I've had the vaccine but now I'm scared

[Laney39]

I have had 2 shots of pfizer vaccine. I was scared to get it but eventually did. Now I'm terrified I should have taken my chances with covid. I've read that people will eventually die from these vaccines because it's new technology that hasn't been tested in the long term. How do the spike proteins stop producing? What will happen in 5 or 10 years time or does it just wear off?
People are saying it's all just a big money making thing for pharma companies and that we'll all get sick and need more drugs.
I can't sleep, I can't stop thinking about it. Can anyone help and reassure me?

@everythingthelighttouches

Oh and…

“People are saying it's all just a big money making thing for pharma companies and that we'll all get sick and need more drugs.”

This is spreading misinformation, wouldn’t you agree hamstersarse ?

Yes I would.

But shutting down conversations is never the answer.

Look how angry people are getting at me about mentioning ADE? This should be categorically stated as a risk or not a risk, not just this whitewash of "tin hat anti-vaxx'

At what point did we ditch any form of skepticism in favour of group think and all out compliance?

@speckledostrichegg

I personally don't feel like the atmosphere of censorship and shutting down of questions gives anyone informed consent and it is a big big problem.

@hamstersarse

You're not asking questions, you're stating things (which you've done quite a bit of) without consideration the wealth of evidence from reputable sources that says the opposite

Provide the evidence? I do keep saying can you show me where it is proven that ADE is not a risk.

Yet no-one has done that?

I'm not in UK. Can someone tell me if it's mandatory to have the vaccine if you work for the NHS in a patient centred role?

Sorry to interrupt the thread.

@Walkacrossthesand

Heres what I'd like to say to the purveyors of all the conspiracy/antivax people...

I find that staggeringly naive tbh

I am classed as a scientist in what I do. FFS I work with Professors who are considered the TOP of their field, globally. I can categorically state that I would not trust everything they say. Science has become like a new religion, giving us some illusion of order in the chaos. We like to forget that scientists get things wrong quite a lot in our new religion.

Look how angry people are getting at me about mentioning ADE? This should be categorically stated as a risk or not a risk,

I'm not seeing anyone angry, it's just this conversation has happened in multiple iterations across many threads. You've had a huge number of well qualified posters explain why it's not considered a risk.

No reputable scientist will "categorically state something isn't a risk", that isn't how medicine works.

I can repost everything that was said last time but it's just not particularly rewarding when the same points are recycled in a couple of days.

@speckledostrichegg

I don't get why if it is so obvious you won't post the studies that categorically state that ADE is not a risk from the vaccines?

“I personally don't feel like the atmosphere of censorship and shutting down of questions gives anyone informed consent and it is a big big problem.”

I personally don’t feel that valid scientific discussion about ADE or the practicalities of how clinical trials are run should be used to give a false equivalence or credibility to anti vax bollocks. It confuses most people, obfuscates informed consent and is a big, big problem.

I am classed as a scientist in what I do. FFS I work with Professors who are considered the TOP of their field, globally. I can categorically state that I would not trust everything they say. Science has become like a new religion, giving us some illusion of order in the chaos. We like to forget that scientists get things wrong quite a lot in our new religion.

You're a scientist @hamstersarse? Or you are someone who works with professors?

I wouldn't say anyone credible refers to science as a religion, or states things definitively without appropriate caveats.

www.journalofinfection.com/article/S0163-4453(21)00392-3/fulltext

New enough?

Not reputable enough?

Which part of the religious code does this one breach?

@speckledostrichegg

Yes I am an actual scientist.

You say in one breath that scientists won't categorically state something is true yet in another breath say You Must Believe All Scientists

Got a religious tone to it hasn't it!

@hamstersarse

www.journalofinfection.com/article/S0163-4453(21)00392-3/fulltext

New enough?

Not reputable enough?

Which part of the religious code does this one breach?

Have you actually read the paper that you just linked?

[quote hamstersarse]@speckledostrichegg

Yes I am an actual scientist.

You say in one breath that scientists won't categorically state something is true yet in another breath say You Must Believe All Scientists

Got a religious tone to it hasn't it![/quote]
Please point to any of my posts where I've said eithers of those point

Which bit would you like me to read again? @speckledostrichegg

"to the best of our knowledge ADE of Delta variants has not been specifically assessed. Since our data indicate that Delta variants are especially well recognized by infection enhancing antibodies targeting the NTD, the possibility of ADE should be further investigated as it may represent a potential risk for mass vaccination during the current Delta variant pandemic."

Not assessed?

Should be investigated further?

Potential risk for mass vaccination?

Whose running the "I've had my vaccine & now I'm scared" bingo card this week?

We've already got "big pharma" and "cant sleep" and "will die from vaccines" in the first post

OP, step away from the nuts. For all the nonsense that there is with covid and lockdowns and vaccine passports blah blah blah, the actual vaccine is not going to turn anyone into zombies.

@hamstersarse

Which bit would you like me to read again? *@speckledostrichegg*

"to the best of our knowledge ADE of Delta variants has not been specifically assessed. Since our data indicate that Delta variants are especially well recognized by infection enhancing antibodies targeting the NTD, the possibility of ADE should be further investigated as it may represent a potential risk for mass vaccination during the current Delta variant pandemic."

Not assessed?

Should be investigated further?

Potential risk for mass vaccination?

The entire paper - it's littered with red flags and the entire manuscript is only ~700 words.

It is another hypothetical piece on whether ADE could occur. There is no epidemiological analysis in there.

It also would be funny (if it wasn't regarding a public health issue that has the potential to coerce people into not getting vaccinated) that you deliberately cropped the key sentence out of the concluding paragraph

However, although the results obtained so far have been rather reassuring1, to the best of our knowledge ADE of Delta variants has not been specifically assessed.

