will covid ever go away

[essexgirl58]

As of today the covid figures have topped 50,000.

I blame the Government for relaxing the wearing of masks. Even on public transport where the wearing of masks is compulsory, many people are not adhering to this and nobody takes any notice.

Venues have been opened such as cinemas and gyms and people do not have to wear a mask.

Even places of worship are relaxed and they say oh you do not have to wear a mask. There is also no limit on the numbers at funerals.

Roll on the winter

I do wear a mask, and wash it each time (thought that was normal)

But that study linked is inconclusive and also says

‘However, incorrectly worn masks may increase the likelihood of the wound getting contaminated with germs‘

But they don’t go in to what incorrectly means exactly

The psychology behind all this will be fascinating to look back at. People can’t accept that ‘doing nothing’ is now the strategy. That allowing cases to peak and fall naturally (the real exit wave) is pretty much our only plan now. (Well that plus vaccinations)

So many demands for masks to be brought back. As that will ‘solve’ the problem. Do we want to prolong this any more? Do we want to keep creating artificial waves?

I don’t think 90% of the population (especially children) wear masks properly anyway. And I don’t think children need to stunt any more of their educational and social development.

Also in pp saying there’s nothing there is quite a high proportion of people in London wearing them on PT

Admittedly I’ve only been out in last two days since briefing but I’d say about 70%

X post with Delatron who I agree with pretty much these days

Nope
You can be the most careful person or least careful person in the world and the end result will be the same

The Tube is germ soup at the best of times.

I'd like to see masks kept on public transport, where you can be cooped up with heaven knows who for heaven knows how long, with pretty crappy ventilation

@Delatron I totally agree with you. I'm fed up of hearing people say " this is because no one is wearing masks " . Sadly they really believe that.

@Dontforgetyourbrolly I half wanted them to bring masks back as cases would still rise and then at least we could stop going on and on about masks!

I felt the same about the tube @SquirmOfEels but they ran tests and ventilation was good (how I don’t know) I guess crowded tubes aren’t ideal though and understand masks in those situations.

There’s just too much focus on the lack masks as the only reason cases are rising. That if only we were all wearing masks we’d be in the same situation as other counties right now. This simply isn’t true.

Countries not counties!

@Shanghaisprize

I keep seeing this utterly stupid comparison all time

It is not a stupid comparison. Masks in theatres are a form of mitigation. As would be the ones worn in society by those of us with half decent hygiene standards, especially in confined spaces. Therefore masks in some situations at present would equal one form of mitigation for very little inconvenience for people. Still better than none.

I am so sick of hearing the 'face nappy' and 'personal risk assessment' brigade spouting utter bollocks such as the above in order to justify their selfishness.

But you are contradicting yourself. If masks were mandated, then there would be even more people wearing them incorrectly and quite possibly doing themselves harm while doing so. And only a very small proportion of people such as your good self, those with "half decent hygiene standards", would be wearing them as a surgeon would.

Wales and Scotland have illustrated perfectly that a mask mandate doesn't lead to fewer infections.

If you were in change, how would you enforce daily washing of reusables, changing and disposing a disposable every few hours, not touching, not putting them in pockets or bags? How would you make everyone do it properly so there WAS a small benefit?

It is not a stupid comparison. Masks in theatres are a form of mitigation.

Which bit of a completely different environment don't you understand, it is a utterly stupid comparison to compare a shop to a sterile environment.

the point of a mask is to protect other people from you .... and to help slow spread so the NHS can deal with the people who get ill. it's bizarre to me why people think it's a big deal to wear one, living somewhere where basically everyone just does it.

and meanwhile to help protect immunocompromised people who can't get the full protection from being vaccinated.

@nearlyhellokitty

the point of a mask is to protect other people from you .... and to help slow spread so the NHS can deal with the people who get ill. it's bizarre to me why people think it's a big deal to wear one, living somewhere where basically everyone just does it.

and meanwhile to help protect immunocompromised people who can't get the full protection from being vaccinated.

Yes that's the point in theory. No one can disagree with the theory.

However it doesn't work like that in practice does it, and this has been discussed a thousand times. And it should also have become very clear that for many people it is a big deal.

And now people have been so shafted and alienated by this shitshow of a government that they are deeply suspicious of any measure brought in which is "just...simply....can't be hard can it?..." Why do some posters find that so hard to understand?

