AIBU That we learn to accept COVID is here to stay!

[Jakie7700]

That now a massive number is double vaccinated those who want to be and that teenagers have started to be offered them, it seems so ridiculous that kids are still losing out on school because they are being sent home as they have a minor cold with minor cough. Covid will still be around in years to come, so will children still be sent home then with a mild cough due to colds?

Many missed days of school waiting for PCR results, parents usually mothers missing work over and over. Nobody seemed to care two years back when these same children were spreading flu, chicken pox etc which can all kill or cause serious complications both in adults and children.

Nothing is going to change you can get COVID again like a cold. Just last week I heard of two friends kids being sent home because of mild cough (coughed three/four times the whole day) missed days of school waiting for results only to be negative and then told this will happen every time they have a cough which as most will know in primary children will be alot over winter! These same parents who have nearly lost jobs due to having to juggle childcare through lockdowns. Surely it is just time to accept COVID is isn't going anywhere and stop making kids espeically suffer.

@thecatfromjapan
@Mumof3andlovingit
Are posters on mumsnet not allowed to divert any thoughts than their OP without being called a liar or making stuff up? Arent posters allowed to be concerned at yet another winter of primary kids missing days/weeks of school waiting for PCR results and parents being in despair at having kids sent home and risking their jobs.
I have never posted on the COVID board before now but a quick look through shows me alot of the your 'making stupid assumption, your talking bullshit, oh for fuck sake wind your neck in' and other abusive comments are from the same people on other covid threads who jump down people's throats who disagree with the poster. I also find it intresting a good number of these posters state they are teachers.

Poorly children shouldn't be in school though. This has always been the case. Why should it now be acceptable to send poorly children in to school?

People have had to take a lot of time off for covid related reasons and some people's jobs are very insecure. If keeping a child with mild symptoms off means you can't afford to feed the family that week, then it's totally understandable why people make that choice.

If parents truly are losing their jobs whilst awaiting PCR results for their kids (I haven't seen any evidence this is actually true) then we have a much bigger problem in this country than covid.

Like the total lack of decent workplaces and worker protections.

And yet, restaurants can't get staff and there aren't enough HGV drivers. I wonder if it's the shitty working conditions? Best focus on that really, or the whole country's going to grind to a halt even more than it has so far.

Like the total lack of decent workplaces and worker protections.

This is not exactly a surprise though. We've had charities, campaigner groups talking about it for a long time.

Of course we need to live as though coronavirus isn't going away!

Everyone can get on board with that!

Only problem here is that 'living with coronavirus' would probably entail things like long-term planning, increases and readjustment of sick pay, development of a caring allowance, readjustment of curriculum (to take account of absence), investment in school buildings ...

Simply allowing sick kids to be dumped in schools is probably the exact opposite of 'learning to live with coronavirus'.

Yes, well said Cat

The symptom which requires a PCR is 'a new continuous cough'.

Most common colds do not have this symptom. The typical order of symptoms for a common cold are: sore throat / raised glands, followed quickly by snottiness and sneezing (which starts clear and get greener and thicker as the cold progresses) then the cough starts (often triggered by nasal drip of the mucus down the throat).

So no, my son's school doesn't worry about a bit of coughing when the kid is already a bit snotty (provided they have had a lateral flow). If a kid started continously coughing out of nowhere (actually not very common) then you'd need to get a PCR. It's applying some common sense.

Anyway, bumblingbovine has nailed the issue:

'I fail to understand why people need to keep reiterating what is happening anyway. You could not really ignore Covid more than we are at the moment in this country so why post this?'

This is true.

Ignoring coronavirus is just what we're doing.

We haven't invested in the NHS to deal with coronavirus - & it's on its knees, stretched to the point other services are fucked.

We haven't re-jigged sick pay to cope with absences needed for testing, isolation, illness & caring duties.

We haven't really-jigged the curriculum and assessment systems to deal with the impact of coronavirus.

