No vaccines for healthy 12-15 Yr olds

[Wellbythebloodyhell]

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vaccines-will-not-be-recommended-for-healthy-children-aged-12-to-15-government-advisers-say-12398444

Is anyone else glad this potential decision has been taken away? I was very much undecided about vaccinating my older dc and now feel a bit of a weight has been lifted now its not something I need to consider.

Behold, the ‘everyone I know agrees with me’ tactic.

Well, aren't you lucky stepup? Easy to opine about vaccines from that vantage point. None had vaccinated at your drinks party? Vaccinated whom??

Anyway off to play cricket, and laughable that you should tie me in as an anti vaxxer given I have had two shots, and I am likely to have a third soon
So is it just vaccines for children you disagree with then, @stepupandbecounted ? As yesterday you said

“Blanket vaccines for children are largely pointless and could be (very) damaging if your child is one of the unlucky ones.”

which gives the impression that you’re against, well, blanket vaccines for children. Like measles, mumps, rubella, HPV, influenza.

Ducking in with the regular reminder that vaccination significantly reduces both infection and transmission, which has also been shown in this age group.

It still won't stop disruption to school because positive cases will still be sent home/have to isolate and judging by what is happening in Israel, I am not sure that either transmission or infection is being greatly reduced. Looks the exact opposite to me.

None had vaccinated children, even though many have 16-17 year olds in our group. None except one were planning to vaccinate younger children. That is my sample of 20-25 parents and it was good to talk about it, very different to the debates about vaccines for adults. There is a different approach with children - a personal choice angle that is heartening to see. A broader discussion about it. We all, as adults, had vaccines as soon as we could, because for us the risks of covid are much higher and I am happy we did. The benefits for kids are just not there currently versus the risks. And that is okay as well.

Have a good day in the sun everyone! Sun cream at the ready

Anyway off to play cricket, and laughable that you should tie me in as an anti vaxxer given I have had two shots, and I am likely to have a third soon smile

Your not an anti-vaxxer but will happily spread misinformation from their playbook? Call yourself whatever you want but spread their message and you do the same harm they do.

@soredust

Ducking in with the regular reminder that vaccination significantly reduces both infection and transmission, which has also been shown in this age group.

It still won't stop disruption to school because positive cases will still be sent home/have to isolate and judging by what is happening in Israel, I am not sure that either transmission or infection is being greatly reduced. Looks the exact opposite to me.

Less chance of being a positive case = less disruption to both yourself and others.

You genuinely think that vaccines are increasing infection and transmission @soredust?

maybe you associate with like minded types? many of us do

Also, maybe you don't know anyone with an immunocompromised child?

Oh and just to say I 100% support all vaccines for children that have been thoroughly tested (measles, mumps etc) I was just referring to blanket vaccines for covid for children, that are pointless, mainly because it does not stop the spread, they can catch covid anyway, and they are extremely unlikely to be poorly in any event. So a wasted effort, as JCVI confirmed.

Nope I don't know an immunocompromised child, but if I did I would assume they would choose to have a vaccine if they wanted one. If they feel the extra layer of protection is worth the risk, that would be a good call for them.
There is no need for my child to be vaccinated though, as vaccines do NOT stop the spread anyway, so it is no benefit to either child to vaccinate healthy children.

extremely unlikely to be poorly in any event

not if they are immunocompromised, as the JCVI has also noted

the balance if risk benefit is if anything in favour of vaccination

giving parents a choice would mean that they can factor in things like family history of relevant disease (which it is a bit difficult to legislate for), though we are pretty well covered under the current guidelines anyhow

@stepupandbecounted

Oh and just to say I 100% support all vaccines for children that have been thoroughly tested (measles, mumps etc) I was just referring to blanket vaccines for covid for children, that are pointless, mainly because it does not stop the spread, they can catch covid anyway, and they are extremely unlikely to be poorly in any event. So a wasted effort, as JCVI confirmed.

Again, vaccines reduce both the chance of infection and transmission.

JCVI haven't said it's a "wasted effort" they've said that specifically the medical benefit/risk profile is so finely balanced for the individual they do not recommend it on medical reasons alone. They also stated that there are other factors (i.e., the impact of disrupted schooling etc) which will be relevant to consider before a final decision is made.

You say you're not anti-vaccine but seem pretty intent on spreading misinformation.

vaccines don't stop spread but they do reduce infection a bit, so there are fewer infected people to do the spreading

[(hubby is taking kids out instead into the sunshine hence still posting, have to wait in for supermarket delivery )

I think you will probably find back in the world of actual real life, people are far more worried about vaccinating children than you pretend to be on this thread. It was an active conversation at the drinks party I went to last night, where precisely no one had vaccinated yet. All saying they would prefer to wait

I agree I was sin pub other week and people who were vaccinated wanted to wait with Thier kids.

They don't say extremely unlikely to be poorly. For whatever reason they only gave data for likelihood of being in ICU.

That is my sample of 20-25 parents

Much science. Very statistical.

You can’t go claiming to not be an antivaxxer now, step. Not after going on a mad rant about sheep and big pharma. There’s no coming back from that.

Once someone mentions 🐑, it's quite clear what they really are.

You genuinely think that vaccines are increasing infection and transmission @soredust?

No idea, but it doesn't really sell the vaccines as working very well does it if you can still get covid and still transmit it.

Genuine question:

Given we only have a few months of data, why on earth ARE you so relaxed about vaccinating your children with an untested vaccine?

(Assuming your children are healthy)

That was a quick cricket match.

@stepupandbecounted If that’s genuinely your concern, which is fair enough, why don’t you actually find out how the vaccine was made, and why it’s not actually “untested”? I mean that genuinely and kindly. Not a Facebook post or a YouTube video, but the actual science behind it.

I admit I’m quite lucky in this respect as I have friends who work in medical science who have explained the whole procedure to me as if I were a small child (I am very much not a boffin!)

Those people are also very willing to give their child the vaccine as they understand the process behind it and all the research that’s done into the safety aspects.

I appreciate that not everyone has access to clear and simple explanations though, which can exacerbate the fear/worry.

For eg
Vaccines usually take a long time (years) to manufacture. This is not due to the need to test them for that number of years. It’s largely due to the red tape and funding that goes along with producing a vaccine. So first you have to wait for funding. Then get to the next step, and wait for more funding. Pass some red tape, move to next step, wait for funding and rinse and repeat for a few years.

The covid vaccine was needed quickly, was funded quickly, so was able to complete the process faster.

Pfizer has more here:
www.pfizer.com/news/hot-topics/how_pfizer_and_biontech_are_moving_with_safety_and_speed_to_develop_a_potential_covid_19_vaccine

@stepupandbecounted can you tell me if you actually bother to read these links? Becomes you’re asking a question, I’m answering you in good faith but please do let me know if you’re wasting my time.

The jvci have recommended that age group don't need to be vaccinated and we are supposed to trust them. So now the government is making the choice. Think I will stick with the jvci recommendations.

Sal

The jvci have recommended that age group don't need to be vaccinated

No they haven’t.

@soredust

You genuinely think that vaccines are increasing infection and transmission @soredust?

No idea, but it doesn't really sell the vaccines as working very well does it if you can still get covid and still transmit it.

you can still get and transmit flu after having a flu vaccine

flu vaccines tend to be less protective than covid ones

we still use flu vaccines (and give them in schools)