@Firesidefox herd immunity threshold. Just the % of the population that have to have had the virus before cases reach an equilibrium and stop growing. It's probably around 80-90% with delta, we don't know exactly.

"Preventing the NHS being overwhelmed" is a reasonable goal, and the one real argument for any remaining mitigation. But by any measure, we are some considerable way off the peaks we have already dealt with successfully, and we will not approach them again, given the % of the population who have been vaccinated or already exposed.

We can't actually prevent infections altogether at this point. That's what "going endemic" means. We can only spread them out through time.

So take your pick. More restrictions = less cases in a given unit of time, but for longer. Same number of cases. That was the whole point of "flatten the curve" - it's the same area under the curve!

That was the whole point of "flatten the curve" - it's the same area under the curve!

This was the phrase on everyone's lips in March 2020 wasn't it? Then it became more a case of "Aaaargh we must eliminate all infection ever".

@Toddlerteaplease

Surely it will gradually become less severe and die out in time. Especially as more people catch it or are vaccinated and become immune.

Has the flu or common cold died out?

@HesterShaw1
but why is it apparently such a big deal ? for some, perhaps a sensory issue but mostly it seems to be an ideological issue.

Also re. what @Dissimilitude said - agree it's the same number, but .. spread out you can deal with them... maintain other services in the NHS etc! all at once, a lot more people die because they can't get teh same standard of care...

just thinking about what you said @HesterShaw1 i agree that the UK govt comms have been catastrophic. but not sure where that takes us....I don't think also that others agree with the theory i set out, partly also because of all the terrible comms! So if we could at least agree that's the ideal then we'd be one step further...

Thank you @Dissimilitude

but why is it apparently such a big deal ? for some, perhaps a sensory issue but mostly it seems to be an ideological issue.

Well one reason for me why I don't like wearing masks is because I don't like breathing in plastic fibres. That's a decent enough reason. I don't go near strangers in shops. I have been double jabbed and I had covid in August. I'm awash with antibodies at the moment. I won't be passing it to anyone, even if I get close enough.

People can call me selfish if they like, or they can have a think and agree it's extremely unlikely that my health is a risk to others' health. And I don't think the onus is on me* to set an example, normalise mask wearing, wear a visible reminder that the virus is still here or any of the other reasons which are being given for why everyone should wear a mask.

*speaking purely for myself

Quite. People don't seem to have grasped the implications of this thing becoming endemic.

@nearlyhellokitty yes, we need to watch health service strain. But it is pretty obvious that there is some motivated reasoning going on (on all sides), depending on individual risk tolerance, political views etc.

It is perfectly acceptable to fall on a number of places on the "freedom vs NHS protection" spectrum. There is a legitimate trade off to be made here. Mask wearing is low cost, but it isn't no cost - and no one has really been able to provide the smoking gun proof of efficacy, which suggests to me that it's both difficult to prove and probably quite marginal an effect.

I should qualify - I meant to say we don't really have an idea of how effective masks are, though the preponderance of evidence suggests they are beneficial.

I think what is more up for debate is their utility at this stage of the game, however.

Covid is not going to go away. Why do people still seem to think it could? It will no more be going anywhere than the common cold or flu will.

I think that the vaccines will have to be tweaked annually in time for the winter booster season in order to incorporate the worst of any new variants, much like the flu vaccines already are.

Covid won't go away, viruses don't really do that. Flu doesn't go away...When people say "go away", they mean not impede on their lives.

This is why I'm of the opinion that you can justify Plan B to a point. The majority of people are ok with wearing a mask on a train, the majority of people who CAN work from home, are likely ok to do so for a bit.

But don't start cancelling gigs, putting travel restrictions in, forcing people to only drink in a pub garden in winter etc. THAT is the point where Covid isn't going away because all you're doing is ruining people's lives to get numbers down.

We need to get away from the concept that if you catch covid you've done something wron or not followed rules or someone else has not followed rules or done something wrong that's made you ill. Its a virus doing what a virus does , you can take measures to try and reduce the possibility of catching or transmitting a virus but you can not stop it in its entirety unless you wear a hazmat suit 24/7 the sooner people realise that the better. You can be as careful as you like but it can still "get you ".