We haven't increased community support for those forced into a more isolated existence.

It's all cobbled together, last minute adjustments, when our existing systems inevitably reach breaking point.

After two years, here we are. With no real long-term planning.

Suggesting an end to testing children with symptoms is just more of the same.

Ignore, ignore ...

And, make no mistake, despite the wholly disingenuous claims that the most vulnerable will benefit from a strategy of ignoring coronavirus, it simply is not true.

Will ceasing to test people with symptoms help the NHS?

No.

Who most relies on the NHS? Could it be the poorest and most vulnerable?

Yes.

Who would benefit from serious investment in a coronavirus-aware benefits system? Is it the very well-off?

No.

It would be the most vulnerable.

So, who benefits from this strategy of ignoring coronavirus?

🤷‍♀️

Anyway. This is all to give this thread too much thought.

Coughing all over other children in school is grim.

Keep your child at home, get a test. Think of others. Don't be selfish.

So no, my son's school doesn't worry about a bit of coughing when the kid is already a bit snotty (provided they have had a lateral flow).

That's not true of all schools though. Many would require a pcr in these circumstances.

Why has this turned into parents Vs teachers? Teachers don't set isolation rules. Also many of us teachers are parents too! It's not like our kids being off has no impact on our work either!

@ArialAnna what the actual guidance says “ a new, continuous cough – this means coughing a lot for more than an hour, or 3 or more coughing episodes in 24 hours (if you usually have a cough, it may be worse than usual)”.

So at the point your child starts coughing, they get a PCR. You don’t ignore the cough because they have a cold. Your sons school are negligent and goi by against guidance by doing so. I bet any money their risk assessment will say children who have a cough need to isolate and get PCR - so are they going against their own and/or government guidance?!?

@ArialAnna
That seems like a very good approach your childs school have in place.

@MrsHerculePoirot
But this is a point I was trying to make earlier in the thread. Schools as you can see are doing things differently. So you can see why a parent may be annoyed and confused when they have two children at two different schools and the guidance is different!

"I have never posted on the COVID board before now but a quick look through shows me alot of the your 'making stupid assumption, your talking bullshit, oh for fuck sake wind your neck in' and other abusive comments are from the same people on other covid threads who jump down people's throats who disagree with the poster. I also find it intresting a good number of these posters state they are teachers."

Aha! So are we finally getting to the actual point of your thread?

@MrsHerculePoirot

**the actual guidance says “ a new, continuous cough – this means coughing a lot for more than an hour, or 3 or more coughing episodes in 24 hours (if you usually have a cough, it may be worse than usual)”.

So at the point your child starts coughing, they get a PCR. You don’t ignore the cough because they have a cold.**

Yes, I have seen that guidance, and my interpretation is that 'a coughing episode' is a serious bout of coughing, not the few isolated coughs here and there you'd expect towards the end of a cold. Whereas you seem to think that any coughing merits a PCR. You are entitled to interpret the guidelines as you wish, but I prefer to apply a bit of perspective and common sense. Especially given that young children get on average 8-10 colds a year, and are more likely to be asymptomatic with covid than adults are. Cold symptoms in children are much more likely to be the result of a cold than covid, and therefore it is not unreasonable to argue that a lateral flow test should suffice.

@Jakie7700 are you going to continue to ignore my questions about what the original point was of this thread? And what the point of bringing up chickenpox and flu were? Or will you just continue to avoid those because it doesn’t suit you?

I honestly very much doubt schools seriously are ignoring coughs and allowing LFTs in that scenario. It would be going against government guidance and negligent as I’ve said but feel free to ignore that. If @ArialAnna DS school are really doing that, then they will be the outlier not doing what they should be and going against I suspect their own set our risk assessment and policies.

So the issue is with schools not following guidance and sending kids for PCR? I thought you didn’t want them to be sent for PCRs? All schools have to publish their covid strategy/risk assessments etc so I’d be really interested to be pointed in the direction of any that say they don’t need PCRs for a cough….

