impact on case numbers

I can't help thinking this ,but I suppose any restriction might prevent/postpone some infections and that this will help the NHS.Which in my view is the important thing .Though there are people's livlihoods to consider as well...

Where I am...

Don't want it. Don't think it avoidable tbh. It'll happen somewhat spontaneously regardless even if not sanctioned by government.

And government probably can only do so much until a critical problem as the public won't stand for it now anyway.

IMPORTANT NOTE AT THIS POINT: Contigency planning 'for just a cold' does exist.

When we have had concerns about Swine Flu in the past there was contigency planning because of the worry so many workers would be off, critical services and infrastructure wouldn't be able to operate properly due to staff shortages.

Even in a best case 'omicron is very mild' scenario, that could well be what we are running headlong into.

It would be very shortlived but it'd be a problem nontheless.

If its worse than that, then we have other issues to contend with too.

Thewiseoneincognito · 10/12/2021 21:29

I agree RTB, all eyes on Sturgeon. She’s usually a step or two ahead and is a good indication of where we’ll be heading.

Do we have any idea yet what ‘very challenging new information’ Gove was alluding to?

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