And now ... The Symptomless Variant!!

[SencosRshit]

www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/delta-plus-symptomless-variant-driving-22198497

@Sumsencosrshit

Ah yes, your classic argument that because numbers are increasing that means none of the measures are working

This is a sensible argument isn’t it? How would you argue it olly?

It's not a sensible argument at all. Numbers could have been rising a lot faster without the measures.

@Lostinacloud

And incidentally, I don’t actually see what is wrong with my argument that cases still rise despite all the restrictions in place. It’s evident in most countries of the world that is the case. Look at 100% vaccinated Gibraltar and Israel a few weeks ago.

Cases don't rise when ALL restrictions are in place. Look at how effective the lockdowns were - that proves the when ALL restrictions are in place, the infection rate plummets. It's blindingly obvious that infections will spread when people are mixing freely - the question is of balance, i.e. what level of restrictions are needed to stop covid beggaring up the country, in terms of the NHS, the economy, benefits etc.

It's not a sensible argument at all. Numbers could have been rising a lot faster without the measures.

Quite @Badbadbunny

@SencosRshit / @Sumsencosrshit

Have replied to @Lostinacloud with words to this effect several times on various different threads.

Cases don't rise when ALL restrictions are in place. Look at how effective the lockdowns were - that proves the when ALL restrictions are in place, the infection rate plummets.

This was true for original and alpha but delta is more difficult- as NZ and Melbourne got in very early but it still spread

Right now we have lower restrictions in England than many other places and fairly steady cases / hospitalisation which is actually quite good considering

It gets harder when rapid growth happens as you need brakes on

@Badbadbunny and @ollyollyoxenfree have you not looked at any stats or graphs?

Practically every single last country of the world timed their lockdowns to start right before the peak. The numbers were going down anyway!

And I say again, the vaccines work, case numbers no longer matter.

You both sound like the BBC except you’re forgetting to say “other viruses and threats to life are also available!” We cannot justify focusing on this one virus for which we have vaccines any longer. The rest of the health service is falling apart for other people who need it just as much.

[quote Lostinacloud]**@Badbadbunny* and @ollyollyoxenfree* have you not looked at any stats or graphs?

Practically every single last country of the world timed their lockdowns to start right before the peak. The numbers were going down anyway!

And I say again, the vaccines work, case numbers no longer matter.[/quote]
I don’t think you can say this

Lockdown did suppress spread and cause big drops

It was a peak caused by the lockdowns, which then rose again when lifted

The waves of cases seem to be fairly consistent in their ebb and flow regardless of lockdowns.

Please stop with this there is a vaccine that breaks the link between infection and hospitalisation or death for all those wishing to have it, whether vulnerable or not.
It's not true for all. It is true for most but not all.

@Lostinacloud

The waves of cases seem to be fairly consistent in their ebb and flow regardless of lockdowns.

Can you say a country that peaked without using a lockdown?

For the first two / three - Before the last two months when the picture is changing wrt immunity

The state of Florida between July of this year and October of this year. No masks, no school closures and no lockdowns.
It’s quite hard to find a country that hasn’t always slammed a lockdown in right ahead of a peak and I daren’t mention Sweden on here!

Ha I don’t mind Sweden as a mention. I think I saw some posts saying it was doing well, and that’s a far cry from times when you got bailed out for daring to say it.

Ok I’ll take Sweden and Florida as good examples. If we, and all the other countries who put on brakes didn’t, I wonder what would have happened

Sweden or Brazil? Was Brazil pretty bad iirc

I do think the peaks Europe / U.K. etc were unnatural ones caused by lockdown still though

As they happened at same time and after cases started rising again

This is slightly separate to Sweden or Florida choosing different approach