And the authors clearly added a question mark to the end of their title which you're trying to pass off as a concluding statement

Infection-enhancing anti-SARS-CoV-2 antibodies recognize both the original Wuhan/D614G strain and Delta variants. A potential risk for mass vaccination?

Please, please, please this is beyond boring now. If those who think it is all a conspiracy would like to be on ICU with my son who is a doctor and be the one to telephone relatives of 25/26/27 year olds and pregnant ladies who have not been vaccinated, to tell them their loved ones are not going to make it and they literally have an hour to come and say goodbye, these ridiculous stories might finally end. May be I credit the British public with too much intelligence but when the young and pregnant are dying surely this must register somewhere in their brain. Please I urge anybody who hasn’t had a vaccine to get it. Is it fair to lay that at doctors doors and their mental health because somebody on Facebook thinks it is a conspiracy. Your problem is not the jab it is that you allow yourself to be led by Facebook and fail to do your own research.

I wish I had been in the right head space to read and listen to this stuff a few months ago - I was just caught up in the panic and the uncertainty of something new that I couldn't reason with myself

I'm sorry your son is having to work under these circumstances, it must be very stressful.

Today, I feel like I will make it on Wednesday

@speckledostrichegg

So the Nature article is too old, the Journal of Infection control article is too short. I get it -there definitely is a specific type of science that is acceptable in your Fortress of Certainty / religion

The topic of vaccinations really does bring out the worst in 'splitting' (in the psychological sense here )- you are obviously ''for' vaccines in their entirety and can only talk of them being Absolutely Safe, one should never raise a concern at all such as this may break down the Fortress of Certainty.

I find it pretty disingenuous that you are doing the exact same thing that you accuse anti-vaxxers of. You are cherry picking information and offering absolute certainty that the vaccines are completely safe, when you know nothing of the sort.

pfizerfizzer talked about personal responsibility and it's an important point.

hamstersarse, you've flung this sentence:
"I believe we have around 1500 confirmed deaths from these vaccines in the UK" out on a public forum, on a thread read by people who are nervous about getting the vaccination. You've put the weak qualifier "I believe" at the start of the sentence as if that just absolves you of any responsibility for stoking up fear without presenting any evidence to support this figure. I notice you have also used the word "confirmed" - presumably to make it sound a bit more official and add some gravitas to your baseless statement.

[quote hamstersarse]@speckledostrichegg

So the Nature article is too old, the Journal of Infection control article is too short. I get it -there definitely is a specific type of science that is acceptable in your Fortress of Certainty / religion

The topic of vaccinations really does bring out the worst in 'splitting' (in the psychological sense here )- you are obviously ''for' vaccines in their entirety and can only talk of them being Absolutely Safe, one should never raise a concern at all such as this may break down the Fortress of Certainty.

I find it pretty disingenuous that you are doing the exact same thing that you accuse anti-vaxxers of. You are cherry picking information and offering absolute certainty that the vaccines are completely safe, when you know nothing of the sort.[/quote]
I don't think you understand how to assess scientific evidence.

As I have pointed out - the article is another hypothetical piece not experimental or epidemiological evidence. It's simply musings on how ADE could possible occur, not that there is any evidence it has or will happen. The length of the article is relevant because at 700 words, it is clearly just a thought piece rather than robust evidence.

I have no idea where you're pulling these statements from but I have never cherry picked information nor "offered absolute certainty that the vaccines are completely safe".

All I have pointed out is that the vast majority of experts are confident that ADE does not pose a risk, hence why we have rolled out vaccination to the general population.

@powershowerforanhour

The 'believe' word was used because there is no real data on this.

The 1,517 death figure comes from the Yellow card reporting but of course, we aren't really monitoring this. We aren't investigating these deaths thoroughly and so there is no official figure. Unless you can find one?

As far as I know, no one really knows.

I agree that my use of the 'confirmed' is misleading. Of course they are actual confirmed deaths, but the exact reason for their deaths is not reported.

It's simply musings on how ADE could possible occur, not that there is any evidence it has or will happen

Musings? Hmmm I'd say ADE is a real thing and has been the reason multiple vaccines have been pulled before. I am glad there are at least some scientists 'musing'

And there is no evidence it isn't happening right now - unless you have some? I would suggest that rigorous scientific procedure would be to be very sure that it isn't happening before you go about mass vaccination programmes.

@hamstersarse

It's simply musings on how ADE could possible occur, not that there is any evidence it has or will happen

Musings? Hmmm I'd say ADE is a real thing and has been the reason multiple vaccines have been pulled before. I am glad there are at least some scientists 'musing'

And there is no evidence it isn't happening right now - unless you have some? I would suggest that rigorous scientific procedure would be to be very sure that it isn't happening before you go about mass vaccination programmes.

Sigh.

No one is debating the ADE is something that can occur. The article you have linked provides no evidence that it is something that will happen with the coroanvirus vaccines. It is not an epidemiological or experimental study.

As I said, manyyy times, there is worldwide data to show that vaccination reduces severity of illness, not that it enhances it. Vaccinated people have better, not worse, outcomes than unvaccinated.

@pfizerfizzer then please stop reading threads of side effects as its not helping. People won't bother saying if they were fine mostly. The worst side effects I'm aware of from a sample of about 40 friends, family and colleagues are two (one AZ, one Pfizer) who both felt a bit flu-y for maybe 36hrs after both doses.

After my first dose (Pfizer) my arm felt like I was wearing a tight sleeved tee shirt for a few hours, second dose I felt a bit tireder than I would have expected to on any other Wednesday. I vegged on the sofa reading a book after work rather than going for a walk.