Lateral flow tests are not for people with symptoms so what you're doing is praising schools who go against government and NHS guidelines.

@CallmeHendricks
Which is? You seem to know what I think so please do tell...

I didn't think it needed spelling out but perhaps I was wrong.
You are here to bash teachers and schools.

and therefore it is not unreasonable to argue that a lateral flow test should suffice. except that these are explicitly stated to be used for asymptomatic cases. We know covid can present as cold symptoms. Yes it’s more likely to be cold than covid. So quick PCR, as per guidance, would confirm that. Why wouldn’t you want to make sure you’re not inadvertently spreading covid to others? I honestly find it a very odd attitude to have right now. Reduce the spread and everyone benefits surely?

@MrsHerculePoirot
What would be the point as everything I post if you and some others don't agree you state you very much doubt it's true or others just call out bullshit.

So why ask the question if you already know you are going to not believe me?
Another poster has clearly stated their child's school are giving difference guidance on a cough which I have already said happens. If your school doesn't do that it does not mean either of us are lying.

Surely it just shows my earlier point at the frustration and confusion of some parents where teachers or head teachers are treating coughing a few times in class very different to others! It is not about which school is wrong the point is it is happening whether you want beleive it or not.

@ArialAnna

The symptom which requires a PCR is 'a new continuous cough'.

Most common colds do not have this symptom. The typical order of symptoms for a common cold are: sore throat / raised glands, followed quickly by snottiness and sneezing (which starts clear and get greener and thicker as the cold progresses) then the cough starts (often triggered by nasal drip of the mucus down the throat).

So no, my son's school doesn't worry about a bit of coughing when the kid is already a bit snotty (provided they have had a lateral flow). If a kid started continously coughing out of nowhere (actually not very common) then you'd need to get a PCR. It's applying some common sense.

Some kids might get symptoms in that order after a new cold. Some don’t. Either way the cough is new. So you get a pcr. Doesn’t matter if that’s typical for your child to get a cough after a cold. If it’s a new cough it needs testing. Seriously doubt your school would take such a huge risk and allow parents to test with lateral flows when there is a new cough present which is not a old cough for the child (some kids have coughs due to asthma allergies etc so that’s not a new cough)

@CallmeHendricks
Not at all. I did say I read the Covid boards AFTER I posted and was surprised to see alot of teachers or who state they are teachers jumping down people's throats as I have a different opinion to yours. That is not teacher bashing what ever way you want to dress it up.

It is not about which school is wrong

It isn't? But your OP said it seems so ridiculous that kids are still losing out on school because they are being sent home as they have a minor cold with minor cough

It seemed fairly clear from your OP that you thought the school was wrong to send home children who have covid symptoms.

So now you're saying that they're not wrong to send children home who have covid symptoms and it's not about that at all?

@Jakie7700 I was just asking why you bought up chickenpox and flu if you weren’t comparing them to covid. Because you kept telling me off when I then subsequently referred to them. I am just trying to understand in what context you bought them up if it wasn’t to compare to covid?

From my local PHE - isolate and text for any symptom:

“ With emerging evidence of the transmission of non-UK variants of Covid-19 in Wolverhampton, the city's schools are being asked to implement additional, temporary, measures to help stop the spread of the virus.
It is now recommended that any pupil or staff member who is either off sick or becomes unwell and therefore has to go home limits their contact with others and gets a Covid-19 PCR test – whether or not they have one of the typical symptoms of coronavirus, such as a fever, a new, continuous cough, or a change to their taste or smell.

If the test is negative, the individual can return to school once they feel well again.

If, however, the result is positive, the individual and their household must self isolate for 10 days from the onset of symptoms, or until the individual in question is fever free for at least 48 hours, whichever is later. Other household contacts can stop self isolating after 10 days, as long as they are well themselves.”